Musings about the shooter in Omaha...

[ironglow]

   Fox News showed picture of perp...  His main gripe was that he lost his job at MacDonald's and his sweetie quit him !
   Why and how have things changed so much? Years ago, if someone were so depressed over personal problems, he
  would either take his own life or possibly take the direct "offender" with him..now they strike out at the innocent !
   What has "civilization" come to?
     
      This morning I was up early and watching the History Channel, which was showing some films from the 50s..
   covering Pres Eisenhower's diplomatic trips to the Mideast; Turkey, Pakistan, Afghanistan etc.  The news footage
   showed cheering crowds and the narrator spoke in admiring terms about "our President". When he got home,
   he was welcomed by crowds, confetti and the news people were congratulating "our President".

   Common sense tells us that certainly not all the people producing that film were voters who had elected President
  Eisenhower; but still..there were no complaints about his foreign policy, no snide remarks about his election victory !
      When the President was touring, the news people spoke only respectfully about him. When he arrived home in
  Washington, the narrator mentioned how great it is for anyone, but especially for our President to arrive back home
  in the "good old USA"!..

   Compare that with today's reportage and today's people who are in the spotlight ! Many make crude, sicko remarks
    about our President and other leaders..they often are the first ones to complain about how unfair, indecent and
   downright "rotten" the USA is ..(makes one wonder why they stay here).

    How much of an intellectual jump is it for a teenager, already hurting from life's "unfairness" to catch that same
   "hate disease" that he hears and sees being bandied about by people who SHOULD be mature and responsible
    enough to control their own hateful emotions. There are some well known people called "celebrities", from all walks
   of life, that are just stupid enough to demonstrate their hate to impressionable, already hurting, poorly adjusted
   teenagers.

          Where does all this HATE come from..our society never used to be this way ?  Is this the new "chic" ?
    Is it "cool" to be a clod ?

    I submit that this kid was "egged on' by all the anger and hate he sees everywhere around him ?  ..but of
   course, he won't see it here anymore..nor will 10 or 12 other innocent people !

   
        Has our media "given him permission" to vent his pain in this way ?

   Sorry for the long rant, but our country, our people are not the same as they were a few short decades ago !
  We are worse, not better for it..and I don't know if we will ever get it back..looks doubtful !

     BTW: Of course, once again.."guns' will be blamed..and none will mention the culture of hate the lad was brought up in.

[GatCat]

I think the problems of people like him are multi-faceted. First off is the acceptance of violence, brought about by so much violent video games, movies, and rap songs. Then there is a need to be "known" due to media coverage, and web-sites ( my-space, blogs, and such). People like him feel they will be "famous", or known forever. Then certainly a break-down of the family structure factors in, as does a general lack of respect for other people ( perhaps starting with parents, teachers, cops, etc.). Being "spoiled" since an early age doesn't help ( "no one understands little Johnny.."). A general lack of Religion enters the picture. Various prescription drugs might have a bearing. And on and on.
But then, remember there have been "thrill killings" before the above entered the picture. Leopuld/Lowbe ( spelling???, in the 1930's or so ). The young guy and his girlfriend who killed about 6 people in the mid-west in the '50's ( forgot their names ). And so on.
Sometimes evil happens.
Wish I had a better answer!!!
Mark

[SHOOTALL]

ironglow , at one time we were team players , we voted and supported who ever won , the elected did what was good for the country ! and the world !
today the elected do what they need to do in order to get elected , can you say special interest group ?
and SI group cries when they don't get what they want !
as far as the rest of the world mass shootings and bombs are the norm as far as getting attention goes , guess we have arrived at a lower level of respect and honor for team spirit  ! we are a me people now !
SHAME !

[deltecs]

We only have ourselves to blame for the current politically correct trend.  We buy the newpapers full of sensationalism.  We elected officials that constantly lie and commit perjury while applauding his 80%+ popularity.  All the while our embassies are bombed, our ships blown up, our enforcement officers are burning buildings in a hostage crisis and killing innocents in standoffs.  What about our politically correct policy of education in which the teachers without authority to administer corporal punishment, who babysit our children not teach, so my wife and I can have 2 jobs and attain the American dream.  Or the neighborhood and community that pleads 1st Amendment rights to silent prayer or Pledge of Allegiance in classroom, lawsuits against the Boy Scouts of America so gays can become leaders and members all the while with criticism of their standards.  It is so easy to blame someone else for our faults when the truth is we are responsible for our own actions, not the tools at hand.  Newsmax quoted "Police believe Hawkins stole the assault rifle, an AK-47, from his stepfather's home, Warren said."  Since when are we going to stand up and tell these reporters that a semi auto rifle is not an assault weapon.  This term has been used so much by the Brady bunch that it has come to mean something entirely different than the truth.  A sanitation engineer is still a garbage man to me and human resources directer still means personnel manager.  Go ahead and use the politacally correct terms and we will find that sexual orientation will become a right instead of an aberation. 

[DalesCarpentry]

If you want to get down to it we are a victim of our our media. Monkey see monkey do. These things are reported so much now days that we have copy cats. Dale

[gypsyman]

GatCat hit on most of them. Few more problem area's--Make sure that when Johjnny or Billy is growing up, he doesn't learn how to lose. Even if his team is, or him, is the the pits, make sure he gets a trophy for just showing up, don't chew him out for screwing up, just tell him, it's ok, try and do better next time. That way, when real life hits him in the ass, he doesn't know how to handle it. Sometimes ya lose. Get up off your butt and keep moving on.
Lets make sure we take religion out of daily life. Why answer to God. The sports hero making 10 million a year that's using steriods, cheating on his wife, Hollywood celebrities hooked on drugs, not wanting to take care of their own children. Thats some of these kids gods. I'm afraid it's only going to get worse.  gypsyman

[30-06man]

They will blame the guns and wonder how he got them. I think they said he stole them from his dads safe, and then on CNN(i know) they said that the man was irresponsible about keeping his guns locked up and that we need stricter laws. What got me was last night they were talking about it and they asked the woman who works for the Hospital if you could tell what type of gun it was by the one bullet hole. He was asking was it a semi auto and I am sitting there like how the hell did you get into the news and know that a single bullet wound would tell what the gun was. The he went on asking what caliber and I am sitting there like this is a bunch of BS. So I turn it over to fox and they are interviewing the cops asking well were the security cop armed and where were they and the cops said they ran because all they has was mace and some handcuffs and were being paid minimum wage. Then they went and interviewed people in the mall and asked if they would support the security guards caring guns and all said no. I thought well hell if you are worried about this man then why don't you want the only security you have there to not carry a gun but yet you seemed surprised when they ran and hid just like you? I am all for the security guards getting paid more and carrying guns or just hiring cops like they do in the schools these days. I am also for arming the teachers in schools.

[ironglow]

   I don't know if any of us have the complete answers...but it sure looks like almost everyone who has answered here so far has made a lot of good sense !

  If, in spite of how we may disagree on some details..we; a bunch of average hunters/shooters know what makes good sense..

   How is it most the media, politicians and super-celebs all seem to be talking gibberish ?

   Methinks..they are not so smart as they PRETEND to be!

[Chilachuck]

30-06, the reporters may have spoken with people a little before the cameras started rolling to see if they would support an anti gun agenda, then did the interview. Something like that was documented back in the Rodney King riots and after at least one hurricane in Florida.

[30-06man]

Fox news has never appeared the be anti gun or anything. The media does get in and change peoples minds. I just wonder if some of the people were staged?

[williamlayton]

More than likely they were photo opted or sorted out for the effect--not all were included.
Who can say but I will think that if ONE had a chance too lessen the carnage and didn't that will play on the mind.
Would I have---who knows---I hope so.
Blessings

[Heavy C]

I think Gypsyman has it right in that society doesn't allow for having anyone lose.  I attended a kids basketball game to watch my nephew play in a tournament.  These were six-year olds, tournament finishes and they award 1st through 3rd place.  One of the kids mothers that was on one of the losing teams asked where the trophies were for the rest of the kids.  Needless to say she was shocked and offended that her little boy was not going to get anything for playing.  The coach calmly explained to her that this was actually a life lesson and our kids need to not only learn how to deal with life's disappointments, but do it in a classy manner.  She just walked away, but I was proud of him for standing up to that parent.  All too often society has taught kids that even when you finish last there will still be a prize for you. 

The fact that this young man came from a broken home in my opinion just added to his inability to cope.  I hope the media doesn't portray this as a gun control issue.   

[SHOOTALL]

I guess when your team looses now they don't make you run laps anymore ?
and when ya screw up bad do they not have blanket parties anymore ?
how do the motivate teenage boys to get it right these days ?

[ncsurveyor]

I guess when your team looses now they don't make you run laps anymore ?
and when ya screw up bad do they not have blanket parties anymore ?
how do the motivate teenage boys to get it right these days ?

Things of the past.

Not allowed to be a loser anymore.

I imagine they'll start solidifying the laws to make it so kids can't be fired, and that you'll have civil litigation options available if your girlfriend throws you to the curb.  You know, mental anguish, breech of contract, alienation of ego.  Some other BS.

I heard where they won't allow drill sergeants curse at the recruits anymore.

[ironglow]

   
    Although I taught my sons and grandkids that sometimes you lose..but they must be ready to try harder next time around.

  Then i stressed the importance of conditioning and preparation ..so they would not have to face losing..

    I am glad I did it..since my oldest grandson (23) has just finished his second deployment (Spec Ops Marine) to the Ramadi/ Fallujah area..
   
   Young people should be taught to win..and they should be taught that there is a cost to losing..

  ..Because in what many of our young folks are facing in Iraq & Afghanistan..the personal cost of losing even a small confrontation..could be MUCH GREATER !

[30-06man]

That's what I have taught my son and daughter. But I cannot say the same for my nephews because my brother seems to not think the same as I and yall.

[ironglow]

 30-06 man;

         I hear where you're coming from ! My youngest brother is as far left as John Kerry !..

   He spent his working (?) life in the "education industry" both high school and college level..and
      apparently swallowed their whole schtick ..hook, line and sinker..
         
      In my few discussions with him..common sense and logic seem to bear no part in his decisions
   about things, especially along political lines.
        It is indeed heart wrenching to find someone with enough letters (BA,MA,PHD) behind his name to
   make a helping of alphabet soup...make political pronouncements that come out sounding no more
  brilliant than a street chant such as....
                (e.g.) " Hey, hey..ho, ho...western civilization has got to go !"
   
    Yes; he did serve a couple years (honorably) in the Army '68 -'70...but all I hear is a limp backing of the
   troops with severe criticism of the military in general !
        I could understand such criticism of the military if he were to offer the same type critique of  teachers
    and teacher's unions !
        But alas; such is not forthcoming...
   
   Yes he is my brother and I love him..but sure can't agree with him ...

         

[30-06man]

My brother served in the marines for 4 years and didn't seem to learn how to do anything. Then he went and worked in a factory and supported Clinton and those who got rid of his job. Now he supports John Edwards along with the union and has no common sense. I don't see how a factory worker and a hunter could so such a thing. He says he supports the hunting organizations but yet seems to support anti gun and hunting presidential candidates. He seems to believe in everyone of their lies.

[clodbuster]

I can only echo what has been said above.  The  PC behavior practiced by so many people in this country is leading us down the same path as Europe.  The sheepification of America opens the door to Socialists, ex. the Dems Pres candidates.  Let's see....take from those who work hard or smart or both and give to the lazy azzez.  Anyway a child having been or now being raised by the group on this discussion ought to consider themselves blessed. 

[skit]

do any of you guys think that getting rid of the "draft" may have had a negative effect on the youth?

[williamlayton]

I liked the draft.
I have read much here but few solutions---we all know the penalty---does anyone offer a cure?
Let's see.
Freedom---but you must be a team player and think as I think.
Hummm.
Be willing to accept responsibility--if you can't find someone too lay off the responsibility on.

What about individuality and accept the results of this individuality and be happy with the fact that you are what you want too be.
It does boil down to accepting responsibility---and that is a rare trait.
Learned---Really, I doubt it---kind of like guts--but then no one knows what that is, anymore--just what Hollywood makes of them.
Blessings

[beemanbeme]

Skit, Yes! Yes! Yes! I truly believe that every young man at the age of eighteen should be taken from his home. NO DEFERMENTS, NO EXCEPTIONS. And put in the service for say three years with two weeks leave each year to go home.  If the guy is a c.o. fine. Put him to work in a state hospital or a V.A. hospital or train him as a medic.  If he can sit in a chair, he can sit at a computer entering data. He doesn't have to be 1A. But get him out of his Mommie's house and let him know what its like to be treated like a man and be expected to act like a man.

[SHOOTALL]

maybe affirmative action has caused this !
We lost 2 jobs lately , they were awarded to a minority contractor ! not because he was low ! ( we know he wasn't low because he was going to pay us to do the job for him ) NO WE DID NOT ACCEPT !
WIN ? LOOSE only applies to a level playing field !

[ironglow]

   Shootall;
      You are probably correct, in that affirmative action caused some of it..but of course, it does not stand alone. All PC is detrimental to our culture, simply because it is based upon UNJUST and ILLOGICAL thinking.
     Several decades ago there was some unfairness practiced against women, people of color, recent legal immigrants..etc. In a practical sense, that no longer happens..certainly not in the numbers or degree that liberals like to think it does..

...But no matter, that perhaps you or any contractor in your town have never practiced any kind of discrimination..discriminatory measures will be applied against you !
   Now, there is a brilliant example of "liberal logic" !

        Another "sterling stroke of stupidity" is the enactment of "hate crimes" laws.. It would seem that if someone assaults, murders, tortures or otherwise maims or kills a fellow human, one might safely assume that hate would have been involved..DUH !
  The only exception may be a contract killing..but then a "contract killer" could not in good conscience, be charged with a hate crime..since he operates solely upon
   a business proposition..LOL                   ...More "liberal logic"!

   I think we all are aware that the so-called hate crimes laws are not applied uniformly;  Examples ?  easy !
 
  1) The so-called Jena six hoodlums who ganged up on and beat a lone student nearly to death. Beyond the original assault, there should have been a "hate crimes"
   penalty enacted..why was this not done ?

   2) The meagre penalty given to the rioter in Los Angeles a few years ago that tried to murder Reginald Denny, an innocent truck driver, with a brick to the head !
      That murderous person only got "time served" as I recall (a few months)..no mention of the hate crime involved..

   Yes, as the old saying goes.."justice delayed is justice denied"..even moreso, Justice denied via discrimination is an egregious crime by authorities.

   Frankly, anyone should only be charged for what the actually did..not for what some shyster lawyer or judge ..THINKS the defendant was thinking.

           I recall a popular song from years ago that said, " you can't go to jail for what you're thinking"..not true anymore..

   In fact it is worse than that..you can now apparently go to jail for what someone else may THINK you are thinking !!!  Now that's liberal justice !

[deltecs]

   Shootall;
     ...           I recall a popular song from years ago that said, " you can't go to jail for what you're thinking"..not true anymore..

   In fact it is worse than that..you can now apparently go to jail for what someone else may THINK you are thinking !!!  Now that's liberal justice !

A few years ago I was cited for DUI after an accident.  No one was injured but because of my .357 S&W in the console, we could not agree on the plea bargain.  The city DA was adamant that my firearm be seized because it was in my possession while I was under the influence.  This had been common practice for the DA and Court to seize firearms in DUI cases, even though firearms were not involved with the incident in any way whatsoever.  I refused to agree with the plea bargain if my handgun was taken as a condition of the agreement.  The DA in court attempted to persuade the Judge that I needed 30 days in house alcohol and drug treatment after refusing the plea bargain.  Prior to the refusal the DA only requested the minimum sentence allowed along with the firearm seizure.  Her statement to the judge was that had it been me that had been rear ended, I would have jumped from the vehicle and stated blasting.  When the judge asked if I had anything to say, I promptly related that the firearm, whether in the car or not, would not have changed this situation and I am being charged for what did happen, not what might have happened.  My attorney then stated that under Alaska law, that court had been seizing firearms unlawfully, without the express conditions laid down by Alaska Legislature.  The judge, with surprised eyebrows raised, reviewed the statutes that permit seizure of personal possessions cited by the attorney allowed under the Motor Vehicle Codes.  The City DA demanded the judge seize my firearm, at which time the judge stated that under the law, he would not seize it.  She immediately got indignant and again demanded the judge seize the gun.  Needless to say, the judge told her to meet him in his chambers after this case and to shut up about the seizure. I got the standard minimum sentence applied to other DUI convictions.  My attorney told me that the judge could have sentenced me to the maximum for a first offense and that it was not smart move to balk at the firearms seizure.  I told him that somewhere a great man stated "A man who gives up his arms for peace and security deserves neither"  I felt my conscience would not permit me to surrender my arms to the court for no reason other than this DA's agenda. 
There are too many of them like her who base their opinions on what may happen and not what did happen.

[SHOOTALL]

I read the post after mine and all i get is that to punish the criminal is too hard so lets punish the innocent so it will look like we did something !

[Chilachuck]

Deltecs, what city was that? Do you remember the DA and the defense attorney name? Public Defender?

[deltecs]

Deltecs, what city was that? Do you remember the DA and the defense attorney name? Public Defender?

Yes, Anchorage Municipality, Anchorage, AK.  My attorney's name was Dave Mallet, who specializes in DUI.  There was no way I was not guilty of the offense and plead No Contest.  My attorney was there only for a negotiated settlement.  I found out years ago when I presented arbitration disputes that it is a fool who represents himself in a courtroom.  Good thing I had him too.  I truly regret my actions and do not recommend this course to anyone whatsoever.  It cost me tens of thousands of dollars before it was all over, not including the possible harm I might have done to others.  I got lucky.

[Chilachuck]

I hope I don't go up against that DA. My first thought was that she was a transplant, but then I remembered the "born and raised here" lawyers I've known who are anti-handgun.

[ironglow]

  Agreed Shootall;
   
   That seems to be part & parcel of PC and liberalism..don't punish the criminal..blame the innocent.
 
  Just like their "gun control" and "affirmative action" schemes..blame honest gun owners for what crooks do and with affirmative action...assume that
 
   every businessman or employer is guilty of some kind of discrimination.