**HOW LONG DO WE HAVE?**

[jh45gun]

GEEZ you guys do not have to convert me I am a Christian was raised a Catholic still am though I do not go as often as I used to. Bottom line is I went online to see if according to scholars we worship the same God and according to them we do as do the Jews. HOWEVER they (THe towel headed muzzies INTERPERT that a whole hell of lot different then we do. Same God according to the scholars,  but they do not believe in Jesus as the Son of God they think he was a prophet and I think the only reason they do that is to try to give Mohammoud more credibility.  I posted what I posted just to show that maybe Bush did the same research and came up with the same info it is on the net for every one to see wether you believe in it or not is up to you and every one else here. You can disagree all you want with me thats cool but I do resent the implyed comments that I am stupid or an Idot or do not care what is going on in this world. I did a search and came up with the INFO and passed it on. Some other Christian faiths do worship differently and believe different things yet still believe in the same God.What is upsetting is the thought that a bloodthirsty race of camel lovers may worship the same God that we all do I think that is what bothers you guys.  Just because I post something does not neccessarily mean I support it. A post as made bashing Bush because he said we worship the same God. I did a search to provide facts that support that. That was the only reason for my post.

 Look at the differences between some Christian faiths.  Now I am just finding some differences not a complete definition of the different faiths. 

Catholics attend a Mass instead of a service and believe in the Holy Trinity and the Virgin Mary. They believe we have a soul and they believe in the Saints and believe that if your faithfull you go to Heaven and if not you go to Hell yet sinners that have not dammed their souls with Mortal Sin can go to a place called Purgatory: Purgatory (Lat., "purgare", to make clean, to purify) in accordance with Catholic teaching is a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God's grace, are, not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.
Babies who were not baptised go to a place called Limbo as according to the church they were not absolved of Orgional Sin which means they cannot access Heaven though this concept have been debated.

 Seventh Day Adventist believe this: Holistic human nature (fundamental beliefs 7, 26) - Humans are an indivisible unity of body, mind and spirit. They do not possess an immortal soul, and death is an unconscious sleep (commonlSome Pentecostal churches, however, hold to Oneness theology, which decries the traditional doctrine of the Trinity. Oneness doctrine holds that God is absolutely and indivisibly one and that Jesus was the one God manifested in the flesh (Timothy 3:16, John 1:1-11, John 10:30), the division of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost as some of God's manifestations rather than persons; furthermore they are seen as titles to Jesus. This type of teaching is largely associated with the pentecostal church, yet is not based solely on the pentecostal experience.

y known as "soul sleep"). (See also: Christian anthropology)
Conditional immortality (fundamental belief 27) - The wicked will not suffer eternal torment in hell, but instead will be permanently destroyed. (See: Conditional immortality, Annihilationism)

Baptist have more then one branch and they do have differnences from branch to branch. Some do and some do not consider themselves Protestants as they feel their church predated the Catholic Church and that they were not a group that split from the Catholic Church which was the Protestent Movement.

Pentecostal: Believe in the speaking of tongues and some Pentecostal churches, however, hold to Oneness theology, which decries the traditional doctrine of the Trinity. Oneness doctrine holds that God is absolutely and indivisibly one and that Jesus was the one God manifested in the flesh (Timothy 3:16, John 1:1-11, John 10:30), the division of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost as some of God's manifestations rather than persons; furthermore they are seen as titles to Jesus. This type of teaching is largely associated with the pentecostal church, yet is not based solely on the pentecostal experience.

Morman's have their book of Morman which is like their bible or a second affirment of the bible what makes this different is that they believe that God gave this directly to Joseph Smith in 1827. Christ Himself, who, after His Resurrection, appeared to the people of ancient America and invited them to come forward one by one to see and touch Him until “they had all gone forth and had witnessed for themselves” ( 3 Nephi 11:13–17).
In the Bible, Jesus told His Apostles?, “Other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd” ( John 10:16).  Soon after He was resurrected, the Lord visited these “other sheep”—the inhabitants of ancient America.  During this visit to the American continent (recorded in the Book of Mormon), Jesus Christ:

First Church of Christ, Scientist, is widely known for its publications, especially the Christian Science Monitor, a daily newspaper published internationally in print and on the Internet. Some consider the Church to be controversial due to its emphasis on healing through prayer when others would likely choose modern medicine. There have also been periodic tensions with other Christian denominations who reject the idea that Christian Science is a Christian denomination because of what some consider to be unorthodox tenets. (An example of these tenets is: "We acknowledge Jesus' atonement as the evidence of divine, efficacious Love, unfolding man's unity with God through Christ Jesus the Way-shower; and we acknowledge that man is saved through Christ, through Truth, Life, and Love as demonstrated by the Galilean Prophet in healing the sick and overcoming sin and death."[2] (Science and Health with Key to the Scriptures p. 497) To shorten things up lots of other protestant churches have differnces but are close to each other in ways too and have either split from the Catholic Church or the Church of England.
Buddism may consider this not a religion but teachings to guide a person to reality. Others may consider it a religion
Hinduism
When God is viewed as the supreme personal being (rather than as the infinite principle) God is called Ishvara ("The Lord"[20]), Bhagavan ("The Auspicious One"[20]), or Parameshwara ("The Supreme Lord"[20]).[15] However, interpretations of Ishvara vary—ranging from non-belief such as followers of Mimamsakas, in Ishvara to identifying Brahman and Ishvara as one as in Advaita

Of course there are lots of other common religions that are split from churches like the Catholic Curch and the Anglican Church that are called Protestant as they protested from these other religions most are common in the same beliefs so I am not going to list any more of them. What I did was th show that these religions are very different in many aspects yet worship the same God so if the Religious Scholars say that Christians and Jews and Muslums worship the same God there could be merit to the premise even though as Christians we find that repugnant because of the muslums savagery and ways of their religion that is the direct opposite of Christianity as was stated before by Ironglow.

[jh45gun]

Bush is an idiot!

I could say that about every Liberal Demoncrat in Office which is hell of a lot more of them than one man.

[deltecs]

Ok I'm in...

I have done a lot of research on this topic over the last few years. All indications point to 12-21-2012 to be the beginning of the end. Over a period of 6 days beginning on 12-20-2012 the earth and all other planets will line up in a straight line out from the sun which based on scientific tests will cause the earth to stop and change its axis.

Odd how this is the exact date the Mayan calendar predicts.  I watched a History Channel documentary on the Mayan calendar and its relationship in its culture and theology.  Looks like I won't live long enough for my retirement benefits to outweigh my donations.  And people now say SS is insolvent.  Go figure.

[Dee]

Bush is an idiot!

I could say that about every Liberal Demoncrat in Office which is hell of a lot more of them than one man.

What you actually need to do is EDUCATE YOURSELF, as to what YOUR PRESIDENT has signed on to, in regards to YOUR LIBERTY, rather than MAKE EXCUSES for him. A good start would be glenbeck.com and look on the topic our liberty in peril. You are touchy about a man you seem to know almost NOTHING about, and now, you are DEFENDING a pagan god called ALLAH, and saying his is the same God YOU worship, or used to worship. It is so OBIVIOUS TO ALL, but you, that you do not know what you are a talking about, regarding these two. Being a Christian REQUIRES you know PRECISELY WHOM YOU ARE WORSHIPPING, and YOUR LOOKING IT UP ON THE INTERNET? You continue to NOT surprise.

[jh45gun]

STICK IT WHERE THE SUN DON"T SHINE!    You question my religion yet who the hell are you? Just because I support the President does not make me an idiot. You profess you voted for him twice so what does that make you?  You talk of me knowing little about the President well you know jack  about me so do not try to surmise over a few post here at Greybeards you can have me figured out or what my beliefs are. I can go on line and all day fine references to Allah in the Bible and remarks of Scholars that say what I have posted. So they are all wrong just because little old dee does not agree I do not think so. Another Example:

This article originally appeared in the
The BibleTranslator:Technical Papers,
Vol. 52:3 (July 2001), 301-305.
Reprinted by permission.
Kenneth J. Thomas is a UBS
(United Bible Societies) Translation
Consultant based in New York.
The question is asked by certain groups whether Allah can validly
be used to translate words for God in the Bible. It is inconceivable
to many that a word that is commonly associated with the Islamic
religion would be found in a Christian Bible. There are some English speakers,
for example, who say that the words Allah and God refer to different
deities and therefore that Allah should never be used in any translation of the
Bible. One person who has written a book arguing against the use of Allah by
Christians is a Nigerian, G. J. O. Moshay. In his book, Who Is This Allah?, he
writes, “For long we had assumed that Christians and Muslims serve the same
God, and that it is only in the language of expression and mode of worship
that they differ.”1 But he concludes that they are not the same. Significantly,
this objection does not come from traditional Arab Christians, most of whom
live in the Islamic heartland.
The basic question is whether the word “Allah” can be considered a generic
term for the supreme being that can be used to translate elohim or theos, which
are themselves generic terms in Hebrew and Greek. The Arab philologists discussed
the etymology of the word at great length. Some held that it was a loan
word from Syriac or Hebrew, but most regarded it as a contraction of al ilāh
(“the god”).2 Western scholars are fairly unanimous that the source of the word
Allah probably is through Aramaic from the Syriac alāhā (“the god”).3 In either
case, the Arabs used the word Allah for the supreme being before the time of
Muhammad.4 Inscriptions with Allah have been discovered in Northern and
Southern Arabia from as early as the fifth century b.c.5 Christians have used
the word Allah from pre-Islamic times, and Allah has been used continuously
in Arabic translations of the Bible from the earliest known versions in the
eighth century to this day. One Arabic translation of the New Testament using
the word may even be pre-Islamic.6
Jews, Christians, and Muslims have used Allah in their citations and translations
of the Bible since the first centuries of Islam. Jewish commentators writing
in Arabic used Allah in their translations and citations. Sa´adiah Ga`on b.
Joseph, a 9th-10th century a.d. Rabbanite translator of the Hebrew into Arabic
(using Hebrew characters), used Allah for elohim. For example, for Genesis 1:4

I do not support Muslums nor have I ever. However you and others here with your nitpicking the President because of his remarks on we all worship the same God is wrong as I have shown proof to the contrary. Wether you want to believe it or not us your perogative.  I know who God is I used the Internet for examples for my post not because I do not know God. I could give a rats ass if you do not agree with me but your can take your insinuations that I am not smart and stick them!

[billy_56081]

   Aint this a discussion about how lond the world will survive? George Bush whether you like him or not has no power over this. Or has he became as powerful as God?

  Geez get over yourselves, no one here is an expert on what God is. Now anyone with a little common sence surley know what God is not.

[billy_56081]

On second thought the world is going to end because of rude people!

[jh45gun]

On second thought the world is going to end because of rude people!

Billy, If that was the case it would have ended a long time ago. 

[powderman]

OKAY guys. Maybe I can simplify this. Allah is just the name the muzzies use to describe God. They Admit there is but one true God, we believe the same is true, there is one true God. WE see God as he really is, loving, careing, forgiving. They base their vision of God on the teachings of mohamed, not Gods true word. They know nothing of our Bible, or Gods true words, only what mohamed taught them. They, and us, worship one God, but our perception og God is not the same as theirs. They see him as full of hatred and death to all non muslims, because they believe in the rantings of a madman, mohamed.
ALTNMAN. Just what is your religion or belief, if I may ask.
DEE. Your caps are still irritating and distracting. You may wish to rephrase some of your statements to JH45GUN, you are borderline rude, and theres no reason to be. POWDERMAN. 

[DalesCarpentry]

This is about the craziest thing I have ever read. There is no way to predict the end of the world. You would have to be a fool to believe that just because some self proclaimed profet says the world is going to end on any petucalar date is crazy. Dale

[Graybeard]

Tell me that again on New Years Day 2013 IF you and the rest of the world is still here. 

[jh45gun]

Yea Powderman that pretty much covers it thanks.

[jh45gun]

With this whole Bush Debate thing I am not saying he has not made mistakes but heck we all have made mistakes show me one who has not!!! There is not a President or a world leader  who has served that has not had some issues. Bush may not be the best speaker either but I do believe he meant what he said about we all worship the same God as Bush is a religious man. IF he has made mistakes so be it we elected him to office so we have to deal with it. Of course some of you armchair quarterbacks I am sure could do better 

[jh45gun]

Tell me that again on New Years Day 2013 IF you and the rest of the world is still here. 

GB if we are  both still around because nothing else has gotten us by then I would be glad to! 

[SHOOTALL]

This is getting bad , our President is accused of being an idiot by folks that  that quote everything from the Bible to the Internet to back their post but Pres. Bush does not fit the definition of idiot , did their research slip ?
We are asked to believe the Mayan leaders could predict our demise but not their own ( and prevented it ) ? It is almost funny how just about anyone who predicts the end is creditable right up to the day after they are proved wrong !

debating the end is a past time that has been handed down thru. the ages and will continue to be done !
Different men will worship God in different ways and some a different god . It is not important if we die together on some day in 2012 or one at a time we will all die and see the other side . Then and only then will all see the true answer's to the question of religion . Choose your words wisely !

[Dee]

With this whole Bush Debate thing I am not saying he has not made mistakes but heck we all have made mistakes show me one who has not!!! There is not a President or a world leader  who has served that has not had some issues. Bush may not be the best speaker either but I do believe he meant what he said about we all worship the same God as Bush is a religious man. IF he has made mistakes so be it we elected him to office so we have to deal with it. Of course some of you armchair quarterbacks I am sure could do better 

By sticking it where the sun don't shine, I assume you meant the root cellar under the house. jh45gun, I voted for Bush twice, the lessor of two evils was my excuse. Kinda like saying being bit by a cotton mouth is not as bad as being bit by a rattler, but the fact is I DID vote for him twice.

But since 911 things have become DRAMATICALLY CLEARER. Since 911, it has become CLEAR, that our borders NEED TO BE CLOSED. Bush on the other hand thinks they NEED TO BE OPENED. WIDER! He wants Mexican trucks to run all lower 48 states, and only PRESSURE from the people have prevented this. He wants us to basically become MEXIAMERICANADA, and has said so. HE FORCED the PATRIOT ACT THRU CONGRESS, and then has come BACK wanting it to BE PERMANENT. This Patriot Act which he is so proud of has basically GUTED THE CONSTITUTION and BILL OF RIGHTS, yet issues like the BORDER HE IGNORES and REFUSES TO COMPLY WITH A MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION.
Now the ISSUE that you and others have brought up in the past is EVERYONE MAKES MISTAKES. TRUE! But these are OBIVIOUS MISTAKES, that WE SEE AS NONSENSICAL, and "UNNECESSSARILRY" DANGEROUS to our FREEDOM and SAFETY. While he SECURES IRAQ'S BORDERS, HE "IGNORES" HIS OWN PEOPLE'S SAFETY, BY REFUSING TO "SECURE OURS".

As I said in my opening remark, DEFEND THE COTTON MOUTH if you will, in adverse to the RATTLER, but they are both SNAKES.

Now as far as ALLAH being God. ALLAH was the MOON GOD, in Arab religion, and was one of over 300 other gods. Mohammad saw fit to trim the field down to one in an effort to UNITE THE PEOPLE. He (allah) and our Christian GOD are not the same, you see, ALLAH had not son. MY GOD has a Son called CHRIST, and they are not the same.

And by the way. Did some one call you an IDIOT? I certainly didn't. GB told you to stop being an ostrich, but that was all I saw.

How long do we have? Until God Himself get enough of this mess. But I assure you allah won't have a say in it.

[magooch]

I'm reminded here why I have a rule about arguing over religion.

Anyway-- Bill, can I have your guns in about 5 years?

[ironglow]

   Powderman;

    I think you did a very credible job on simplifying the subject of the REAL God vs Muhammad's version. You described him as a madman, and as I see it, you are correct.

   I  just don't understand how anyone can figure a god that preaches hatred, murder, death and self-immolation could be considered a worthwhile god to enslave oneself to.
 
   Nor how anyone can consider a man that would marry a 6 yr old little girl and "consummate" that marriage on her 9th birthday, should be considered as "prophet" material,
 
   ....But then, I am just a simple old blacksmith...

[jh45gun]

I agree with you Ironglow, Powderman did a good job simplifying things. Like I posted the examples all the religions that worship God that believe Jiesus is his son and believe in the trinity ect still have major differences. I guess the main thing is that you do worship God on that we agree.

[powderman]

IRONGLOW. According to my 2 Godless neices his blushing bride was MUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCCHHHH older than that when he honored her by allowing her to pleasure him. Must have been a real good time, for one of them. I won't speak to them til the next funeral. POWDERMAN. 

[Brett]

I got a question for you jh45gun...  If Barack Obama called his cat Allah and got 10,000 liberals from LA to Boston to bow down and worship it three times a day would the cat be God?

[jh45gun]

I got a question for you jh45gun...  If Barack Obama called his cat Allah and got 10,000 liberals from LA to Boston to bow down and worship it three times a day would the cat be God?

Don't be smartassed I used examples that are legit. All you have to do is a search and the whole internet is full of examples of the fact that Christians, and Jews use the word Allah for God. Here is another one.

The word "Allah" is the perfect description of the "One God" of monotheism for Jews, Christians and Muslims!

Is "Allah" only for Islam and Muslims?
[No! It is for All Three Abrahamic Faiths.]

"Allah" is the same word used by Christian Arabs and Jewish Arabs in their Bible, centuries before Islam came.

On page one [1] of Genesis in the Old Testament, we find the word "Allah" seventeen [17] times.

Every hotel and motel has a Bible. Next time you see one look in the introduction, you will find samples of the different languages they have translated. For Arabic they have translated the verse in the New Testament in Arabic from the famous verse in the Gospel John 3:16 -

"For God so loved the world . . . "
- and the word the translators used in Arabic for "God" is the very same word used by Muslims around the planet, "Allah."
Where Does the word "Allah" Come From?

"Allah" comes from the Arabic word "elah"a god' or something worshiped. - (Arabic) means '

This word (elah) can be made plural (gods), as in "aleha" and it can be male or female just as the word in English can be "goddess."

"Allah" comes from "elaha" but it brings more clarification and understanding.

Allah= Has no gender (not male and not female)
 "He" is used only out of respect and dignity - not for gender
Allah = Always singular - Never plural
 "We" is used only as the "Royal WE" just as in English for royalty
Allah =Means "The Only One to be Worshipped"

I call God, God and Jesus, Jesus my whole intent of this was to show that Allah is not strictly a Islam name as it was used before Islam was ever founded. My main intent was to show that Bush's comments had merits not to get into a full blown religion discussion.  To be honest folks may think they have all the answers but the Clergy and Religious Scholars have disagreed in the past about Religious ideals and history. What I did find on my internet search was that a lot of folks consider Allah the word for God by Christians (if nothing else the early ones) Jews and later Islam.

For what it worth I would not call a Cat  God in jest to prove a point seems to me more tacky than anything Bush said!!!

[williamlayton]

This is good!
Hummm, well I say ? the heck are we confused about?
Physical science has a number of laws. One of these laws indicates that at the moment of creation all things begin to disintegrate/die.
There is one small problem with physical science----GOD.
This thing that was created by Him, for Hisownself, by His word of power will go on til He says stop.
No one knows.
Now you can speculate on the stars--has happened before--and maybe you are correct. I will say that the stars are not the answer for God can align every star and planet in the entire universe---and He can--and everything remain the same on this earth.
He will sustain until He has decided it will end and it will end the way He planned it, the same instance He created it.
Then it won't be the way you see it it will be the way He See's it AND then He will recreate it again.
Now the real question is not who, what, when or where, is it?
The real question is you.
Check Him out and ask Him if you need Him, or, you can speculate.
It is easier too deal with the truth than speculation.
IMO
Blessings   

[ironglow]

  JH45gun;

           I agree with you on the vast bulk of your pronouncements...but here my friend, you simply must put away your spade and quit digging:
     you're only getting deeper.
   
    I have spent many years in studying God's word and schooling in most of it's variations, just as many in this forum have . Frankly; no credible Christian scholar,
   Pastor, professor or researcher I ever met, has used "Allah" as a varient name for the TRUE God !
      You will please note that most of us when referring to Allah, or any else but the true God, spell the term g-o-d . Only do the true God , do we refer to as G-o-d.

                The term "Allah" was derived from the Arabic pre-Islam moon-god...and there is no reason why Jews or Christians would ever use a pagan god's name for
      their REAL God.

           Almost as soon as Muhammad devised Islam, it's devotees started upon their bloody trail of conquest ! After that date, For Jews or Christians to have referred
     to the true God as "Allah" would have been tantamount to we Americans calling our president "fuehrer" since WW2 ...not likely in either case !


      ....And the term Allah did not endear itself any more during the Crusades or the European conquest by the Islamic hordes.

    Yes, I checked the Wikipedia explanation; but we must remember that the Wikipedia entries are basically the opinion of the contributor..and in the case of the "origin of Allah",
    the Wiklipedia entry still awaits rebuttal arguments!
      At the moment, the article in Wikipedia looks to have been penned by an Islamic apologist.

    Many of the Muslim plotters would like nothing better than to have poorly informed Christians and Jews believe that we worship the same god ! A plotting enemy has a
    "leg up" on us if he can make us believe his lies .

    Remember how, in the garden, the serpent said, " surely you shall not die" !

    JH45gun my friend, put aside the spade...stop digging, and join the rest of us in giving worship to the true God..Jehovah, Elohim, Eloi, Jesus, the Great Creator, Wonderful,
         Counsellor, Prince of Peace..etc,etc..

    ...But never "Allah"..

        www.biblebelievers.org.au/moongod.htm            www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/skm30804.htm

[ms]

WORMWOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[powderman]

BRETT. The Godless ones would be more likely to eat the cat than worship it. Worshiping the cat would probably get them more of a blessing than their allah. POWDERMAN. 

[jh45gun]

IronGlow just because I posted it does not mean it is my conviction. like I said I call GOD, GOD. For the record I also found reference saying that moon god BS is just that BS spread by folks who cannot stand the idea that Allah was used as a word for God. Hey I do not care I can walk away from this and still call God, God the only reason for the research was to stand up for Bush it is not my convictions about Allah I do not and have never used the word. All I was trying to do is post a connection that Bush was right as a certain few here think Bush is wrong about everything which I disagree.

Almost as soon as Muhammad devised Islam, it's devotees started upon their bloody trail of conquest ! After that date, For Jews or Christians to have referred
     to the true God as "Allah" would have been tantamount to we Americans calling our president "fuehrer" since WW2 ...not likely in either case !

On this you could be very true but also look at it this way while us as Christians may not use that word other Christians still do as their are Christians in this world that are muslum and other races like Indonesian.  So just because we do not use it does not mean others do not.  I am not trying to convert anyone here that it is right or wrong to do so all I was doing was showing cause that the President's comments were not that far off base. Or I could Jokeingly say if so, this is not the first time he was fed bad information. 

[jh45gun]

BRETT. The Godless ones would be more likely to eat the cat than worship it.  POWDERMAN. 

Powderman would them be Chinese Muslums. LOL I hear the Chinese like Cats LOL

[SHOOTALL]

Hey guy's I realize I tic. ya'll off cause I don't quote the verses but could someone tell me what difference it makes who they worship ?
Why do we care ?
They want to kill us !
This ain't the first time either !
Dee a snake is a snake and the best ones are the ones with their head cut off !
They don't want their soul saved , they act like they want their A$$ kicked !

[ironglow]

  Now you blew it guys...TM7 agrees with you !...LOL