Author Topic: Range report and question: 243 WIN (Read 1362 times)

Jal5 · « **on:** February 17, 2008, 08:14:46 AM »

I am having trouble getting reasonable accuracy from my Handi 243 WIN standard barrel contour, wood stocks, Bushnell Trophy 3-9X40, accushot deluxe Hi rings. This was a new gun, I have fired about 60 rounds, and followed the break in directions in the FAQ including polishing the bore.

My previous range trips were zeroing it at 25 and shooting it at 50yds: about 1.5 in. group, didn't shoot at 100yds at that time. I changed out the scope to the 3-9x40 Bushnell, used to have a 2-7x32 Nikon on it, but wanted more magnification for 100+yds shooting.

Two recent trips to the range:
trip #1 shot Federal Power Shoks, 100gr loads, 2 shots almost touching at 25yds, but at 100yds literally shot all over the paper. There was a strong gusty variable wind that day.
trip #2 brought the Federal 100s, Fusion 95 gr, and Federal PShoks 80 gr. No wind at all , sunny day.
I tried 100gr. Fed PShoks again, 4 shots but they were all over the target.

This is the best picture I could take of the target where I used Fusion 95gr and Fed PShoks 80 gr, 110 yds from the bench using a pretty solid bag under the forearm. Prior range trips also used this bag set up.

Shots 1-3 were 95gr. Fusions all below the circle on lower edge of the white paper, one below off paper and to the right. Shots 4-5 were the PShoks 80 gr but they were way above and below the white paper. Went back to the 95 gr Fusions for shots 6-10. #6 was the lower right of the white paper, I adjusted up 8 clicks (1 click=1/4"). #7-9 were about 3" apart along the edge of the circle target with 7&9 inside the target. I adjusted Left 4 clicks and shot #10 on the white paper directly above the bull, 3.5" up from dead center. The circle target is a ShootnSee 5.5" target.

For this #2 trip to the range I did put a rubber o-ring on the barrel stud.

I may not be the greatest marksman in the world, but I know I can get this rifle to shoot better! My question is where do I start to check things or improve things? I have already double checked all screws on the mount set up. I thought about changing the scope to another Nikon 3-9x40 that I have but don't want to do that yet. What should I try first in a process of elimination? I thought about trying some other ammo too but shouldn't I be getting better groups even with ammo the rifle doesn't like too well?

Sorry for the long post, thanks as always.

Joe

millwright · « **Reply #1 on:** February 17, 2008, 08:25:41 AM »

First, bag under just in front of trigger guard, not under front stock. You have already tried the o ring, so leave it there. Find some weather stripping with the adhesive backing, about 3/8 to 1/2 inch wide. Place a small piece under the barrel at the front of the forestock. If it doesn't touch the barrel add another piece. This should make a difference.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** February 17, 2008, 08:31:54 AM »

How bout the basics Joe? http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,116451.msg1098375514.html#msg1098375514

When you changed scopes, did you remount the base? Make sure the screws aren't too long and you remove all of the thread locker to the bottom of the hole so they don't bottom out on it, you should see shiny metal at the bottom of each mount hole, see FAQs for more detail.

I'd check the crown, see it it looks buggered.

Contact H&R and ask for it to be returned on their dime since you've done all you can, it may have a bad barrel/chamber/bore, it happens.

Tim

aldar · « **Reply #3 on:** February 17, 2008, 08:39:42 AM »

your experience with the .243 is exactly the same as mine. I did all the tweaking hints in FAQ section and even shot with the forearm off. I went from 8" groups down to 6" groups at 100yds. with real erratic consistency. I could get 2 shots inside of 2" and the third might be 6" or more off. Finally had enough and sent it back for repairs.

Redford Bohica · « **Reply #4 on:** February 17, 2008, 09:36:28 AM »

I had an Ultra in .243 that also sprayed its shots all over the place; 8-inch group sizes at 100 yards were the norm. This was with handloads using Speer 80 gr. bullets and Hornady 87 gr. bullets. Remington 100 gr. factory ammo also turned in the same results. However, when I switched to Sierra 60 gr. bullets in handloads, the darn thing would then group inside of a nickel at 100 yards!

Jal5 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 17, 2008, 11:37:15 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on February 17, 2008, 08:31:54 AM

How bout the basics?
When you changed scopes, did you remount the base? Make sure the screws aren't too long and you remove all of the thread locker to the bottom of the hole so they don't bottom out on it, you should see shiny metal at the bottom of each mount hole, see FAQs for more detail.

I'd check the crown, see it it looks buggered.

tim I try to follow those basic points about positioning the bag on the forend, and following through on the trigger pull, etc. I did not remount the base when I changed scopes since I did that when I put the first scope on it and didn't think I had to redo it...how important is that? the crown looks fine. There is one loose screw on the plastic spacer at the end of the forearm, I just noticed that like the hole in the wood is not grabbing the screw...would that be a factor in accuracy? One of the other guys mentioned handloading but I will be using factory ammo- I suppose I could try something by Remington, but I have tried 3 different grains and different manufacturers so far with nothing consistent.

Do you think it is worth it to try another scope?

Joe

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** February 17, 2008, 12:18:31 PM »

If you remounted the base before and made sure the screws weren't bottomed out, it should be ok if you used thread locker, but it sure sounds like something is loose, base, rings or scope internals.

Did you shoot it without the forend on? That right there will tell you if the forend is the culprit, if the forend fits tight, one loose screw could make it cock to one side a bit.

There's a fix in the FAQs for loose screws on butt pads that would work for the spacer, just be sure to use a release agent on the screw and spacer.

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,122550.msg1098420963.html#msg1098420963

Swapping to a known good scope would eliminate it as an issue.

Smoke the latch shelf according to the barrel fitting info and see how it looks.

Good luck,

Tim

Jal5 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 17, 2008, 04:03:30 PM »

I am sure the base is ok and I did use thread locker, unless those screws are too long that came with the 5 slot base...but I did follow all the tips in the FAQS regarding the base. Forend locks up good, and I never shot it without it on, I suppose that is the next easiest thing I could try. Then I will try the tip you mentioned to fix the screw hole maybe I will get lucky and that will be the culprit...if all else fails I will swap the scope again since that one is second hand I don't know how well taken care of it was by the original owner.

Probably won't get to try it again for several weeks, between other obligations and the poor weather here!

Will keep ya posted- thanks!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** February 17, 2008, 04:10:47 PM »

Something you can do in the mean time, remove the forend and see if the action is still tight when closed, sometimes the forend can hide a poor fit/loose barrel.

Tim

snapcrackpop · « **Reply #9 on:** February 18, 2008, 12:14:09 PM »

For those of you that sent the barrel back, did you have luck the 2nd time around?

I'm playing around with hand loads too. So far 3 out of a 5 shot are 1", but 2 "fliers"...... is the best I can do.

Jal5 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 18, 2008, 02:27:18 PM »

I checked the barrel for lockup without the forend on and its a tight fit. So my next move will be to shoot it without the forend on and see what's what. Let you know later.

Jal5 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 18, 2008, 12:30:56 PM »

I know this is a REALLY old thread but I wanted to let you guys know how my problem was resolved. I haven't had much time this year to use this rifle, but recently began working with it again: new scope, blue loctite on all the rings screws. I think it was the ring screws loosening up that was giving me fits. Today 1st range session using Federal Power Shok 100 gr SP I had the most decent groups I have seen yet: at 50 yds first 2 were low, I settled myself down a bit and then shot a group of 3 one inch left of the bull, 1.17 " which I thought was pretty good. I had only one shot left and moved the target to 100 yds and that 6th shot was almost exactly 2" directly above the group of 3.
I liked the new scope much better too- Nikon Prostaff 32- 3x9 variable. I think I will work up a batch of handloads and see what I can do with those. Thanks.
Joe

TribReady · « **Reply #12 on:** December 18, 2008, 12:38:12 PM »

It is a long time since you started with this, but keep us posted.
We can learn also as you work thru this.

Troyboy · « **Reply #13 on:** December 18, 2008, 12:42:00 PM »

I was gonna suggest getting some good rings.

Slufoot · « **Reply #14 on:** December 18, 2008, 02:07:01 PM »

Thanks for the update Jal5, keep us posted when you get to the range again.

GOOD SHOOTING!
Slufoot

Jal5 · « **Reply #15 on:** December 19, 2008, 05:40:15 AM »

It was a long time since I started with this problem but other responsibilities and stuff just kept getting in the way! If we were allowed to use the 243 during Ohio's hunting season I would have resolved it much sooner. I hope in the New Year to have a lot more time for shooting in general. thanks for all the encouragement.

Joe

casterbuster · « **Reply #16 on:** December 19, 2008, 10:08:35 AM »

I have never been able to get even a remotely good group out of my .243, it now sits in the back of the gun cabinet. It's a shame to it has the green camo monte carlo laminate stock. 22" heavy barrel, i put about two boxes down range and finally gave up. I tried the oring and checked everything on my optics and still couldn't get it to shoot. I wouldn't even feel right trading or selling this long range shotgun to anybody.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #17 on:** December 19, 2008, 10:47:58 AM »

There's no excuse for having an H&R rifle that won't shoot 2" groups or better at 100yds, either you haven't used the right ammo or handload, or there's something wrong with it, H&R's standard is 2" or less 3-shot groups at 100yds with factory ammo. If you can't get it to shoot using the Handi Basics 101 and the accurizing help in the FAQs, contact them and make arrangements to send it in for repair.

Tim

casterbuster · « **Reply #18 on:** December 19, 2008, 02:15:10 PM »

I don't reload every thing I tried down the barrel was factory and nothing was even close to 4" group at 100. It's been about two years since I have even had it out the cabinet, maybe it's time to bring it out and try again. Will see what happens.

snapcrackpop · « **Reply #19 on:** December 20, 2008, 05:07:20 AM »

My best groups are with the 100gr Federal PowerShocks (blue box) also.
Took my first antelope this year in MT with the Handy 243.

Handloads, Winchester, and other Federals and 80grs just wouldn't work.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #20 on:** December 20, 2008, 05:27:46 AM »

Most 243s will shoot either the heavier or light bullets best, some won't shoot the light bullets well at all, while others won't shoot the heavy bullets well, I'd try the 100gr Rem Core-lokts, 95gr Fusion and 100gr Power-Shoks on the heavy side, and the 80gr Rem PSP and 85gr Sierra HPBT on the lighter side for factory ammo. If you have the Superlight barrel, don't expect it to shoot well if the barrel is very warm.

Tim

DeepSouth · « **Reply #21 on:** December 20, 2008, 11:28:30 AM »

I got my son,(he's

one to shoot deer hunting.It is the youth rifle.Shooting 95gr Federal fusions this rifle will shoot a 3 shot group that you can cover with a quarter almost with a nickle.THis is at 100yds. Thisrifle will flat out shoot,it amazes me everytime I shoot it.

casterbuster · « **Reply #22 on:** December 20, 2008, 12:43:12 PM »

just picked up two boxes of Federal Blue Box 100 grain power shocks. Even before I read the post I will give them a whirl. I no for sure it won't shoot 95 grain Winchester silver ballistic tips. It wouldn't even shoot a pie plate consistently can't remember what other ammo I used. Hopefully the federals will shoot

dozernomore · « **Reply #23 on:** December 20, 2008, 01:18:56 PM »

when I previously owned a ultra thumb hole 243 bbl,,,I found winchester 80g,btsp,,got my best grouping,,,usually around 2" moa,,,,but not always,,that dreaded vertical stringing,,haunted me once in a while,,,but then I traded it in for another toy,,