Author Topic: Handi 45-70 or 444 Marlin, Which would you choose? (Read 939 times)

Down South · « **on:** February 20, 2008, 12:47:16 PM »

Hi folks, I'm new here. I discovered this forum while researching a Handi single shot rifle. I’m going to buy one of the NEF Hindi Crack Barrels. It appears that this year we will be able to use one during the primitive weapons hunting season. I’m looking at the 45-70 and the 444 Marlin. Right now I’m leaning towards the 444. I’ll be casting for whichever one I get.
I’d like to know which one you folks would recommend and why.

Thanks, Sam (DS)

Bob_VT · « **Reply #1 on:** February 20, 2008, 12:56:52 PM »

45-70 hands down! I love the range of loads and the amount of information.... you can cast almost anything for it.... uses wide range of powders..... and has a great following.

Welcome to the H&R madness...... it's a disease you know!

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #2 on:** February 20, 2008, 01:07:57 PM »

Crack rifle is correct They are a bit like an addictive drug. As for the rifle to buy... .45-70 no second guessing there, I mostly shoot cast boolets outta mine and I love it.

LaOtto222 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 20, 2008, 01:10:54 PM »

You will find that the 45-70 is very popular on this site. I bought a 444 Marlin, simply because it has reputed good accuracy and I was already set up with bullets and powder for the 444. Ether one will serve you well. Buy the one you can get, unless you are already set up to cast bullets in either size, then go for that one. Better yet get both.

Down South · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2008, 01:26:43 PM »

I’m not set up for either caliber in reloading or casting yet. I have a buddy that will sell me a set of RCBS dies cheap and give me what he describes as a (Bunch) of brass for the 45-70. This same buddy has both the 45-70 and the 444. For some reason he and his hunting buddies are all wanting to throw down their 45-70’s for the 444. He seems to think the ballistics is better with the 444. From the research that I’ve done so far, I’m changing my mind about the 444 and starting to lean more towards the 45-70. I’ve decided to buy a new whatever caliber I get. The Handi appears to be a good rifle. From what I’ve read the Handi can handle (Leaver Loads) in both calibers.
The deal on the dies and brass may just be enough to swing my thinking on caliber. One more question. How well does the 45-70 do out to 200 yards?

LaOtto222 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:10:27 PM »

You can not go wrong with either one. Get the one that you can swing the best deal on. The 45-70 will handle anything this side of big bear up to 200 yards as will the 444. Neither the 45-70 or the 444 have very good ballistics because of bullet drag. Bullets that are big in diameter, blunt nose and short do not sail through the air well. There is not much difference in them, if any thing the 45-70 with heavy long bullets may be a hair better.

MS Mule · « **Reply #6 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:22:34 PM »

My state started allowing the 45/70 among others during our primitive weapons deer seasons a couple of years back. I chose the 45/70 Handi and have been well satisfied. It is a joy to handload for.I have two friends that chose the 444 over the 45/70 and they are well satisfied. Personally I think the 45/70 is a better choice because of the wider choice of bullets available to the handloader. That may not matter to you or the next guy. I load a 300 gr. Hornady Interlock to 2050 fps out of my Handi. That gives me a point blank range of 189 yards when zeroed at 161 yds. It will be 2.9" high at 100 yds and 4.7" low at 200 yds still traveling at 1484 fps with 1336 ft/lbs energy.

As for choosing which one you want to deer hunt with. One fellow said choosing between the 444 and the 45/70 for deer is like choosing between a claw hammer and a ball pein to squash a bug.

MSP Ret · « **Reply #7 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:29:47 PM »

is this a trick question?....<><....

answers - 45-70 and a claw hammer of course!!!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:32:38 PM »

Welcome aboard Sam!!

If you use the search, you'll find previous discussions on the same topic, there have been lots of discussions on the Mississippi Primitive season. Basically, if you handload, the 45-70 has a fair advantage in that higher BC jacketed spitzer bullets are available for it, the .444 just doesn't have anything like that available, but taking advantage of them also comes with a cost of uncomfortable recoil.

If you're shooting factory ammo, the .444 has an advantage since most 45-70 ammo is limited to trapdoor pressures.

I have both, but only one .444 and three .45-70s plus a 45-120, all H&Rs.

Tim

rbergum95 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:33:53 PM »

buy both if at all possible. if not get the .45-70. there is no better caliber in the handi.

ron

Datil · « **Reply #10 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:45:13 PM »

Welcome Sam, to the wonderful world of Handi's and GBO forums.
Every body needs or have to have a 45-70, Good hunting.

Marv,

MSP Ret · « **Reply #11 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:52:13 PM »

Sam, when our voice of experience, Marv, aka Datil, one of our senior statesman speaks you should listen, that man "knows of where he speaks"...

P.S. - I have a couple of 22" barreled H&R 45-70's and a Buff Classic myself and no .444's, so you can see mine is an impartial opinion!!!....<><....

MS10point · « **Reply #12 on:** February 20, 2008, 02:59:10 PM »

I am in the same boat as you and had decided to go with the .444 mainly because of the better trajectory with factory loads and slightly less recoil.......until I saw the new 45-70 ultra stainless with the thumbhole stock. Now I' am seriously looking at it. Cost is still a big factor though. The regular handis in 45-70 can be had for around $200 while the .444's seem to be around $250.00. The best price I've seen on the ultra is around $400.00.
A buddy of mine just got a handi 45-70. With the leverevolution, he sighted in 3" high @ 100 yds. and was about 6" low @ 200 yds.
Let us know what you do.
TP

ben. · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2008, 05:20:15 AM »

You mentioned casting. You might keep in mine there is plenty of over the counter 45/70 rifle moulds up to 500+ grains. All the 444 over the counter are pistol moulds up to 300 grains. Of course 300 grains is nothing to sneeze at. AS a matter of fact 200 or 250 isn't either. I have 4 45/70 and one 444. I shoot nothing but cast bullets at targets. I hunt with a 30/06 with 180 gr jacketed bullets. The only time I took my 45/70 up elk hunting I forgot it in camp and had my 30/06 along for a 40 yard shot. I had spent a lot of time experimenting with 2 alloy cast bullets and wanted to use one on a elk. Yesterday I shot one of my 45/70 at the range with full load of black powder and a 540 gr paper patch bullet. Been a while and after 10 rounds was getting a little shakey. I decided to cut the powder considerably and also bullet weight. I don't think you can go wrong with either caliber. I sold most of my bolt action guns and now shoot mainly handis.

knight0334 · « **Reply #14 on:** February 21, 2008, 05:27:47 AM »

45-70 of course..

Why buy a V6 that is maxed out when you can have a V8 that does the same and can be sup'd up even more for the same price??

Down South · « **Reply #15 on:** February 21, 2008, 06:56:48 AM »

I ordered the 45-70 about 1/2 hour ago. It's in stock and I should have it around Tuesday.

Thanks for all of the knowledgeable replies.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #16 on:** February 21, 2008, 06:59:24 AM »

Good choice, you can always send the frame in for a .444 barrel and do your own comparison too!!

Tim

Down South · « **Reply #17 on:** February 21, 2008, 07:41:32 AM »

For curiosity’s sake, about how much does it cost to have another barrel fitted by H&R if I decide to buy extra barrels?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #18 on:** February 21, 2008, 07:49:37 AM »

Here's the list, cost on top of the barrel price is $15 fitting per barrel and $10 return shipping per order, plus the cost to send your frame to them. You may want to add a forend to the order so each barrel has its own dedicated forend in case you want to bed it to the barrel.

http://www.hr1871.com/Support/accessoryProgram.aspx

You can also order other stock sets if you choose to, most of those are listed on the 2007 Retail Parts Price list page or the price list itself in the FAQs and Help sticky. Take a look at the "Let's see some Handis" link in the FAQs also, it has several pages of pics of Handis.

Tim

Down South · « **Reply #19 on:** February 21, 2008, 10:26:58 AM »

Thanks for the link. It doesn't look to be expensive at all to get a couple extra barrels in different calibers.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #20 on:** February 21, 2008, 10:47:51 AM »

Or complete rifles if you have a mind to!!

Tim

JerryKo · « **Reply #21 on:** February 21, 2008, 11:05:57 AM »

THERE IT IS AGAIN!!!

I just love that photo of the family.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #22 on:** February 21, 2008, 11:12:18 AM »

Need to do another one, there are 2 missng from that pic, plus the fluted 270 that I just bought from Mac.

Tim

McLernon · « **Reply #23 on:** February 21, 2008, 12:15:15 PM »

There is a rule or maybe it's just a guideline, that "everybody needs at least two 45-70's". Start with one then add from there. 444's don't come under the 'rule'. The 45-70 shoots from mild to wild and there is a great choice of bullets including lead cast and jacketed, and powders including several smokeless, BP, Goex, Triple Seven, American Pioneer and Black Horn. Soooooooooooooooo many choices.

Mc

Swampman · « **Reply #24 on:** February 21, 2008, 12:47:20 PM »

I really like the .444 but if I could only have one rifle it would be a .45-70. It's big fun, and very accurate.

JerryKo · « **Reply #25 on:** February 21, 2008, 01:30:39 PM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on February 21, 2008, 11:12:18 AM

Need to do another one, there are 2 missing from that pic, plus the fluted 270 that I just bought from Mac.

Tim

You dirty dog. I thought you had passed on that one. Your wife really does love you. I wanted that one pretty bad but I resisted. I'm glad you were able to pick it up.

Jerry

PS You better get a wider lens.

Down South · « **Reply #26 on:** February 21, 2008, 02:19:19 PM »

Tim, that sure is a beautiful collection that you have.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #27 on:** February 21, 2008, 02:27:50 PM »

Thanks, now ya know what you're in for when you start adding barrels, it's just the beginnng!!

Tim