Author Topic: WHATS YOUR PICK FOR A BATTLE RIFLE? (Read 19590 times)

teddy12b · « **Reply #180 on:** May 21, 2008, 05:14:47 PM »

My AR10 is a DPMS 308B. It's got an 18" barrel that is very heavy. This rifle would not be a joy to carry will 200 rounds of ammo, but it would instill more than ample confidence with it's power and accuracy. Everything has it's trade offs. I've only put just over 200 rounds through it and 100 of them have been Remington 150gr core lokt ammo. It was the least expensive I could find to break in the barrel where I'd have Rem brass to reload after wards. I've also shot some handload 150gr SST's through it, but that was more to get rid of the SST's and help break in the gun because I plan on doing my real shooting with the 168gr matchking. I did fire some 168gr handloads that made one ragged hole the size of a golf ball at 100 yards. Not bad for a rack rifle with no upgrades. The trigger is starting to smooth out so that's helping me shoot better.

I used to have a bushmaster M4 in 6.8 and with the short barrel on it. Couldn't hit squat past 200 yards with it. I agree that a 223 is better off with a longer barrel, but I've gone through doors in sandy far away places with a standard M16 length barrel and would have given the world for something shorter, even an M9, but that's another topic for another time.

In any event I recommend the DPMS 308's based on the one I have, but opinions are always worth what you pay for them and mines no different.

SharonAnne · « **Reply #181 on:** May 21, 2008, 06:00:18 PM »

Teddy, golf ball size at 100 yds just breaking in. Looks like ya got a good 'un. What are you using for sights? I agree re: confidence inspiring.

re: going through doors with an M16. that IS what the M4 is for, but the PTB are trying to make the M4 into an "EVERYGUN" and there ain't no such aminal.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #182 on:** May 22, 2008, 02:21:31 AM »

SA , Trashing you - no !
pointing out the longer effective range of M-14's over M-16's yes ! had no idea you would make it personal . That is your choice !
There you go assuming again , I admit I don't know about you ( you agreed and pointed out my being true )and you insist on knowing what i trust / read . Hate to bust your bubble but you are wrong !
Sorry i haven't read SN for years and only then to look at prices or locate a gun i wanted . The groups indicated were not bad for an off the rack battle rifle , as i have no idea of the quality of parts or skill of the man who put the rifle together .
It appears you took things personal , You want to compare special built rifles to standard battle rifles go for it as you cause the apples to oranges not me ! You create the double talk not I by cutting and pasting to support your personal attacks on me ! I realize you love and will depend on your AR but do you really believe it has the same power as the M-14 ?
myronman3 did it occur they may have wanted more rounds in the weapon ? You don't feel the M-1 was an improvement over what was in widespread use at the time ? Guess it didn't fit your campaign to attack me ! Tack and intellect now that's wishful thinking !
As far as writing to make your reading easy, Why would I ? I see your post around the site , you are always in opposition/battle with someone has it ever occurred to you that you might be the cause not the rest ?
I don't have anything to admit , so i won't ! You fabricate things and say i will not admit them , you are correct i won't agree with your BS either !
I paid alot of attention in school , learned all the rules which makes breaking all of them so sweet today !

In my opinion the problem here is I just don't have the same inflated opinion of myself ya'll do of your self's !

Old Syko · « **Reply #183 on:** May 22, 2008, 02:33:10 AM »

Quote from: SharonAnne on May 21, 2008, 12:57:31 PM

The M4 is at best a 200 yd weapon.

SharonAnne I've been well in your corner except for this statement. I use a Contender pistol with a barrel shorter than the M4s that I'm confident with beyond such a distance. Maybe a better statement would be "The M4 is at it's best under 200yds." No the M4 is not an "EVERY GUN" but an "ENTRY GUN" and close range weapon. Like all other guns the main range limitation is the shooter even though the gun and/or round may have more far reaching capabilities.

I only bring this up because of getting to speak with my nephew who was recently home for a break between missions and his telling me of some of the amazing marksmen in his squad and some of their exploits. Through modesty they call many of their accomplishments Kentucky windage, luck and a lot of other things when practiced skill is really the underlying factor regardless of the equipment used.

As for the AR10 I couldn't wait to get my hands on one. Yet when I did I discovered more negatives than positives for my wants and needs in a carry gun. Even knowing what I percieve as faults that are there, there is sitll an LRT version of the AR10 in my near future.

teddy12b · « **Reply #184 on:** May 22, 2008, 02:41:39 AM »

SharonAnne,
I forgot to mention the scope. I have a Leupold 4-12 vx-I with the long range reticle (two dots below the duplex). I used to have it on a rifle, then my old AR, and soon it'll go on to Ebay. It's a good scope, but it has the microfriction adjustments and I want something with regular click adjustments. A guy at the range told me about the new millett long range scope coming out that has 140 MOA of internal adjustment. That peaked my interest and so I started researching millett scopes and came across a millett TRS-1 4-16 with illuminated mil-dot. That is the scope that's in the mail and will find it's home on top of my 308. For now the leupold does just fine, on 4x the crosshairs punch holes at 100 yards, the second dot hits around 200 yards and the third dot hits around 300 yards.

I couldn't agree more that an M4 is not a long range rifle. I was in a mechanized unit and we would ride around in armored vehicles M113's and I would have liked an m-4 just getting in and out of that thing, but once you're out in the open a full sized rifle is the ticket. There just isn't a one size fits all for anything. I'm still hoping that the military will find something that's a compromise between an m14 and m16.

myronman3 · « **Reply #185 on:** May 22, 2008, 02:47:24 AM »

again i agree with you syko. i was shooting my m4 last year @300 and doing well. i have no reason to believe that i couldnt take it out further as i used to do with the m16. i think there is more loss from the gas operated action than the barrel length.
sharon does have a point though with the 20 inch barrel, there is an advantage there; how much i dont know.
shootall, you just keep blabbering incoherantly. i cant make heads or tails of what you are trying to say anymore, but it is amusing watching you flounder.

myronman3 · « **Reply #186 on:** May 22, 2008, 02:48:42 AM »

so teddy, are you telling me you were a 11m?

teddy12b · « **Reply #187 on:** May 22, 2008, 03:27:02 AM »

I used to be a 12B, now it's a 21B (combat engineer).

myronman3 · « **Reply #188 on:** May 22, 2008, 05:19:50 AM »

ah shucks. here i thought i had found me another infantry brother. that is alright though, you still have 1000x's the hands on real world experience than certain people around here dont. and you are still in my cool book. lol

teddy12b · « **Reply #189 on:** May 22, 2008, 05:22:58 AM »

lol, rather be in somebodies cool book than on their $&!^ list! Glad to hear I'm in good company, the army is the biggest fraternity in the U.S.

myronman3 · « **Reply #190 on:** May 22, 2008, 05:38:14 AM »

true, but with all the differnet jobs they have, the combat arms people are a different class of people compared to some of the others.

teddy12b · « **Reply #191 on:** May 22, 2008, 05:59:49 AM »

I would completely agree. I don't blaim anyone for joining the military and wanting to learn a trade or skill, but I think the guys who joined up the yell HOOAH and actually go kick some @$$ deserve an extra pat on the back. It all depends on what stories you want to have when you get out. Nobody sings songs about the brave cook in the rear with the women and children.

SharonAnne · « **Reply #192 on:** May 22, 2008, 08:12:35 AM »

OS, I said "at best a 200 yd weapon". I know it can HIT past that, but the bullet has slowed so much it no longer reliably yaws and breaks up after impact. It just drills straight in. It is beyond its quick incapacitation range barring a CNS hit.
Please thank your father for his service and shake his hand for me.

Myron and Teddy, thank you for YOUR service (applause, applause) consider your hands shaken. I was an RN. I thanked every veteran I had as patients, or met for that matter. One WW2 vet cried when I thanked him. He said "no one has ever done that before". How sad.

I do believe this: Shootall is a pathalogical lier. He continually denies things he did say(write). Claims he said or meant something different. The difference is, in speech, he can claim he was misunderstood or misquoted. In here, in print, his own words can be repeated exactly and he does not know how to deal with that. Thus the gobblygook in his threads. I agree, he is getting more incoherent. His 'logic' is all spin. He will not answer a direct question with a direct answer and always brings irrelevant information into his replies. It will be amusing to watch his continued mental decline.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #193 on:** May 22, 2008, 09:38:19 AM »

Oh well not the first time you were wrong !
Good try !

SharonAnne · « **Reply #194 on:** May 22, 2008, 07:32:07 PM »

now, will someone with a brain please contribute! we have heard quite enough from the short bus rider.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #195 on:** May 23, 2008, 01:30:22 AM »

Enjoy the mud it appears you love it !

SharonAnne · « **Reply #196 on:** May 23, 2008, 04:53:05 AM »

anyone?!?

AtlLaw · « **Reply #197 on:** May 23, 2008, 06:35:23 AM »

You 2 sound like you're married... get a room!

I trained with the M1 and M14 and carried the M16 and M16A1 in the RVN, also at different times a M-12, Grease Gun, Thompson, M1D, AK or M1 Carbine. Did I say all this before?

This thread has has run on so long and bounced around so much I forget the original question! $:-\$

Did I say I like the M-16? A1, not that heavy butt, M1/M14 wannabe A2 model!

gstewart44 · « **Reply #198 on:** May 23, 2008, 06:57:51 AM »

WOW - I just read the original post and all follow ups...I did not get the privilege of serving in our Armed Forces but I salute and thank each and every one of you!........The first question I think is really related to geography and what one may encounter - a) If your were going to a war..........and b) if the war was coming to you.

I have lived several states through the years and my surroundings have included Florida swamp, Appalachian mountains, Atlantic coastal beach towns and Louisiana bayou. I have not lived in the wide open spaces of the West. That being said I believe I may choose a different rifle depending on where I was if the war were coming to here....

Could we include in future discussion if geography and/or setting would make a difference (or not) in your choice and why? Rural/urban, mountainsprairiee/desert/swamp.

Thanks again to all the Vets.

SharonAnne · « **Reply #199 on:** May 23, 2008, 08:23:11 AM »

ATLAW "get a room" SA reply (puke)

Richard you DID state your preference for the M16A1. I do not recall you telling us of all the others you used. Quite a menagery. What did you think of the M1D?

44, please do include your thoughts on geography, setting, if it was coming to you or you going to it. That WAS part of the original thread.

I know there are many reading this thread who have good experience to share. Please people speak up. Over 3000 times people have looked in and only less than 200 replies! With all that interest there has to be information/experience/opinion that is worth sharing.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #200 on:** May 23, 2008, 08:35:04 AM »

Maybe they don't want to get muddy !

myronman3 · « **Reply #201 on:** May 23, 2008, 09:28:05 AM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on May 23, 2008, 08:35:04 AM

Maybe they don't want to get muddy !

everytime it starts getting back on track you take a shot. grow up.

i like the ar platform because it is easy to pack, as is the ammo it is easy to get accessories/parts for, it is FAMILAR, accurate, easy to resupply, dependable, and fast handling. it is also easy to repair. as far as stopping powe: i dont care what dope you are on, what fanatical religon you follow, how hungry or crazy you are. a 55 grain fmj through your brain and your goose is cooked. for far out there, there are better weapons. but for medium to close range, it is a mighty fine choice offering firepower, reliabliity, mobility, and fast handling.

AtlLaw · « **Reply #202 on:** May 23, 2008, 09:29:50 AM »

Quote from: SharonAnne on May 23, 2008, 08:23:11 AM

What did you think of the M1D?

The M1, In any of it's variants was and is a great weapon! I could go on ad nauseum about the weapons (and the wimmins

) I've loved but that would be off topic.

Quote

thoughts on geography, setting, if it was coming to you or you going to it. That WAS part of the original thread.

True, and a valid part it is! ... but no matter, I'd still take the A1.

Maybe an M4 but I've never shot one. If the enemy is so far "out there" that the 55 gr. 5.56 is ineffective, I'd use the time it takes them to get closer to establish a defensive perimeter or maneuver for an attack. Jungle, desert or urban, fights usually boil down to pretty close affairs.

Disclaimer: The foregoing opinion is based on the author's experience ONLY and not to be construed as conflicting with or negating any other opinion that may be held by any other forum member based on that individuals perceptions, whether driven by experience, logic, reason or the unfounded biases of any such forum member.

SharonAnne · « **Reply #203 on:** May 23, 2008, 09:40:42 AM »

OMG!!! you really are a lawyer!

SharonAnne · « **Reply #204 on:** May 23, 2008, 07:28:28 PM »

come on. I know there are more out there with good input.

rzwieg · « **Reply #205 on:** May 23, 2008, 10:44:56 PM »

The only input I have are words of encouragement to propel the ongoing entertainment.
Give 'er!

Dixie Dude · « **Reply #206 on:** May 24, 2008, 06:53:52 AM »

I will throw $0.02 more in. IF the Mini-14 had cheap 30 round magazines or if it was designed to take the AR magazines, then I would prefer it over the AR family. I have had both. I like the all stainless steel construction. Very rugged gun. Can take a lot more abuse and still fire. It also needs a more accurate barrel. Now, the newer ones are more accurate from what I hear. On the other hand, if you go to a gun show, the AR family has a tremendous amount of parts and accessories available. My L1A1 is a better hunting rifle for deer and above, but it is heavy for all day hunting.

SharonAnne · « **Reply #207 on:** May 24, 2008, 01:17:36 PM »

DD, I agree, the Mini 14 is a nice rifle. And it IS cool. But it IS inaccrurate. My Minis' 'group' at 100 yd looked like a #4 buck shotgun pattern. Bill Ruger found out what a design genius John Garand was when he designed the M1. Ruger tried to build a MAXI 14 in .308W. He gave up because of accuracy problems. That design is very hard to make accurate. I do hope the new Minis are more accurate. It is a fun gun and I would buy one again.

gstewart44 · « **Reply #208 on:** May 24, 2008, 03:06:39 PM »

I still have my stainless Mini14 and it is extremely rugged. It has taken a bath in Louisianna bayou and Florida swamp on occasion over the past two decades and still goes bang every time. I have fired well over 6000 rounds through it and never had a misfire. But as SharonAnne has said it ain't accurate. With 55gr bullets the best I can expect is about 4 " at 100 yds. However this particular rifle loves 62-64 grain bullets and it groups about 1 3/4" with this weight. I have never been in a combat situation but if the fight was brought to where I am now ( heavy woods, swamps, nothing over 200 yds) I would feel confidant my Mini would go bang when the time counts. I was able to pick up a dozen 30 round mags for this one in 1991 and they all work fine.

If I had to take consistently longer shots I would want a more accurate platform. Hmmmmm the crystal ball says it sees an AR in my future......

SharonAnne · « **Reply #209 on:** May 25, 2008, 11:52:15 AM »

can we get some input from the owner of a new Mini 14/30 please???