Author Topic: Tang sight question--need help (Read 1778 times)

Gapmaster · « **on:** February 04, 2008, 06:22:13 PM »

I have a EMF Hartford 1892 stainless heavy barrel lever action in .357 Magnum. I want to install a tang sight. I would like to buy one that already fits and needs no drilling and tapping---if I can.

1.. Which one can I buy that will fit the gun?

2. If I can't get one that fits and I have to drill and tap, which one do I have to get.

3. Do I need to change the front site post---I don't want to if I don't have to.

I need some direction please.

Thanks, Gapmaster

Castaway · « **Reply #1 on:** February 05, 2008, 12:46:25 AM »

I'm not aware of any that don't require drilling and tapping the receiver. See post below about lever action tang sights for more information.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 05, 2008, 04:15:56 AM »

Receiver side peep sights are the sights that generally require the side of the receiver to be D/T'd, while tang sights use a longer than issue tang/stock screw to secure the ear of the tang sight base to the upper tang and also need a smaller screw to secure the front of the sight base.

That said, consider a couple of things:

1) A .357 doesn't generate as much recoil as larger cartridges.

2) The upper tang surface isn't flat - it has a slight curvature, side to side.

3) The bases for the Marbles and/or Lyman tang sight, fitting your gun, are also not flat - having a slight side to side curvature in their underside, too.

4) The tang screw, alone, will securely hold the tang peep in place - if it's tightened properly, and kept tight.

5) If there's any problem with (4), after shooting, then you can always have one hole D/T'd in the tang for the forward screw. I would, however, recommend the forward screw added in any M92, since the vertical body of the tang sight for that gun sits on the forward part of it's base, giving it too much leverage on a single(tang) screw attachment.

MidwayUSA carries both tang sights. The Mable's is click adjustable for w&e, while the Lyman must be shimmed to adjust windage - which is why the Marble's is more expensive.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=114804&t=11082005

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=546951&t=11082005

jimster · « **Reply #3 on:** February 05, 2008, 06:40:35 AM »

I have an EMF Hartford 1892 with the heavy oct...it's already drilled and tapped. If you see a small plug screw in the tang, that would be it.
When you buy a tang sight it should have a longer tang screw that comes with it, plus a screw that would go in place of that little plug screw.
As far as I know, the EMF Hartford is already for the tang sight, you just have to find one that is compatible with your rifle.
Not sure about the carbines, never saw one up close.
I'm looking to get a tang sight for mine as well.

Jim

jimster · « **Reply #4 on:** February 05, 2008, 06:49:02 AM »

Gapmaster. some added info here....

http://stevesgunz.com/index.htm

If you call this guy up he can tell you about front sight height also.....and he also sells a tang sight there for the EMF, although I don't know what brand it is.
Nice guy, he'll help you out. As I remember from talking to him a long while back, the .357 has much less problems with front sight height than the .45's do...
depending on how you load the .45.

Maybe give Steve a call and ask him some questions, he works on 92's exclusivley.

Jim

Rangr44 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 05, 2008, 02:38:53 PM »

FYI - There's no need to change out a front sight for height with a tang sight, as is usually needed with a receiver peep - just remove the rear barrel sight and fill the dovetail slot with a filler blank.

If you want to keep the barrel sight, switch it to a folding leaf of the same height as the issue rear & sight it in for short range. The tang sight can then be sighted-in for a longer range, and used after folding down the barrel sight - all with the issue height front sight blade.

Gapmaster · « **Reply #6 on:** February 07, 2008, 06:56:33 PM »

Thank you all very much. This was some great info. from everyone. I sent Steve an e-mail asking the question and all he told me was he sells a rear tang site (didn't mention what brand) and gave me the price for the sight and install.

Ranger44--those links you sent me. I have a question. Will that Marble 1892 fit my rifle. I'm still a little in the dark about if all 1892 sights will fit my 1892. I see 1892 tang sights for Browning, Rossi's and Winchesters?

If it will fit that's the one I will buy.

Thanks, Don

jimster · « **Reply #7 on:** February 08, 2008, 06:23:00 AM »

Gapmaster, if I may...your EMF Hartford model is a Rossi, it's just imported by EMF, with some different things that EMF wants, like maybe different sights, different
stain or grade wood, different finish...EMF has their own deal going with Rossi so to speak.
If you look at the Marbles tang sights (I'm looking at them also) they will say they fit a rossi 92....that should fit your rifle as well.
somewhere on your rifle it says made in Brazil....I forget, maybe it's under the lever on the bottom of the tang...that's where all Rossi's are made.
I plan on actually calling up Marbles maybe this weekend and asking a few questions before hand, I also plan on calling Steve Young up asking him
what brand he has just so I know. I sent me his card when I ordered a plug to go in place of the safety on the bolt, so somewhere, I have his phone number.
If I order one from Steve, I'll install it myself, so maybe that will lower the price a wee bit.

Hope this helps some.

Jim

Gapmaster · « **Reply #8 on:** February 09, 2008, 02:53:14 PM »

Jimster, were you able to get a hold Marbles? Thought I would check in with you to see what info they gave you. Thanks, Gapmaster

jimster · « **Reply #9 on:** February 10, 2008, 10:33:34 AM »

No, I just haven't got to it, got busy this weekend and before I knew it, it was Saturday evening. I'm going to try to call there from work Monday. The weather here in Michigan is
not cooperating this weekend by the way, it's REAL cold outside.
from what I gather though, they have specific models for our lever actions, shape of the base and the screw sets that come with them.

http://www.marblearms.com/sights/specs/peep.html

So I'm thinking according to the link above we would order accordingly...."Rossi 1892" I see in this list. I'm almost certain these are for the EMF/Hartford models, but I would like
to call them up and chat with them to make sure.

I'll back after Monday and post what I find out...and maybe there is someone out there that has purchased the Marbles tang sight that can chime in also.

Jim

Rangr44 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 10, 2008, 02:25:06 PM »

[I'm still a little in the dark about if all 1892 sights will fit my 1892. I see 1892 tang sights for Browning, Rossi's and Winchesters?]

The Model 92 lever action rifle was designed by John Browning, licensed to Winchester (who also made variation's called the Model 53 & 65), later made by Miroku (Japan) as both Brownings and Winchesters, and also copied (after the patents ran out) by other companies like Rossi & Uberti - which are imported under all sorts of importer's brand names like "Puma" and other names.

It all doesn't make any difference - a Model 92 is a Model 92 is a Model 92, ad infinitum (including Model 53/65's).

What does make a difference, is that early Rossi-manufactured Model 92's were made with non-standard width barrel sight female dovetails (read: larger than "standard"), and the standard front and rear barrel sights won't fit that particular variety properly.

The tangs of all Model 92's & 53/65's are all of identical shape/length, less markings - except that some may have been already factory D/T'd for a tang peep sight, but most will need a forward hole D/T'd for the tang sight's forward base screw.

One (same) height tang sight fits Winchester M-55's, M-64's, M-94's and all Model 92's (& M-53/65's, which have the same receiver as M-92's)

jimster · « **Reply #11 on:** February 11, 2008, 02:50:07 AM »

Well, I did call Marbles...and was directed to Brownells for technical questions....anyways....for the EMF/Hartford rifles which are already
drilled and tapped for the front hole...the sights for the "Rossi 1892" should do it, like the chart says. I notice Marble's has a lot of places that sell their sights,
but the prices all seem pretty close.
Doesn't appear like you can buy directly from Marbles, and they give a huge list of who sells their sights.

Guess that's about it....except for coughing up some cash for one....I just got done buying a Lyman 66 peep for a pre64 Winchester...that was not so cheap either.
It costs a lot of money for me to look through a darn hole....but I just can't use the buck horn sights as well anymore at this age.

Gapmaster · « **Reply #12 on:** February 12, 2008, 05:44:34 PM »

Ya jimster, my eyes are pretty gone also.

It looks like I will have to drill and tap mine. There are 2 screws on the tang behind the hammer. The one right behind the hammer is a small screw, and the one further back is bigger. I do not see anything plugged. I did look under the lever and it says "A. Rossi S.A.--Made in Brazil". So I guess I would use the same tang site as you. A Marbles 1892 tang sight for a Rossi.

Hmmm, I'm kinda brave enough to give it a try, but I would sure hate to screw something up. I see there is an installation video on the Marbles web site. Looks easy enough.

Thanks for all the help in the matter jimster. I hope you do well with yours. Now I have to come up with the money also.

Don

jimster · « **Reply #13 on:** February 13, 2008, 03:24:18 PM »

Gapmaster, the small screw behind the hammer is your plug screw, the larger one is the tang screw. when you get your sight, it comes with two screws, one will go in place of your little screw behind the hammer, and you'll get a different large screw, it will be longer, to go all the way through your tang sight and the tang. That little screw behind the hammer is where they drilled and tapped it already. That screw is not holding anything together, it's just there because it looks better than having a hole in your tang after the drilled and tapped it. The 92's that are not drilled and tapped does not have that little screw that is on your tang behind the hammer. Just for kicks, get a screw driver that fits that little screw behind your hammer and back it out...you'll see it's not holding anything together. It's just sitting there waiting for you to order a tang sight...LOL!!

All you need to do is buy the sight, it will come with the proper screws. Rangr44 is right about the tangs on 92's all being the same, except for some are not drilled and tapped like your is.
Marble's probably list all those different models so people with all different models will order something. So you might as well just order the one for Rossi 1892, and you will get the two screws that will work in your Emf/Hartford.

Gapmaster · « **Reply #14 on:** February 13, 2008, 07:12:50 PM »

That darn thing probably is just setting there waiting for me to buy it a sight. ha ha ha ha

I will take the screw out tomorrow and take a look. I'm sure glad you straightened that out for me. I might have been drilling for no reason.

And if they send the right screws with the sight, that makes it all very easy. Why was I getting so worked up over this?

I feel kinda dim wited now

Thanks, I'll let you know what I find.

Don

Rangr44 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 14, 2008, 01:08:53 PM »

PHEW ! Another crisis averted !

Now I can take my nap.

FourBee · « **Reply #16 on:** February 14, 2008, 05:01:48 PM »

To Rangr44 and jimster:

Thanks for all your input on this subject. I've been looking into that with some interest myself. My '92' is a PUMA brand. I just had to check for the plug behind the hammer. Not there on this one.

Rangr wrote: "One (same) height tang sight fits Winchester M-55's, M-64's, M-94's and all Model 92's (& M-53/65's, which have the same receiver as M-92's) "

That bit of knowledge settles a lot of questions. Thanks again.

FourBee

Gapmaster · « **Reply #17 on:** February 14, 2008, 05:27:29 PM »

Yup, I pulled the rear screw---it's a plug alright---duh !!! (Please don't tell my wife or friends)

Kelley · « **Reply #18 on:** April 01, 2008, 12:53:50 PM »

Thank-you folks, I have been pondering these questions for a while. I have one LSI 45, which is drilled, and one 357 which is not, "NOW" I know what to do.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #19 on:** April 02, 2008, 02:27:33 AM »

Now - If you really want a curve ball thrown at ya - How about going "Creedmore" , where a vernier tang peep sight is inletted & screwed to the top of the rearmost part of the buttstock for shooting from a laid-back position ?