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Offline ms

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For all you bush lover's
« on: November 20, 2007, 09:07:30 AM »
 Nov 19, 2007 8:05 pm US/
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| Print Wounded Soldier: Military Wants Part Of Bonus Back
 Reporting
Marty Griffin PITTSBURGH (KDKA) ― The U.S. Military is demanding that thousands of wounded service personnel give back signing bonuses because they are unable to serve out their commitments.

To get people to sign up, the military gives enlistment bonuses up to $30,000 in some cases.

Now men and women who have lost arms, legs, eyesight, hearing and can no longer serve are being ordered to pay some of that money back.

One of them is Jordan Fox, a young soldier from the South Hills.

He finds solace in the hundreds of boxes he loads onto a truck in Carnegie. In each box is a care package that will be sent to a man or woman serving in Iraq. It was in his name Operation Pittsburgh Pride was started.

Fox was seriously injured when a roadside bomb blew up his vehicle. He was knocked unconscious. His back was injured and lost all vision in his right eye.

A few months later Fox was sent home. His injuries prohibited him from fulfilling three months of his commitment. A few days ago, he received a letter from the military demanding nearly $3,000 of his signing bonus back.

"I tried to do my best and serve my country. I was unfortunately hurt in the process. Now they're telling me they want their money back," he explained.

It's a slap for Fox's mother, Susan Wardezak, who met with President Bush in Pittsburgh last May. He thanked her for starting Operation Pittsburgh Pride which has sent approximately 4,000 care packages.

He then sent her a letter expressing his concern over her son's injuries, so she cannot understand the U.S. Government's apparent lack of concern over injuries to countless U.S. Soldiers and demands that they return their bonuses.

While he's unsure of his future, Fox says he's unwavering in his commitment to his country.

"I'd do it all over again... because I'm proud of the discipline that I learned.  I'm proud to have done something for my country," he said.

But Fox feels like he's already given enough. He'll never be able to pursue his dream of being a police officer because of his wounds and he can't believe he's being asked to return part of his $10,000 signing bonus.

KDKA contacted Congressman Jason Altmire on his behalf. He says he has proposed a bill that would guarantee soldiers receive full benefit of bonuses

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2007, 10:47:47 AM »
This trash has been going on since at least 2004.  The fellow behind it is David Chu, the Pentagon manpower guru.  Chu once dissed veterans with this jewel:  "Veteran's benefits are hurtful to national security."  The White House is well aware of this policy and apparently sees nothing wrong with it. 

In 2006, Rumsfeld asked congress to cut six million dollars from troop brain injury research:  Hastert quickly complied.  The money was restored early in the current congress. 


Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2007, 11:32:25 AM »
I live just outside of Pittsburgh and have heard of this story. They are rite when they say it is a slap in the face. For a person to give their all for their country and get injured. Then have the government do this is is a very terrible thing. What the hell is going through their heads. These people in many cases will not be able to work again. Dale
The quality of a mans life is in direct proportion to his commitment to excellence.

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Offline Dee

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2007, 02:01:40 PM »
You guys are gonna make some Bush supporters mad. :o
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2007, 02:34:46 PM »
"You guys are gonna make some Bush supporters mad."

My body is scarred from another useless war.  We were told that if RVN fell that the other countries in the region would fall like dominos.  Well, RVN fell and nothing else happened in the region.   Now the politicians in the white house and congress are in the pockets of the primary supporter of the North Vietnamese-Red China.   Presently we have another holy war going.  The big difference between this war and the other wars is that the white house is waging war on disabled veterans.   i wanna puke.

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Offline Dee

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2007, 04:30:01 PM »
Once again, there seems to be an absence of Bush worshipers on the thread also. ??? Truth is indeed hard on the follower, when the race horse turns out instead, to be a sloth. huh?
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline nomosendero

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2007, 04:49:52 PM »
Unbelievable & a sorry state of affairs. I have 2 boys in the Guard & I cannot imagine how the parents must feel, it should enrage everyone. 
You will not make peace with the Bluecoats, you are free to go.

Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2007, 04:58:42 PM »
Once again, there seems to be an absence of Bush worshipers on the thread also. ??? Truth is indeed hard on the follower, when the race horse turns out instead, to be a sloth. huh?
Dee I really enjoy your perspective on things normally but in this case I have to say. ??? ??? ??? ??? I don't understand what you are trying to say. I hope you are not saying to bad for our guy's and they should have to pay that money back. If that is what you are saying you have really lost my respect for your opions. Dale
The quality of a mans life is in direct proportion to his commitment to excellence.

A bad day at the range is better than a good day at work!!

Offline Redhawk1

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #8 on: November 20, 2007, 05:17:31 PM »
Once again, there seems to be an absence of Bush worshipers on the thread also. ??? Truth is indeed hard on the follower, when the race horse turns out instead, to be a sloth. huh?

It is not just a Bush problem, it has been going on longer than Bush's term with other war Veterans. If you want to put blame on anyone, then but it on all of them not just Bush.
 
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Offline Cheesehead

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #9 on: November 20, 2007, 05:46:45 PM »
When GW dies and goes to Hell,,, he will feel the pain of every soldier that was killed or injured and the pain experienced by their family and friends. This hardship put upon the Vets,,,,,is the ultimate sin. >:(

Cheese
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Offline jh45gun

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #10 on: November 20, 2007, 06:03:09 PM »
When GW dies and goes to Hell,,, he will feel the pain of every soldier that was killed or injured and the pain experienced by their family and friends. This hardship put upon the Vets,,,,,is the ultimate sin. >:(

Cheese

So Cheese you gonna say that about every Commander In Chief we have had during war since this country began or is this just a Bush thing???? As far as the origional thread goes you can blame Bush and maybe some is his fault but the Government has treated Vets unfairly for a long time. A very long time before Bush took office, there is plenty of blame to go around in that respect.
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Offline Dee

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2007, 01:44:31 AM »
Once again, there seems to be an absence of Bush worshipers on the thread also. ??? Truth is indeed hard on the follower, when the race horse turns out instead, to be a sloth. huh?
Dee I really enjoy your perspective on things normally but in this case I have to say. ??? ??? ??? ??? I don't understand what you are trying to say. I hope you are not saying to bad for our guy's and they should have to pay that money back. If that is what you are saying you have really lost my respect for your opions. Dale

Well Dale, you DEFINATELY MISSED my sarcasm. I have a son whom just finished his 3rd combat tour as a Sgt. with the 82nd Airborne. My support of the troops is PARAMOUNT, and my sarcasm was directed at Bush for allowing this kind of BS. I would dearly love to address face to face the folks that are responsible for the latest abuse of American troops.
Bush is not a "race horse" he is the "sloth". He should address "this issue" on wounded troop treatment PUBLICLY, and apologize to the soldiers, but it is probably not going to happen, just as he has REFUSED to pardon those two Border Patrol Agents whom shot a MEXICAN DRUG SMUGGLER, and then were sent to PRISON. GOOD GRIEF!. Now the drug smuggler has been CAUGHT AGAIN, and still the Agents sit in Prison. Mr. Bush is the lowest of the low, to let these two men languish in Prison, while the smuggler, continues to ply his trade in our country. Different issue than the thread, yes, but same ole deal. Make excuses while our troops and protectors suffer.  >:(
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2007, 02:57:07 AM »
"Bush is not a "race horse" he is the "sloth"."

Bush runs all over the place like a big proud stallion.  When it comes to the things that are important to this country like dealing with  belligerent China, getting after the sorry Iraqi government, getting serious with illegals and taking care of the troops, Bush is a gelding.

Offline Dee

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2007, 03:13:31 AM »
Well now sir, I stand corrected. I like your analogy much better than my own. Hear! Hear!
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline gypsyman

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2007, 10:39:20 AM »
While I will certainly give credit, where credit is due, this administration, and all of them back to as far as WWI have NEVER treated veterans the way they should. I just get a kick of how some of you just like to kick Bush, when it's been the last 80 or so years. When did the Vietnam Vets get treated the right way. Clinton cut both the military and the benefits they received. Take heart all you Bush basher's, less than a year to go. Then we'll all get to pick on Hilary.  gypsyman
We keep trying peace, it usually doesn't work!!Remember(12/7/41)(9/11/01) gypsyman

Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2007, 11:58:12 AM »
Dee please accepet my apology then Dale.
The quality of a mans life is in direct proportion to his commitment to excellence.

A bad day at the range is better than a good day at work!!

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2007, 12:49:58 PM »
"Clinton cut both the military and the benefits they received."


i am a disabled military retiree who stays up to date on who cuts what.  Clinton did not cut veterans benefits. 

Offline oldandslow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2007, 01:25:39 PM »
I have a brother-in-law that retired from the Air Force. His drug benefits went away on Clinton's watch and were restored on Bush's. My son was injured while in the Army and was told if he re-upped they would med board him out. He received a 10% disability, all on Clinton's watch. He reapplied to the VA 3 years ago and now gets 60% disability. I'm not George's biggest fan but I don't think he is the devil in disguise either. Just my two cents worth.

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2007, 02:12:53 PM »
"I have a brother-in-law that retired from the Air Force. His drug benefits went away on Clinton's watch and were restored on Bush's."

I retired from the US army in 1979.  No drug benefits went away on Clinton's watch.  Please do not try to tell me who cut what veteran's benefits.  i advise veterans' on their benefits as a gratis service.     


Matter of fact Clinton authorized compensation for Gulf War syndrome:  Good thing he did too.  The Republican draft dodger lead congress that took over in 1995 would have never passed that legislation. 



Statement on Signing Veterans Benefits Legislation
November 2nd, 1994 
 
Today I am pleased to sign into law H.R. 5244, the "Veterans' Benefits Improvements Act of 1994" and H.R. 3313, the "Veterans Health Programs Extension Act of 1994." These bills address important areas of concern for our Nation's veterans.

The primary purpose of H.R. 5244, the "Veterans' Benefits Improvements Act of 1994," is to authorize compensation to Persian Gulf War veterans suffering from disabilities resulting from undiagnosed illnesses possibly incurred during service in the Persian Gulf theater of operations.

Some of our Persian Gulf War veterans are suffering from illnesses that cannot be diagnosed based upon current available scientific and medical data. The lack of a diagnosis at this point, however, should not stop us from providing an expeditious and compassionate response to these veterans' needs. Our Nation is keenly aware of its responsibility to the brave men and women who so capably served our country during the Persian Gulf conflict. This legislation is designed to address their needs.

The Act authorizes the Secretary of Veterans Affairs to compensate Persian Gulf War veterans who suffer chronic disabilities from undiagnosed illnesses that became manifest during or within a specified time after their service in the Gulf region. It also requires the Secretary of Veterans Affairs to develop and implement a uniform and comprehensive medical evaluation protocol for veterans of the Persian Gulf conflict suffering from unexplained illnesses. I am pleased to say that this protocol has already been established. VA medical centers and facilities are currently providing appropriate medical assessment, diagnoses, and treatment to Persian Gulf War veterans.

This Act will help to further our investigation into the adverse health consequences that may be associated with service in the Persian Gulf, including potential risks to the family members of our veterans, by requiring the VA to evaluate the health status of spouses and children of Persian Gulf War veterans. It also requires the VA to implement an outreach program for Persian Gulf War veterans, including a newsletter and a toll-free telephone number to provide information concerning available benefits.

The "Veterans Health Programs Extension Act of 1994," H.R. 3313, will extend the VA's authority to operate a number of veterans programs and activities. Significantly, this Act will extend the VA's authority to provide Persian Gulf War veterans with hospital, nursing home, and outpatient medical care for disabilities possibly incurred from exposure to toxic substances or environmental hazards during service in the Persian Gulf. It also extends the VA's authority to provide Vietnam veterans with hospital and nursing home care for disabilities, which may have resulted from exposure to dioxin. The Act also extends the VA's authority to provide priority health care services for disabilities possibly related to exposure to ionizing radiation during nuclear testing or during certain service in Japan following World War II. Finally, the Act also authorizes appropriations of $379.4 million for major medical facility construction and repair projects and 15.8 million for major medical facilty leases for the VA.

Because of the important benefits that this legislation will provide to our Nation's veterans and their families, I am very gratified to sign these two bills into law.

William J. Clinton

The White House,

 

Offline gypsyman

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2007, 02:58:52 PM »
There hasn't been a president that has managed to get everything right. Impossible. But it sure seems like Bush can't put his pants on without somebody complaining. Sure is alot better than what the alternative would have been.  gypsyman
We keep trying peace, it usually doesn't work!!Remember(12/7/41)(9/11/01) gypsyman

Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2007, 03:10:32 PM »
What would the alternative be? Dale
The quality of a mans life is in direct proportion to his commitment to excellence.

A bad day at the range is better than a good day at work!!

Offline gypsyman

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2007, 08:32:08 PM »
Al (the global warming guy) Gore-  I defend Bush on certain levels, and condemn him on others. I believe that the war in Iraq and Afghanistan was the right thing to do. It's their religion that drives the terrorists to do what they do. If we didn't try and stop them over there, another 9/11. On the other hand, Bush's border policy is a joke. Thousands of crime's every year are committed by illegal aliens. Unless we stop the flow, it's going to get worse. This country should have had import duty/tariffs 15-20 years on all the stuff coming from overseas. Regan did it on imported motorcycles 20-25 years ago to help out Harley. Our dollar is going down the drain, and this government is sitting around with a thumb up it's butt doing nothing. Bush certainly isn't the best, but 10 times better than what the alternative would have been.  gypsyman
We keep trying peace, it usually doesn't work!!Remember(12/7/41)(9/11/01) gypsyman

Offline oldandslow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2007, 06:05:32 AM »
alsaqr, I'm not going to argue with you. All I know is I road with him to pick up a prescription when Clinton was prez and he told me he had to start paying for it. A few years later after Bush took over over I went with him again. I asked if he still had to pay. He told me " No, we got that benefit back".

Offline ironglow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2007, 07:14:35 AM »
  Well fellows;

  I started out as a very firm Dubya supporter..even as the Klintonites in the capitol were stealing the "W" key caps off all the computers.

  It has become abundantly clear that like every other CinC, he is far from perfect ! Of course, I never had any delusions about any human being as absolutely perfect.
 
 None of them has of yet, walked upon water !

  That also goes for everyone presently running to take that same office..  If you know of one that is perfect and walks on water..please let the rest of us know !

    The war in Iraq, though painful (as all wars are) is starting to show fruit. Al Anbar and the Sunni Triangle are pacified, and Baghdad & the Shiite areas are well
   on their way to be so.
  This in itself is just short of a miracle..while many of the congressional Democrats and the drive-by media have partnered in their efforts to torpedo and play down the
   accomplishments of our troops.
  Tragically, some of the more shameless Democrats are still trying to discount our troops efforts and get more killed by giving "aid & comfort" to the terrorists that are sneaking in from Iran, Syria etc.  Lately, not as many have been sneaking into Iraq as previously, because now days the IRAQIS are hunting this scum down like the rats they are. The surge is working !!!

     I don't give the Pres as much credit as  do Gen Petraeus, who is arguably the world's foremost expert on counter-insurgency warfare..Just happened the Pres appointed the right man at the right time.

  Businesses are coming back strong, weddings are being celebrated in the streets of Baghdad and Iraqi Army and security jobs have all the volunteers they need.

    It took quite some time for the Iraqi in the street to figure out that the terrorists were their enemy..not Pres Bush...Some folks here in the US, still haven't figured that out !!
  Guess they are not as sharp as the average Iraqi in the street !

   Yes; regardless of some AMERICAN politicians calling our troops "cold blooded killers" and "terrorists"..the average Iraqi now knows better . I wonder just when some Congressmen will learn as much a Haji cab driver already knows !!

   Even Nancy Pa-loser's efforts to start a war on the Turkish border has not only fallen flat, but has promoted joint efforts by Iraq & Turkey to uproot the Communists in  Kurdistan.

  Wonder how that strikes Pa-loser to find that her efforts at starting a war has resulted in hurting her fellow-travelers, the Commie terrorists in Kurdistan ?

  Sometimes I pause to think..Pres Bush is not great..he is much better than the guy he replaced, but certainly no Ronald Reagan. However when I hear the same people complain
    continually about Bush and NEVER give credit for the good things he has done, cutting income tax, appointing fine judges to the Supreme court, protecting farms & ranches for the
    rightful heirs rather that the IRS or protecting the 2nd amendment..I realize there is "something else" in play..be it sour grapes from the 2000 election, yellow-doggery or whatever.

   Veteran's rights as with many other governmental things a re controlled more often by bureaucrats..who were most often appointed by an administration prior to the tenure of the
   seated President.
        The only way a President can greatly change the law governing veterans affairs is by signing new laws..but the Congress has to send good ones up to the President's desk !!
   Remember; " Congress proposes, the President disposes.".
       If you don't like the way veterans are being treated, climb onto your Congressman..make him/her do their job. !!     

     Are our memories so short ? Do you recall that in 2000 our troops were so mistreated, so demoralized and underpaid that candidate bush had to tell the troops,
      " Hang on, relief is coming "..simply because many were leaving the military . So many qualified pilots left that our Air Force was jeopardized. It is VERY expensive to train new
   pilots.

  Alsaqr;
   
        You're a riot ! You write of the great things Clinton did ( other than giving China "most favored nation" status, giving them ICBM accuracy enhancing technology, and trying to sell the Long Beach naval base to them..not to mention his efforts at gagging interns). Then right away, you say the "Republican draft dodger led Congress" !
  Perhaps you can answer for me ..
   Who not only dodged the draft, but then bragged about it and said.." I LOATHE the military"..

   Don't know where you stand, but you are sounding more and more like a Clinton apologist. Slik must have done some thing right..maybe the many pardons that were given to generous campaign donors ..or some such thing, but it is not a case of Clinton being all correct and Bush being all wrong...unless one is as blind as Pelosie or Murtha..

    You mention that " veteran's benefits improvements act of 1994 "  ...I suppose it is only a coincidence that in 1994 the Newt Gingrich revolution took over         congress     ..remember, "Congress proposes, the president disposes"..

      Could be that the Dems in Congress saw "the handwriting on the wall" and did something..or perhaps some Republicans sponsored the bill and scared enough Dems int signing it..who knows ?

   We do know this..since 1972.the Democrats have NOT been the military's best friend; so it is highly unlikely they would have done the military any favors !

   Doesn't look like the landscape has changed much..i haven't heard any Republicans calling our troops "cold blooded killers" or "terrorists" as of late..
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline DakotaElkSlayer

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #24 on: November 22, 2007, 07:46:15 AM »
...I sleep well at night since I never voted for the guy. ;)

Jim
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Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2007, 08:18:05 AM »
While US troops are taking back the streets, the Iraqi "army" wusses off and bides its time until US troops leave.   It does not matter whether US troops leave tomorrow or 20 years from now.  The place is going into total civil war when US troops leave.  Ask the four million Iraqi refugees who are sitting in refugee camps in Lebanon, Syria, Iran and Jordan what they think of the situation in Iraq.   20 percent ot the population of Iraq have left the country. 

No, i do not like those politicians like Murtha who criticize our troops.  Neither do i like draft dodging cowards like Hastert, Cole and DeLay who claim to support our troops and then vote to cut troop brain injury research.   

God Bless Our Fine Troops on this Thanksgiving day. 

Offline ironglow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #26 on: November 22, 2007, 08:19:10 AM »
  Dakota;

   Do you not vote ?..Or did you vote for the guy that called our troops "terrorists" ? The same guy that admitted to committing war crimes himself...

   It now appears that by the criteria the Democrats themselves established during the 2004 campaign, insisting that any person to be a viable candidate for President must be a "combat veteran"..el;iminates their own folks !

   In fact, the only good ones running this time (by their own criteria) is either John McCain or Duncan Hunter..wonder which one Hillery is voting for ?...LOL
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline ironglow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #27 on: November 22, 2007, 09:08:21 AM »
Alsaqr;

  Since you are "advising vets" I have some info for you..

   The " veteran's benefits improvement act of 1994 " was enacted to deal with the particular poroblems suffered by veterans of the Gulf war, 1990-1991.

  Only natural that about 2-3 years after the conflict, some special legislation would work it's way through Congress..about the usual reaction time.

  Contrary to what you seem to claim, these vets have not been abandoned..the act has in fact, been extended to 2011..

         http://home.att.net/~vet_updates/gwcompen.htm

      You can use the link or just do a search for   < veteran's benefits improvements act of 1994, extended >   ...sure seems like an adviser to Gulf war vets would
     already know the act was extended.... during the Bush administration....Hmmmm     

       BTW: I don't understand why you cited  HR 3313  since that is the " Defense of Marriage act" ...sponsored by 38 Republicans and 1 Democrat..
       
     ( another reason to back Republicans ?)
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline alsaqr

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #28 on: November 22, 2007, 09:54:13 AM »
"You mention that " veteran's benefits improvements act of 1994 "  ...I suppose it is only a coincidence that in 1994 the Newt Gingrich revolution took over         congress     ..remember, "Congress proposes, the president disposes"..'

The Newt Gingrinch bunch did not come into congress until 1995. 

 "BTW: I don't understand why you cited  HR 3313  since that is the " Defense of Marriage act" ...sponsored by 38 Republicans and 1 Democrat..'

i cited no such thing.  Furthermore, i could care less about that or any of the other feel good crap proposed by Hastert, Gingrinch or any of the other cowardly draft dodging chickenhawks  in his  congress. 

Offline ironglow

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Re: For all you bush lover's
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2007, 03:20:34 AM »
 Alsaqr;

   "Feel good" stuff is usually brought in by liberals...LOL

   Think; ....are there any "draft dodgers" on the left ? Other that the Der Slickmeister himself...
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)