Green Mountain 32" 1-70 twist 58 cal

[Dillohide]

Had my 54 cal Renegade out for the first time in 12 years this weekend. Why you might ask? About 12 years ago had to get bi-focal glasses and found I was having a hard time sighting my open sight 30-30 so assumed the same with the Renegade. However, realized this weekend with the longer barrel and heavier front blade I could still put round balls in a 4 inch group at 100 yards. I've shot several deer with this thing using TC maxi-balls but prefer patched round balls. In the Texas heat have had the Maxi-Balls actually slide out of my barrel while hunting. Never tried their pre-lubed bullets, maybe they wouldn't slide out. Anyway, I'm ordering the Green Mountain 58 Cal drop in barrel and was wondering what a good  patched .570 round ball load would be. I use Pyrodex ffg so assume, like the 54 Cal a good round ball range load would be about 80g but what's a good heavier hunting load?

[StrawHat]

It depends on how much your shoulder can take!

Start at 80 and keep going up 5 or 10 grains at a time until the group size is unacceptable or your shoulder says enough.

I quit at 110 with a flintlock (36" Harper's Ferry)many years ago and have since lowered the charge to 90 grains.

If placed in the right spot your 80 grain load should be fine.

[Dillohide]

I don't mind recoil. My hunt load with the 54 cal was a 430 gr maxi-ball and 100 grains ... a pretty stout shoulder pusher. However I've never shot one with a twist specifically for a round ball so figured I could work the 1-70 twist up to 120 grains and see how much accuracy I loose.

[forest2]

With a .58 your not going to need a "good heavy hunting load".
 Accuracy is about all you'll need. The placement of the round will do just about anything you'll need to do with anything short of a charging "Grizzly".
 Find your preferred patch/lube/ball size combo then stay with it. As stated, work your powder charge up in 5 gr increments. If you have shoulder like you said,, you will find for your rifle and your prb combo an area of proper charge for the best accuracy for your gun.
 Placement man, Placement. If you can get 4" at 100 yrds, heck if you can get 6" at 100 if a 58 prb.

 Don't forsake break in,,read the archives YMHS.
 

[Dillohide]

Thanks guys. I was really excited to discover that the sight radius and big thick blades still allow me to shoot traditional. I'm also a little irritated with myself for giving up on them 12 years ago for scoped rifles.  At least I didn't sell the Renegade!  Can't wait to get that new barrel on the range

[coyotejoe]

You might also want to consider a rear peep sight. As our eyes age most of us have trouble with the open rear sight. You'd be amazed at how an aperture rear sight sharpens up the view of the front sight and target. For the first half of the twentieth century, before good and affordable scopes became available, most serious riflemen shot peeps. T/C makes one for the Renegade and the Lyman 57 with proper adaptor base makes a fine sight, though quite bulky. It has been demonstrated many times that a hunting peep with large aperture is both the fastest and most accurate iron sight. Colorado does not allow scopes on muzzleloaders so all of my ML hunting rifles wear peeps.

[Dillohide]

Yes love peep sights but that's where my problem started on the Winchester Model 94. I could see the target clearly through the Williams peep but the front blade was a blur. Add the glasses, sight through the bottom lens of the bifocals and the front blade is clear but the target is a blur. A no win deal so traded for a Marlin and a scope. However, the longer sight radius on most traditional muzzle loaders I now discover overcomes the problem even with a 28" barrel. The rear sight doesn't seem to be an issue but if it becomes one I'll add the peep sight.

[Dillohide]

Got the barrel yesterday. That's one thing I like about Midway, they are fast. Ordered it Sunday, got it Thursday. It's a perfect fit on the Renegade frame. Need to get the last stand and feeder off the deer lease Saturday (changing leases) so hope to start seasoning and sighting it in Sunday before the game.

[StrawHat]

Yes love peep sights but that's where my problem started on the Winchester Model 94. I could see the target clearly through the Williams peep but the front blade was a blur. Add the glasses, sight through the bottom lens of the bifocals and the front blade is clear but the target is a blur. A no win deal so traded for a Marlin and a scope. However, the longer sight radius on most traditional muzzle loaders I now discover overcomes the problem even with a 28" barrel. The rear sight doesn't seem to be an issue but if it becomes one I'll add the peep sight.

With open sights, you will never be able to get the rear sight, front sight and target in focus at the same time.  It has nothing to do with your age, physically, the eyes can not do it.

With an aperture sight, the smaller the aperture the longer the depth of field, so with a small enough aperture the front sight and target can be in focus but they will both be dark.

For target work, I use a smaller aperture but that is under controlled conditions.

For hunting, I unscrew the aperture and just use what's left. 

Then it is back to basics, focus on the front sight, line up on the target, breathe...

Good luck

Oh, I did find a neat aperture sight for muzzleloaders, on an original Ohio rifle.  Just a bent piece of iron with a hole in it!  Anchored to the barrel and extending over the wrist.  It also had a long screw through the piece that sat in a dimple in the tang to allow for elevation.

Haven't put one on the 1803 yet, but I might.

[Dillohide]

I've looked at the T/C Tang Peep Sight. The only problem I see is one frame, two barrels, unless taking the disk out would let you sight through the big ring to the rear sight of one barrel, like a ghost ring. Think that is possible?

[thumbcocker]

I have the t.c. tang peep on my renegade and I like it a lot. Also my renegade is a 58 cal. and I use 120 grs. of goex 2F with a .10 patch and a 570 roundball. Knocks 'em flat.

[Dillohide]

Got the new barrel to the range today using .570 round balls, T/C prelubed .18 ticking patches and Pyrodex. Centered it at 100 yards with 80 grain charges. It was spreading them a little in the new barrel. Got a tighter group at 90 grains and hit the sweet spot at 100 grains. Love this rifle!