WHITE MOUNTAIN CARBINE PROBLEM

[O44]

I picked this gun up used and when you pull the trigger it only goes to the half cock position and doesn't hit the cap. If you yank the trigger EXTRA HARD, it might drop all the way but not always. I have taken the lock out of the stock and cleaned it  and inspected it for any obvious problems, but can't see any reason for the trouble. I know I can send it in but it's about 25.00 shipping and probably a couple weeks to get it back.(maybe). Any ideas would be appreciated.    CHRIS

[Double 30]

Sounds like the tumbler fly is missing.its a kite shaped piece of metal that allows the sear to pass over the 1/2 cock notch.The tumbler is machined to accept it and its recess is visable without disassembling the lock.If the fly is there I am puzzled that you'd have this problem.If its not there that will be the problem.

[30HERRETT]

Sounds to me like you are not putting it back together correct .Did it work when you bought it ? The trigger has to go in just so the timing is correct .
If that does not work just send the lock and trigger to TC , that can be mailed for about $4.60 USPS FLAT RATE .

[O44]

Te gun didn't work right when I brought it home. I didn't know to test for this problem before I paid for it. Didn't want to slam the hammer on the nipple. Is there any way to get a picture of the part that might be missing? Thank you for your responses. CHRIS

[captchee]

 The fly rides in a small indent  that’s cut in the tumbler . It looks like a small ear . If you take the lock off  and slowly bring the hammer back past ½ cock , it should fall down and interrupt the ½ cock .  The fly is very small , about  1/8 wide and just a little longer . Its easily lost if  your not careful. The previous owner could have had it fall out and never noticed .
  If your lock was built to carry a fly then it has to be there for  the lock to work correctly . A tumbler that doesn’t have a fly has a different geometry  as the ½ cock must set to a slightly lower plain so that the sear does not  catch the  ½ cock .

 You need to be careful with your problem as  what your saying is happening can damage  the sear and tumbler .
 Now if  the fly is there  when you trip the lock you will see the sear catch .
 If its catching on the  fly , this means you have a burr on the fly and most likely on the sear . . Carefully take a diamond stone and clean both  up  the parts have to be  smooth enough to slide across each other .
 Now as to dropping the hammer on your cap .
 This shouldn’t be done without a cap on the nipple or over time you will smash the nipple .

 Here is a trick I do .
 Go down and get you a  sink faucet washer . The little black ones that are domed .
 This will fit over your nipple and protect it . This works much better then a piece of leather as it will stay in place and not fill the nipple with leather that your  going to have to dig out

Again if you continue to drop the hammer with the lock catching on half cock you WILL  damage the lock

[tscott]

Ok ... I got another WMC question...! How do I adjust the trigger to take up slack from too much creep, and lower the pull?

[O44]

thanks for replies I will look as soon as I get back in town next week. I will let you know what i find..  THANKS

[captchee]

Ok ... I got another WMC question...! How do I adjust the trigger to take up slack from too much creep, and lower the pull?

 this depends on your lock  as well as the trigger set up .
 some single triggers if not inlet properly will have alot of creep . double sets can also have alot of creek if the trigger is set  to stiff .
some locks like many of the CVA and traditions have a  screw thats on the tumbler that will reduce the amount  of travel the sear has before the lock trips .
 others have triggers with springs that keep positive contact with the sear .
 still others have no such spring  thus letting the trigger creep before it even engages the sear arm .
 so to answer your question we need to know what set up you have .
 is this a production gun or custom , was it a kit  or professionaly built
 is it a single or double set  tigger

[tscott]

Single trigger production gun... Do I shim the lock lever where the trigger groove fits? Funny, I shot the gun today and it fired fine. Never been a flincher, so I didn't notice creep nor pull weight, it just bothers me off the range, so I'd do an easy fix. What would you suggest load wise with this 1:28 21" barrel?

[captchee]

 normally  on a production rifles that have creep  with single triggers  i find 3 real problems
1) the trigger doesn’t set to positive contact with the sear  IE there is play before  the trigger even comes in contact wit the trigger bar . A proper inlet trigger will only be just a  tad off the sear arm when  at  full cock . There should be no forward or back motion to the trigger  when at full cock and only a small amount at ½ .


2) the full cock notch is often cut very deep and at a slight back angle
 This angle causes not only  a heavy trigger but also a lot of creep . This is for IMO a legal issue  not because the tumbler needs cut this way .
 The deeper this  notch the  more creep  will be built into the lock . The more the full cock angles back the heavier the pull will be to fire the lock  .
What happens is that as you pull the trigger , you actually end up cocking the  hammer back just a little before the lock will fire .

3) I have yet to see one that was tuned  or  that could not benefit from a better tuning job

 Before I would go doing any shimming I would check for proper polishing of your parts .. The face of the full cock should be glass smooth as should the sear  where it rides  along the full cock notch as its being fired .
 While you at it , polish any place that  metal touches metal .
 IE the lock plate , back of the tumble . If it’s a bridled tumbler then also the near side and all faces of the tumbler . The seta both back an face , sear arm / trigger arm . This should also be polished where  it comes in contact with the trigger , don’t forget the trigger as well where it comes in contact with the sear .
Also  the inside of the spring and the spring hook where it rides to the tumbler .
 You polish all those areas up and you will not only lose a great amount of you creek but also speed up you lock considerably

[tscott]

Thanks, good tips... I have about 80 maxi balls and a lot of Pyrodex and 777 powder... I'm thinkin' 80 gr 777 to start!!! Green Mtn lists their 21" drop in barrels at 1:28, I'm thinking Powerbelt as well as they have shot best in the 1:28 barrels for me!