CREDIT CARD PROCESSING COMPANY REJECTS FIREARMS INDUSTRY

[TexasMac]

Folks,

The NSSF (National Shooting Sports Foundation) just released the following release.

January 7, 2007
CREDIT CARD PROCESSING COMPANY REJECTS FIREARMS INDUSTRY

REFUSES TO PROCESS TRANSACTIONS . . . Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp. are refusing to process any credit card transactions between federally licensed firearms retailers, distributors and manufacturers -- a move which will severely limit available inventory of firearms and ammunition to military, law enforcement and law-abiding Americans.

The first company to be affected by this decision appears to be firearms distributor CDNN Sports Inc.

"We were contacted recently by First Data/Citi Merchant Services by a June Rivera-Mantilla stating that we were terminated and funds were being seized for selling firearms in a non-face-to-face transaction," said Charlie Crawford, president of CDNN Sports Inc. "Although perfectly legal, we were also informed that no transactions would be processed in the future, even for non-firearms. I find this very frightening."

To voice your concern to Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp., please contact June Rivera-Mantilla at 631-683-7734 or her supervisor Robert Tenenbaum at 631-683-6570.

To change to an NSSF-affiliated credit card processing program, contact Payment Alliance International at 1-866-371-2273 (ext. 1131).

[deltecs]

This trend seems to be increasing.  Maybe a law could be enacted to force transaction carriers must comply with legal financial transactions.  That would force data financial tranfers do not influence legal marketing.  Other items or politcally incorrect financial transfers could also be limited solely at the mediary's discretion.  The data processing company can insert a disclaimer clause in its sign up service agreement regarding liability and legality of transactions at minimal or no cost.  I sent a request to Congressman Young to look into this possibility.

[Hairtrigger]

Wouldn't it be great to own a business and be able to turn away business?  I would refuse to do business with antis

[quickdtoo]

Wait until you read the letter from CTI (contacted) at the NSSF, it makes it sound like every firearm paid for by cc is shipped directly to the buyer!!

Tim

http://www.nssf.org/BP2/current/index.cfm?AoI=generic

[myronman3]

this is easy...ditch your credit cards. they will only get you into trouble anyway.  my ex almost ruined my life with the damn things and i wont have one, regardless of their policies.   it is a trap, and fellow gun owners are 100 times better off without them.   

if you cant pay cash for it,  you dont need it.   

[deltecs]

I have to differ with the idea that credit cards are not needed.  Some of us live in areas not easily accessable to the conveniences of driving to major stores and purchasing a whole winters supply.  Where I live the nearest community is over 40 miles by boat across open ocean.  The population in the winter is about 150 people.  The marine fuel dock is open only on the weekend for 4 hours a day.  I constantly buy products and have them shipped to my postal box via the Internet.  The easiest and most secure way to pay for these products is with a credit card.  Try and rent a vehicle after a 2 hour charter flight in a sea plane upon landng in a town to do business without one.  Doesn't happen no matter how much cash you have.  Yea, I know, you say I can move somewhere else.  Why?  I don't like the politics, taxes, scenery, crime, or population density somewhere else.  My wife and I have for over 30 years lived here with our home schooled children.  They are now college educated and raising familes on their own and very socially acceptable, moral, and independent.  The telecommunication industry, data, and monetary transfer advances through the Internet has permitted a more close contact with my outside world beneficially.  I have no problem with paying cash when and if the situation warrants.  I cannot help it if others abuse the privelge by improper credit card use.  That is like saying the gun is at fault when we all know it is the person behind it.  Or like Larry the cable guy says, "Now I can blame my pencil when I mispell a word".

[quickdtoo]

I have to disagree too, credit cards are just like any other "vice", a person needs to know when and how to use em so they aren't abused and they get themselves in trouble, people that have debt control/financial issues, are better off without them. But they definitely have a useful purpose in many people's life, just pay the balance off every month and there's no interest charge, same as cash, just a lot more convenient.

Tim

[Hairtrigger]

I agree that credit cards are a tool. I rarely carry more than $20 cash and use credit cards for everything. I just make sure what I am buying will be paid off at the end of the month.

[myronman3]

debit cards work great for all of that, with no debt!

[quickdtoo]

Using a debit card as a credit card can be hazardous to your lifestyle, the big one being if it's connected to your main bank account, IE all your disposable cash, do a little research on it, it may save your butt.

Tim

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11731365/

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/06125/687615-68.stm

http://www.privacyrights.org/ar/DebitCd1002.htm

[dukkillr]

Can someone with more knowledge of the Credit industry tell me exactly what happened here?  Is Citi Merchant Services related to Citi-Group the credit card company?  In what way?  What common cards do they represent?

I use a Cabela's Club Visa for everything I buy, from lunch to cars. 

[deltecs]

This is what I've found on the net.

Citi Merchant Services
Provided by First Data Merchant Services Corporation
Citi Merchant Services provided by First Data Merchant Services Corporation is a contractual alliance in the U.S. between Citicorp Payment Services, Inc. (CPSI) and First Data Merchant Services Corporation.

It appears to me to be an alliance between Citi Group Financial and First Data Merchant.

[deltecs]

To satisfy my curiosity I wrote an email to regarding this situation to First Data.  Here is their response and mine back to them.  I think you'll find it most interesting.  My email request starts at the bottom of the quote and responses are read from bottom to top.

Sir,
I wish to correct your response.  The transactions were between Federally Licensed firearms dealers selling and buying firearms interstate.  This is not a firearms sale to an individual customer via online purchases.  It is against federal law to sell firearms from within one state to persons in another without going through a federal firearms licensed dealer in the state of residence.  This transaction was between dealers and not as you responded via non face to face sale, which is already by federal law illegal out of state. 
Your response also did not reflect your company's position with regard in refusal to further process transactions of non firearms items sold by that company as cited.  I find that to be prejudiced against this company who sells firearms.
As to the error in naming Mr. Tenebaum as a supervisor, it was not my quote.  I submitted a quote from Charlie Crawford, president of CDNN Sports Inc..  Any error in names should be addressed to him.  You did correct my statement on this point, yet made no mention of the service representative, who further refused to data process all other items from this company.  So I must presume your company's support of and agreement with this persons ability to interfere with future transactions.   This representative clearly stated no further transactions would be processed, while your response indicates only face to face transactions will be.  A definite conflict in policy interpretation and application is the only explanation to be derived from your response.
Until your policy changes, your company clearly understands the interstate sales of legal firearms transactions under federal law, and permit data transfers with all legally sold items by a company, I shall endeavor to not use, recommend, or support your company's business.
Sincerely,
Gregory T. Williams



Questions <Questions@firstdata.com> wrote:
Thank you for your message.  The posting at www.nssf.org regarding Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp. is inaccurate. Further, while we generally do not comment on individual merchant customers, we would like to briefly address the 12/26 letter posted on the web site. Regretfully, that letter did a less than satisfactory job of expressing applicable policies. Those policies are more properly detailed below.
Citi Merchant Services and First Data do process firearms transactions. Our policy restrictions address only the sale of firearms in a non face-to-face environment. Non face-to-face transactions occur when a cardholder is not present in front of a merchant and includes mail order and online purchases. It is our policy not to service merchants that make non face-to-face sales in a number of industries, including firearms.
It is not the policy of Citi Merchant Services or First Data to refuse to process transactions from duly licensed merchants that sell firearms in face-to-face transactions at the point of sale.
Please direct any questions to Questions@firstdata.com.
The posting also incorrectly states that Robert Tenenbaum is the supervisor when, in fact, he is not.
 
        "Gregory T. Williams" <deltecs@yahoo.com>
01/09/2008 02:14 PM             
        To:     marketingcommunications@firstdata.com
        cc:     
        Subject:        Interference with Transaction 

Sir,
It has come to my attention when researching a company for installation of data monetary tranfer equipment at my business that your company determines which legal sales may be processed through your system.   For that reason I will find an alternate company that provides the same service.  I cannot afford to have your company's policy interfere with my legal sales merely due to personal prejudice.  The following information is what I've found. 
 
January 7, 2007
CREDIT CARD PROCESSING COMPANY REJECTS FIREARMS INDUSTRY
REFUSES TO PROCESS TRANSACTIONS . . . Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp. are refusing to process any credit card transactions between federally licensed firearms retailers, distributors and manufacturers -- a move which will severely limit available inventory of firearms and ammunition to military, law enforcement and law-abiding Americans.
The first company to be affected by this decision appears to be firearms distributor CDNN Sports Inc.
"We were contacted recently by First Data/Citi Merchant Services by a June Rivera-Mantilla stating that we were terminated and funds were being seized for selling firearms in a non-face-to-face transaction," said Charlie Crawford, president of CDNN Sports Inc. "Although perfectly legal, we were also informed that no transactions would be processed in the future, even for non-firearms. I find this very frightening."
To voice your concern to Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp., please contact June Rivera-Mantilla at 631-683-7734 or her supervisor Robert Tenenbaum at 631-683-6570.
 
The parties to this transaction are federally licensed firearms dealers and not individuals purchasing face to face.  My Internet business and now on site store requires a firm reputation to continue existence.  I cannot have your company dictate which legal products may be purchased through your data processing and then refuse all further data sales. 
 
I shall not, nor ever use your company's services if at all possible, unless your company's policy changes to one of total non interference with my legal business transactions without restriction. 
 
Sincerly,
Gregory T. Williams

[phalanx]

deltecs: Oh man ,you really messed up their day.
It seems the entire web is calling them out on this.
I have one of their cards ,and when i called they had a special voice mail for this.
So i just went out ,bought a gun ,and some ammo.
On their card.

[TexasMac]

The following is from the NSSF site.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First Data Confirms Anti-Gun Policy (1/9/08)

The following is an email request to NSSF from First Data Corp.:

We respectfully request that you remove the posting from your website regarding Citi Merchant Services and First Data Corp. As detailed below, the posting is inaccurate. Further, while we generally do not comment on individual merchant customers, we would like to briefly address the12/26 letter posted on your web site. Regretfully, that letter did a less than satisfactory job of expressing applicable policies. Those policies are more properly detailed below.

Citi Merchant Services and First Data do process firearms transactions. Our policy restrictions address only the sale of firearms in a non face-to-face environment. Non face-to-face transactions occur when a cardholder is not present in front of a merchant and includes mail order and online purchases. It is our policy not to service merchants that make non face-to-face sales in a number of industries, including firearms.

It is not the policy of Citi Merchant Services or First Data to refuse to process transactions from duly licensed merchants that sell firearms in face-to-face-transactions at the point of sale.

Please direct any questions to Questions@firstdata.com.

Sincerely,

First Data Corporation
==============================================

NSSF Responds to First Data Letter (1/10/08)

This is to confirm the National Shooting Sports Foundation’s receipt of your email response on behalf of First Data Corporation and Citi Merchant Services on Wednesday, January 9, 2008, concerning First Data and Citi Merchant’s unilateral decision to stop processing credit card transactions involving the lawful sale of firearms by law abiding, federally licensed, firearms distributors/retailers. Regrettably, your email serves to confirm the antigun corporate policy of First Data and Citi Merchant Services and that the article in our publication “Bullet Points,” and subsequent posting to our Website, was based on a correct and accurate understanding of that policy as articulated in the December 26, 2007, letter to Mr. Charlie Crawford at CDNN Sports Inc.

We had hoped to hear from First Data Corporation and Citi Merchant Services that this was not your corporate policy and that the letter was merely the ill-considered actions of a single employee.

Your antigun corporate policy is based on ignorance of the law applicable to the sale of firearms. It is perfectly legal, in fact commonplace, for a federal firearms licensee in one state to sell a firearm to a non-licensee (consumer) from another state. What you fail to appreciate is that the firearm is not shipped in interstate commerce directly to the consumer. Rather, as required by federal law, the firearm is shipped by the selling licensee to another federal firearms licensee in the state of residence of the consumer who is purchasing the firearm. The consumer acquires the firearm from that licensed dealer in a face-to-face transaction after completion of a Firearms Transaction Record, commonly referred to as an ATF Form 4473, and a federally mandated background check to ensure that the purchaser is legally permitted to buy the firearm.

Furthermore, the policy of First Data and Citi Merchant Services interferes with the receiving and shipping of inventory from and to federally licensed firearms retailers, distributors and manufacturers. This inventory supplies not only law-abiding Americans, but military and law enforcement agencies as well.

June Rivera Mantilla’s original correspondence contained so many errors that one could only deduce that it was an uniformed mistake that would consequently be corrected. Instead, we learned yesterday that First Data Corporation and Citi Merchant Services stands behind the policy, which affects not only firearms retailers, manufacturers and distributors, but also law enforcement agencies at the federal, state and local levels of government and law-abiding citizens.

NSSF will not remove its Web posting nor will we rescind or alter our story. However, if we receive written confirmation from you that, after having researched the law, First Data and Citi Merchant Services have changed their corporate policy, we will consider publishing that fact in a follow-up story.

Sincerely,
Jake McGuigan
Director of Government Relations

Ted Novin
Director of Public Affairs

[phalanx]

I called CITI ,and i asked them about this and if i could give an FFL my card Number , to buy a firearm that would be shipped to my FFL  ,where i would fill out the form to buy it .
They said no problem .
I asked them about the same thing , but i buy from a Manufacturer .
No Problem.



Does all of this just pertain to FFLs transferring guns ? or is this just an isolated incident ?

[deltecs]

I called CITI ,and i asked them about this and if i could give an FFL my card Number , to buy a firearm that would be shipped to my FFL  ,where i would fill out the form to buy it .
They said no problem .
I asked them about the same thing , but i buy from a Manufacturer .
No Problem.



Does all of this just pertain to FFLs transferring guns ? or is this just an isolated incident ?

The problem lies with using a data card reader in order for approval on credit card purchases.  This company contracts to businesses to access credit card accounts and get approval codes for purchases.  This company is in partnership or cooperation with Citi Group for the credit history.  It is not the credit card limiting the purchases, it is the data card reader company that accesses the consumers credit line.  This is why it is so important to prevent this type of business practice.  The data processing company could literally decide what purchases may be made using their data check sevices on any goods or products bought depending on its internal company policy or opinion.  Theoretically, the data processing medium and not the credit card companies itself, could without any legal violations restrict all goods and services passing through their machines that do not meet their standards.  It could limit cutlery, ammo components, sporting goods, and type of hunting accessory, or anything else it deems undesirable according to personal prejudice or opinions of the management.

[norman]

So what if I have a C&R license?  If I buy a pistol from say AIM Surplus and use their card would that be O.K.?  The gun would come direct to me.  Thank GOD I dont have their crappy card!