Author Topic: 45 acp or Desert Eagle for deer? (Read 2835 times)

Bowhunter57 · « **on:** January 30, 2008, 01:41:18 AM »

I own/inherited a Desert Eagle in .357Mag. and am considering the purchase of a 45 acp long slide for deer hunting.
With considerations to shot placement, reasonable yardages, etc. which one would you prefer for deer hunting?

Your opinions and experiences are appreciated.
Thank you, Bowhunter57

Questor · « **Reply #1 on:** January 30, 2008, 03:02:00 AM »

The desert eagle. No contest.

Reed1911 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 30, 2008, 03:42:52 AM »

Desert Eagle

teddy12b · « **Reply #3 on:** January 30, 2008, 05:20:13 AM »

I used to have a D.E. in 44 mag. I had great confidence in my shooting with it. I carried it on several hunts, but never had a chance to take a deer with it. I ended up selling, but I still have a very high opinion of those handguns. Desert Eagles just shoot great and that's what I'd go with.

wyocarp · « **Reply #4 on:** January 30, 2008, 08:14:33 AM »

Buy a .44 barrel for the desert eagle. It shoots really well in .44.

teddy12b · « **Reply #5 on:** January 30, 2008, 08:56:31 AM »

Barrels for that gun aren't cheap and you also have to get other new parts as well. For the cost of switching parts you could buy a brand new Smith or Ruger in that caliber.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #6 on:** January 30, 2008, 02:01:11 PM »

Quote from: teddy12b

Barrels for that gun aren't cheap and you also have to get other new parts as well. For the cost of switching parts you could buy a brand new Smith or Ruger in that caliber.

teddy12b,
You said nothing wrong there, brother! I sent an e-mail to Magnum Research, a while back, to find out what it would cost to make the conversion. Well, this handgun was purchased in 1991 for $750 and now it retails for $1199. The conversion kit for .44Mag. is $750.

I've fired less than a dozen rounds through this Desert Eagle and it handles very well. There's a local gun show this weekend, so I think I'll purchase some reloading dies in .357 Mag. and see what this handgun will do with some quality reloads.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

wyocarp · « **Reply #7 on:** January 30, 2008, 02:20:45 PM »

Bowhunter57, I have several of the desert eagle pistols and do switch the barrels although not a bunch. The only thing needed even to go to the 50ae is a barrel and the magazine. I would have never started buying them but my son pressured me. I enjoy shooting them and am considering buying a 10" barrel.

Mikey · « **Reply #8 on:** January 30, 2008, 03:44:37 PM »

The Desert Eagle in 357 is the better choice for whitetail. I would be interested to hear about velocities and accuracy with different loads from the closed chamber of the Eagle and what your final choice of load is. Mikey.

teddy12b · « **Reply #9 on:** January 30, 2008, 04:37:13 PM »

If you're lucky you can find a 14" barrel in 357mag. They used to have them in 44mag, but now they are extremely rare. My 44mag that I had felt like there was no recoil due to the weight and two recoil rods that have two springs on each one.

One of the best shots of my life was with my old desert eagle 44. My brother in law and I had stuck a 4x4 piece of wood through the ice in a pond as a target and when we got back on shore he bet me five bucks I couldn't hit it. Well, I fired one shot and splinters flew everywhere. I didn't collect the $5 because I didn't think I could repeat the shot, bragging rights were worth more than $5.

Desert eagle are awesome but they come at a price. Not only barrel, magazine, but also the bolt have to be changed when switching calibers. You have an awesome gun!

Ken ONeill · « **Reply #10 on:** January 31, 2008, 02:05:01 AM »

Add still one more in favor of the .357 DE rather than the 1911 longslide .45 ACP. However, with the proper JHP, the .45 will work. Since you're "thinking of buying a longslide" anyway, though, I would personally look at a .41 Mag. or .44 Mag. revolver purchase or a Contender in one of many calibers that are even more versatile for hunting.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 01, 2008, 02:24:02 PM »

Many thanks to all that have replied!

I'm going to purchase some reloading dies, brass, etc. and check out this handgun's accuracy capabilities.
Meanwhile, I'm going to look into a 10" barrel in .357 Mag. and/or a .44 Mag. conversion....if I can find it reasonably priced.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

Cheesehead · « **Reply #12 on:** February 01, 2008, 02:48:05 PM »

Bowhunter57,

I suspect that you are a practiced and accomplished bow hunter. Using bow hunting skills and tactics, a long slide 45 acp would work for deer, in bow hunting ranges. I have a Springfield V16 longslide and have considered using it deer hunting, just have not done it yet. I have used it to dispatch downed deer at close range and it works well.

Cheese

countryrebel · « **Reply #13 on:** February 02, 2008, 09:06:14 AM »

45acp worked ok for me but I wished I had got the 10mm instead.So I ended up buying a glock 20,pulls double duty for hunting and hiking.

navylawdog · « **Reply #14 on:** February 03, 2008, 09:44:16 AM »

It might be possible to get the .460 rowland conversion for the .45 and then you would have a sweet hunting round for your .45. Plus it wouldn't be like trying to lift a brick everytime you want to shoot it.

Navylawdog

http://www.clarkcustomguns.com/rowland.htm

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #15 on:** February 03, 2008, 10:38:17 AM »

357 Mag. 158 grain JSP would do well.
In changing out the gun to 44 the slide is so massive that it takes a lot of energy to cycle the thing and it looses about 10% in speed out of the same barrel as a revolver.
I would go with the 50 AE if the older frame is able to be modified. I know with the new frames all you have to do is change the barrel and the mag to go from 44 to 50. They share the same size rim.
Other than that I would look at the shops for a used S&W 44 or Ruger in 44 or 45 colt. You can load the colt to mag specs in the Ruger guns.
Another option is to get the 45 long slide and order a 400 corbon barrel for it. Basically a 41 mag in an auto.
Good luck.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 03, 2008, 04:37:35 PM »

navylawdog and mcwoodduck,
I'll check out the .460 rowland and 400 corbon, respectively and see what the overall cost would be to invest in one.
There's no such thing as too many guns.

I've owned several revolvers and have nothing against them, but now I want to enjoy some semi-auto loaders.

I was at a local gun show yesterday and today, purchasing some reloading accessories for this .357 Mag. and will get started as soon as I can. A carbon 3 die set, 100 Remington 158gr. JHPs, a pound of 2400 powder, 1000 CCI Small Pistol Magnum primers and a couple of Case-Card 50rd. plastic ammo boxes. I'll have to post my results...both at the range and the loads that worked.

Again, many thanks!
Good hunting, Bowhunter57

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 03, 2008, 05:32:23 PM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck

Another option is to get the 45 long slide and order a 400 Corbon barrel for it. Basically a 41 mag in an auto.

mcwoodduck,
After reading an article about the 400 Corbon, I'll pass. It would be much easier to just purchase a 10mm. If I already owned a 45acp, it wouldn't be as expensive.
One sentence from this article reads: "I personally know a few 10mm fans who don't like the 400 Corbon because the 10mm can do everything the new 400 Corbon can do."
www.recguns.com/Sources/IVG12.html
It was a good thought!

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #18 on:** February 04, 2008, 05:35:29 AM »

You can't hurt my feelings on he 400 corbon. I don't own one but it was an option to boost the speed of a 45 ACP with a round that is easy: to make, get components, and just requires a barrel swap to go from 45 to 400. And yes it is a 10mm in a different case.

curtism1234 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 04, 2008, 10:17:56 AM »

I'm reading a lot on here about using 45lc at 900-1100 fps for deer.

Now all of a sudden no one mentions the same loads in the acp.

One can not be adequate and the other not.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 04, 2008, 11:03:59 AM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck

You can't hurt my feelings on he 400 corbon.

mcwoodduck,
I'm glad to hear that, as it was not my intent to hurt your feelings.

It's just not a good idea for ME, because I don't already own a 45acp. However, if I already owned a 45acp, it would be a excellent consideration and very affordable too.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #21 on:** February 04, 2008, 02:57:21 PM »

Curtis,
I think the main difference in the two is the bullet style and weight. Also I have read lately that many of the writers are toting copies of the saddle carbine and using them to hunt deer in 45 Colt or 44-40. The added barrel length adds speed.
But back to your original question.
If both loads are equal in every way then sure it would be a great deer round for short ranges.
I suspect that the Long Colt was throwing a heavier bullet that can not be seated in the short ACP case and still function in auto loaders.
My thinking is they are talking about a 250 grain or larger bullet. 20 added or more grains and 100 to 150 FPS makes a huge difference in Horse power.
At short to medium handgun ranges I think any of the 230 grain JHP loads out of an ACP would drop a deer.
I have a 44 mag with a 6 inch tube and carry anything from 180 grain to 240 depending on where and what I'm hunting. I would not use the 44 Specials that are the same in speed and weight as most 45 acp rounds.
Personally If I were going to hunt with an auto loader I would want a 10mm over a 45ACP. The 10mm is almost equal to the 41 mag that is a fine deer ctg. Grab a ballistics table and you will be surprised at what the numbers show in added speed or added weight.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #22 on:** February 04, 2008, 04:20:17 PM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck

Personally If I were going to hunt with an auto loader I would want a 10mm over a 45ACP. The 10mm is almost equal to the 41 mag that is a fine deer ctg. Grab a ballistics table and you will be surprised at what the numbers show in added speed or added weight.

mcwoodduck,
I agree 100% and I've considered purchasing a 10mm too, but finding one that doesn't cost a young fortune is difficult.
EAA makes a good one, but the standard barrel is only 4.5" and this state, Ohio, requires a 5" barrel minimum. However, EAA makes a match grade barrel that's 6"...for a small fee.

Springfield Armory makes a nice one too.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

Mikey · « **Reply #23 on:** February 04, 2008, 04:41:21 PM »

Curtism1234: The reason you don't hear about that particular load in the 45 acp is most likely due to the weight of the bullet. You stretch the capability of the acp round to perform at that level. You can get a 230 gn acp slug to about 950 - 960'/sec, but that's on the short side of 250 - 255 gns at 900 - 1000'/sec.

Mcwoodduck: the 400 Cor-Bon is a not a viable field option. Its sole claim to fame is the velocity but it can only attain that with lightweight bullets. It is too high pressure a round to load heavier and I haven't yet ever heard anyone speak to it as a basis for target work. The field effect of the 10mm bore is found in the heavier weight bullets the 10mm cartridge can put out. The author of the statement "I personally know a few 10mm fans who don't like the 400 Corbon because the 10mm can do everything the new 400 Corbon can do' is right - the 10mm so far outpowers the cor-bon round the only comparison is bore diameter.

Bowhunter57: now that you have it, have a ball. Keep us pposted on your accuracy findings. Mikey.

navylawdog · « **Reply #24 on:** February 05, 2008, 02:49:31 PM »

mcwoodduck,
I agree 100% and I've considered purchasing a 10mm too, but finding one that doesn't cost a young fortune is difficult.
EAA makes a good one, but the standard barrel is only 4.5" and this state, Ohio, requires a 5" barrel minimum. However, EAA makes a match grade barrel that's 6"...for a small fee.

Kimber makes a nice one too.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57
[/quote]

Is that the witness that comes in 10mm?

navylawdog

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 06, 2008, 01:12:11 AM »

Quote from: navylawdog

Is that the witness that comes in 10mm?
navylawdog

navylawdog,
Yes, the EAA Witness comes in 10mm. It's also available in 9mm, 45acp, 380super and 40S&W.
Their match grade barrel for the 10mm, is 6" and is $185.
www.eaacorp.com

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

navylawdog · « **Reply #26 on:** February 06, 2008, 01:16:51 PM »

Quote from: Bowhunter57 on February 06, 2008, 01:12:11 AM

Quote from: navylawdog
Is that the witness that comes in 10mm?
navylawdog
navylawdog,
Yes, the EAA Witness comes in 10mm. It's also available in 9mm, 45acp, 380super and 40S&W.
Their match grade barrel for the 10mm, is 6" and is $185.
www.eaacorp.com

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

Thanks for the info Bowhunter57. I figured that was the model you were referring to but wasn't too sure. I have never shot one and I have only seen one a couple of times. The only reason it rang a bell was because I remembered my late uncle saying that he had wanted a 10mm and wanted an EAA Witness.

Navylawdog

nilescoyote · « **Reply #27 on:** February 06, 2008, 10:55:53 PM »

If you don't mind the heavy trigger and the extra weight of the Desert Eagle, go with that. I have a 44mag that I used to hunt with before going to the encore and contenders. I was shooting 200 grain xtp reloads powered by win 296 at around the mid 1600 fps. Took two deer with that set up. When scoped, shooting across sand bags at 100 yards it would hold under 3inch groups. As to it losing more velocity over a revolver, that is simple not true. The gas port is a good 5 inches down the barrel and so small you will have a hard time evening seeing it. Plus the polygonal rifling in the desert eagle will give you a boost over cut rifling in most other handguns. I have the 10 inch barrel on the Desert Eagle and a 10 inch on a contender. Shooting the same load in each the Desert Eagle is about 50-75 FPS faster than the contender.

Just remember not to use lead bullets in the desert eagle as it will negatively effect the gas port by slowly plugging it up with lead. Jacketed ammo only. For deer use a good soft point or hollow point with 140 grain being the lightest I would go with 158 or 180 being my first choice. With that set up you should be go to go out to 75-100 yards if you pick your shots and spend so time practicing. Where as I would be hesitant to shoot a 45 acp much beyond 25 yards.

Bowhunter57 · « **Reply #28 on:** February 07, 2008, 12:43:37 PM »

nilescoyote,
I've read, researched, etc. many handguns (mostly pistols) and for what I intend to use it for I believe that I'm better off to reload for this Desert Eagle. The price tags for most of the 45acp or 10mm are "over the rainbow" and by the time I installed a 6" match barrel or purchased a long slide version of whatever brand of pistol....I could purchase a conversion kit for the DE in .44 Mag.

From what I've read on Magnum Research's forum, the DEs favor heavy loads and jacketed bullets, which is fine with me. I've purchased all the reloading stuff I need to make this handgun perform as it was designed, so all I need to do is get it together and go shooting.

I'll have to post some pics of the groupings.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

nilescoyote · « **Reply #29 on:** February 07, 2008, 09:19:21 PM »

I have both the 6 inch that came with the pistol and bought a 10 inch just for hunting. Both shoot well but I prefer the 10 inch for hunting and the extra velocity it yields. I have found that mine does prefer heavy loads. If you try a light load the gun will not cycle properly. My load is a 200 grain XTP hornady bullet with 296 or H110 powder @ 27.5 grains. I may have been a little Conservative on FPS, Im looking at my load data and its indicating 1700 fps for min load of 27.5 and 1800 fps for max load 28.5 grain. I crono'ed my load but have forgotten what it was. This load shoots VERY flat out to 100 yards and turned organs into jello on both deer I have taken with it. Even though it is a light bullet it will penetrate deep and keep most of its weight. I think my recovered weight on one was around 185-190 grain range (quartering away shot). The other was a pass through (broadside shot). I zeroed my scope for 75 yards and at 50 it was only a couple inches high and at 100 a couple inches low.

With a 357 you should be able to see 1400 fps with a 180 grain or very near 1600 fps with a 158 using H110 or Lil'gun. Set your over all loaded cartridge length to as long as the magazine will allow for the best accuracy.

Good luck and cant wait to see those posted groups!