reloading the .243, looking for Umph !

[Scibaer]

anyone have any reloading advice for getting a bit more umph out of the .243 ?
 i'm not fully convinced that the .243 is proper medicine for whitetails and 300lbs. hogs .
any receipts for getting it there
glenn

[Graybeard]

I don't know how you defite "umph" but it seems to me it's not to be found in the .243 Winchester and looking for it as I think I understand your meaning of it is likely to only result in disappointment or dangerous loads.

My recommendation would be to use a heavy for caliber bullet of premium construction and push it to maximum levels recommended in major loading manuals and find a load that is accurate in your gun even if it's not absolute max velocity. You'll find bullet placement more important than a few fps or even a couple hundred fps.

Lots of folks recommend lots of different loads for use in the .243 and claim they work great and I'll not argue with them as I wasn't there and didn't see it. I've shot exactly one deer with it and lost the deer so can't say what happened for sure. I used a Hornady factory load with 100 sp. The deer was at most 50-75 yards away and at the shot the cross hairs were centered on the lungs with nothing but thin air between me and him. He did take a step just as the trigger broke but it was merely a walking step and at worse it should have resulted in a rear lung hit or maybe liver. Both are very deadly or have been with all other things I've placed there.

This deer ran almost 300 yards while still in my view with no evidence of being hit and no blood trail I could find walking the path it took. Hell maybe I really missed or maybe the shot was much worse than I thought. I'll never know since I didn't recover it. A deer matching the description of it was found when buzzards were on it a week later by other hunters almost 1/2 mile away. Was it the one I shot? Dunno maybe and maybe not.

But as a result I personal lost confidence in the round even tho I have no valid evidence it was at fault. I've never used it on deer again.

[burntmuch]

Glenn Im gonna be loading some combined tech ballistic tip 95 grains. Couple mths back I asked that same question. Lotta guys luv em. They say it kills like lightning.  Lotta guys hate em.  I was gonna try some.  Ive never used a 243 on deer. Not much help there was I

[Dave in WV]

Umph? Velocity or penetration? Penetration go with a Partition, triple shock, or Speer Grandslam in the heaviest weight available. For velocity go with what looks good in loading data. Burn rates in the 4350 and 4831 seem to be good.

[Scibaer]

Dave, well a little of both would be nice. i just know that the winchester 100gr soft points aint what i want.

Jay, the 95 grain light magnum rounds look good too,   but they are costly, so i'll hand load something better then the factory stuff i have now.
      not really but you know how you can help me.. .. lets trade

Bill, your no kill situation is exactly what i wanna stay away from. and your heavy bullet at max velocities is of course right on the mark, its just getting there that i'm focused on 
      alot of guys use the .243 on whitetails, but your right it may not be the best or wisest choice, bullet placement not withstanding.

when and if i get all set to reload for the .243 i'll get some hi-tech bullets and see what i come up with , i just thought that someone here may have walked this path ahead of me, and has some answers or could get me setup nicely.
my quest continues

[tomzuki]

The Wife has one.  She took a nice meat pig to about 80 yards.  Made a head shot right behind the ear. That bullet went right on through and dropped the oinker right where he stood.  I think with good 100 gr. bullets and decent velocity it can produce.  As always poor placement is no good.

[flintlock]

I have killed deer with the 100gr Remington  CoreLokt, 100gr Winchester PowerPoint, Federal Premium 85gr Sierra GameKing HPBT, Federal Premium 100gr Nosler Partition, Federal Premium 100gr Sierra GameKing SPBT, Federal Classic 100g SP, Nitrex 100gr GrandSlam and the Hornady Custom 100gr SP...

In this group, I have killed about 85 or so with the CoreLokts, 30 or so with the 85gr Sierra GameKing HPBT and at least 5-6 with the rest...
They all kill deer, but some dropped the deer closer to the shot than others and some were more reliable as far as giving an exit wound...

Here is how I would classify them...

Bullets that almost always exit the deer with a center lung shot...
100gr CoreLokt
100gr Nosler Partition
100gr Hornady
100gr GrandSlam

Bullets that usually exit the deer, after 75-100 yards...
85gr Sierra GameKing HPBT

Bullets that sometimes exit the deer, after 75-100 yards...
100gr Sierra GameKing SPBT
100gr Winchester PowerPoint

The interesting thing, bullets in the last 2 groups (softer) bullets, usually dropped lung shot deer within 50 yards where as the harder bullets in the first group, the deer usually run 50-75 yards with a center lung shot...

Hope this helps...

[Dave in WV]

Scibaer , reloading can help with the penetration but I really don't think you can get a velocity increase that would make a difference even with over loads. This may be a situation where another rifle chambered for a more potentent cartridge would be better. I have a .243 and I load for it. I load 100gr Core-Lokts and I use them for deer. I don't know how well the load will do on hogs.

[Scibaer]

i've done some looking, and a few manufacturers make bullets in the  105, 107, 108 and 115 grains. they report velocities in the 2800+ fps.
 that may be what i'm looking for . but yeah if i cant get comfortable with the .243 i may end up  looking into a .280
glenn

[flintlock]

You might as well sell that .243, or rebarrel to 7mm-08, you have already decided that it's too "light"...I've used mine since 1980, don't own another centerfire so the .243 is what I use for groundhogs, crows, coyotes, deer and even bears when they get into our peanuts...

I'd get a 7mm-08, my brother has one as well as a .280 and he loves it (when he can get it away from his son)...

There is no need for a guy to go hunting with a cartridge that he doesn't have full confidence in, just not worth it...Good Luck

[burntmuch]

Glenn PM sent.   Thats the problem I have. Ive got other options for deer .I think if I took my 243 out deer hunting I would sit in my treestand & wonder all day if this bullet is enough. Nobody I know uses a 243 for deer . That would help.  Now when my daughters are old enough. That will be what they use. or my 357 max.  Its just like any other cartridge. some swear by them some wont use them

[Scibaer]

PM back to you Jay.
 honestly, the only reason that i am on the fence about the .243 is i have not taken game with it. the barrel i have is a great shooter, tight groups and i do enjoy shooting it.
after i handload for it and take some game, then maybe i'll feel better. what got me to thinking thats its not enough gun was stories i've read or talk with other guys who have one. not any experiences of my own, and maybe thats the real problem.

Flintlock,
your right, i do need some confidence in the .243 and i think taking some game will help that out. and handloading will to, i dont see any heavier round for this then 100gr. factory stuff.
 but i do see 107gr. and more from Speer and others, and i think thats what i'm gonna do, for deer hunting anyhow. i got some 75gr. hornadys coming my way, that will be great for yotes and crows for sure.  i dont want to give up on the .243, partly because mine shoots so nice. i just want to know that if i do my part, it will bring that buck down.
glenn

[jhalcott]

Quite possibly Graybeards problem was the deer was too CLOSE and the bullet blew up on a rib. ?? I was involved in a culling operation on a Govt. property. Several of us were using 243/6mm guns. Most of these were fed 100 grain bullets at first. We had a lot of runners after good to excellent hits. We went to 85 Sierra hpbt game kings and the running stopped. Even strong quartering shots were effective (thru the shoulder, out the hip) resulted in VERY short if any runs. We did find the earlier runners and found some grossly large entrance wounds. The bullets available today are a LOT better than what was around 30 years ago. bergers and Barnes bullets have gotten much better. so have the noslers.
   http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=482601&t=11082005
  If you are shooting a 9 twist these SHOULD work. Note the caution about length of caretridges.

[myronman3]

lots of people use them for deer,  sure.  i wont.  my choice.   why?  same reason as you.  $#!*can the 243 and choose a caliber that fills the role you want it to.  7-08,270,308,30-06, 7x57; even the 6.5 swede.   get something you have confidence in, no matter the angle.

[zasxcd]

I have to agree with the consensus here. To paraphrase an old saying, jack up the scope and park a 7mm-08, 260 Rem, 7x57 or 6.5x55 under it.

[DalesCarpentry]

Most bullet companies suggest a 1-8 or 1-9 barrel twist to shoot bullets of 105 grains and heavier. Dale

[myronman3]

i have never understood the 243 being a popular choice with people.  the best i can come up with is the light recoil of them,  otherwise i see them as too small for deer and too big for varmints.  a 100 grain bullet is way to small for my taste.  add that with mediocre velocity, and it just doesnt appeal to me.
  the 6.5 swede or the 7x57 are the front runners when i get a rifle for my wife.  light recoil and killing power.   or i may just get another 270 as she sure seems to shoot mine well enough.   either way the ball bounces, rest assured it WONT  be a 243. 

[Scibaer]

well, i agree will you all. but i got  100 brass, primer, bullets and dies.  so before i offer the .243 up for sale and get the .280 im going to handload some round for it, zero the scope and shoot some rounds. then, go from there. im 6 foot 4 and 300 pounds, recoil isnt an issue for me, my wife got me the rifle, and if just get rid of it offhand, she'll keep her undies on for a month, i dont wanna go that route. i'll pop a yote , a few crows and maybe, maybe try and take a smaller deer. then i'll feel better about jacking up the scope and parking a .280 barrel under it.  maybe the guys that are confident in the .243 ( my hunting buddy being one ) can shed some light on this for me.
glenn

[myronman3]

i hear ya there.   stuff like that can be hard.  what, did yer bud suggest the 243 to her?   if so,  looks like you owe him one, and not a good one...lol.    luckily for me,  my friends think much along the same lines as me so when the wife calls and asks them,  they offer great advise.

unfortunately,  "243" and "Umph" dont belong in the same sentence.  for what is is worth,  when the time comes,  the 280 is a very wise choice.  THAT caliber has "umph" to spare. 

[flintlock]

I've killed about 150 with mine...I wouldn't reload 105 gr bullets, you might actually be handicapping yourself...I know the 100gr CoreLokts and the 100gr Hornady Interlocks SPs to be good bullets...I'd start with one of them...

We killed 44 on our 3 farms in eastern NC this year, 18 were killed with .243s...The only ones lost were hit with a .308, 7mm-08 and a .270.

[Scibaer]

na, his wife got him a .243 ultra, and my wife got me a .243 ( muzzle loader ) combo.
we've been talking and it sounds like we are going to do a hog hunt with our .243's
( and have the wives drag the hogs out of the wollows, lol )<--joking
glenn

[drdougrx]

OOOOOHHHHHHH.....how many 243 vs. deer threads.....my hair hurts......

[Lloyd Smale]

ive shot and seen shot many many deer and bear with a 243 and 6mm remington and have yet to see one lost if properlly hit. My favorite bullets have allways been 100 grain speer grand slams and rem corelocks. Id add partitions to that list as ive used them with great results but they just never gave me the accuracy the other two bullets did. Ive seen enough game killed with them to state without reservation that if you shoot a deer and it gets away it wasnt the gun that was to blame it was the shot that was to blame. Ive put ex wives, girlfriends, sons and daughter and now grandkids in the woods with 243s and 250 savages for years and if they didnt work i think id of known it by now. If your the type that takes pot shots at running deer or will shoot a deer going away from you stay away! There not going to work for that but then what does???

[fernie]

S,

You're undoubtly aware of the debate going on in the small bore forum about the adequacy of the .243 on deer:

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,130884.0.html

However, you asked for advice 'on getting more umph !' out of the .243, so getting back to your original question...

The 'umph !' factor is always full of trade-offs.  Do you want to 'umph !' a deer with a .243, 55 gr. bullet @ 3,900 fps, or a 115 @ 2,800?  I like the 100 gr. @ 3,000+ compromise best.  200 fps makes more difference to 'umph !' in this caliber than does 15 gr. of bullet weight...but then I've not been shot with the two so that I can make a personal comparison...perhaps you'd like to volunteer to tell us?  (just kidding)  To get more 'umph !' out of anything you need a chrony and confidence in how to read signs of pressure in your case.  The first can be had for 100$.  The later can only be had by hanging around people who use the charts for a reference...but who have worked up loads beyond normal...which I am NOT recommending here.  That said, lots of bench-resters have lots of experience with this.  So I'm not telling you what to do.  But one thing I know for sure...the world is not flat.  Good luck with that 'umph !' and tell us how it turns out.

Doc

[Questor]

For hogs I prefer something that will be more likely to give a good blood trail. For more velocity, see if Hornady makes light magnums for the 243. Swift A-frame bullets if they are available or Barnes TSX bullets will give you best penetration combined with expansion and weight retention.

[Questor]

Scibaer:

Flintlock brought up a good point. What is  it about the 243 that made you think it needed more than it already has. By the way, factory loads very often outperform handloads in terms  of velocity.

[PartsMan]

Federal lists the 80 and 85 grain bullets to have the most muzzle energy,
but the 100 grain takes over past 200yds.

The real point in a 243 isn't power but accuracy.
Most will shoot inside MOA and they shoot so flat you don't have to hold over.
As long as you shoot a bullet that will hold together long enough to get to the vitals you are OK.

If you poke a hole in his heart or lung he will die.

[gstewart44]

I have shot .243 on hogs and deer now for over 10 years now and I have learned that it is an excellent cartridge with exact placement but an unforgiving round if the hit isn't just right.   When I hunt with it now I will only take a neck or high shoulder shots on deer (they drop right away) or ear/neck shots on hogs.  In these areas the game goes right down.   

In my earlier days I have had lung shot deer travel over 100 yards in thick cover before expiring.    this is not too good in the swamps and wetlands that I hunt. 

I have had two hogs absorb perfect shoulder shots  at 80-100 yards and run off with no blood trail (bled out internally).  we found them with dogs  later between 250 and 300 yds away with no exit wound and the only visible blood was what came from their lungs through the nose. 

that being said I love my 243 - it will do exactly what I need it to if I put it where it can work. 
 

[gstewart44]

BTW - the only load I have ever used is Winchester Supreme 100gr

[lilabner]

You know, many hunters use 85 gr.bullets and swear by them. Could be the higher velocity causes bullets to break up and do more organ damage (sort of a hand grenade effect) It is certainly a flat shooting bullet but should be put in the rib cage where large bones will not be hit.  I shoot 100 gr. bullets for deer in my .243. I found a load in an IMR load data book calling for 47 gr. of 7828 behind a 100 gr. bullet (corelokt). Velocity listed at 3050 fps in a 22" barrel which is very good and pressure listed at 47900 cup, which is moderate. In my rifle, this load shows no pressure signs and fine accuracy with Nosler partitions. If you try 7828, don't start with 47 gr. - start low and work up. I like the partition bullet because the nose expands reliably at short and long range and the back part of the bullet holds together for better than average penetration. I like the .243 for double lung shots on small and medium size deer and for pronghorn antelope. It would not be my choice for large mule deer or hefty northern whitetails.