Author Topic: Learned at DEC's hunter safety instructor's course.. (Read 2898 times)

ironglow · « **on:** February 26, 2008, 06:27:44 PM »

Past Saturday, I attended a class for folks getting ready to teach Hunter Safety classes..an opportunity to ask questions.
Some of these have been vexing NY hunters for some time, so I'll give you the scoop as I was informed...

A) Page 17 of the NY State hunting & trapping regulations (2007-2008) upper right corner; Transportation of firearms;
cannot transport a firearm "unless the firearm is unloaded in both the chamber and the magazine".
Being an avid woodchuck hunter, I like to be in action as soon as possible after I spot a woodchuck while driving side roads
where I usually hunt..but I didn't want to take any chances about having a "loaded" magazine..
Here's the scoop..no cartridges in the gun..If the magazine is not removable, such as my Savage 11G or my Marlin 336 or
any other tube fed..no..no..
But if you have a removable magazine, such as a 10/22, Marlin 880SQ or 795 for instance..the magazine can be full..
but must not be in the gun.

B) You're hunting on the south side of the road, you want to go across to the north side. You don't have to unload..
You must not shoot from the road..get across the "ditch" first, but you can cross with the gun loaded.
Some instructors, for safety reasons, teach unloading..but the law doesn't insist.
Still, if I were near the road and a game warden stopped in the road and called me to his car, I would unload...
Simply because while talking, I may forget and lean against the motor vehicle..touchy there.

C) I am out hunting and see a game animal that is not supposed to be in NY State..cougar, elk, etc., can I shoot
..If that game animal is listed as not being in NY..there is no season for it (closed or open)..they can't nail you
for shooting an animal that is not recognized as being there..

These are answers given to me orally, by the Master instructors and the area coordinator for the DEC..
Take them for what they are worth...I'm satisfied...

O44 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 27, 2008, 01:15:04 AM »

A and B I was aware of but C takes me by surprise.. I can't imagine dragging an elk out to the road and not getting in some kind of trouble.

ironglow · « **Reply #2 on:** February 27, 2008, 01:51:45 AM »

Elk are present in Pennsylvania and supposedly could wander over the border. When asked about this situation, the reply was..there are no wild elk in NY State,
so the same applies.
One word of caution, make sure you have not wandered onto one of the ever-increasing game farms.

Naturally if some species that is protected federally, such as the California Condor or many other birds of prey..they are naturally, federally protected.

Leatherstocking · « **Reply #3 on:** February 27, 2008, 03:59:51 AM »

I always thought that an animal was protected unless there was an open season for it. For example songbirds, there is no listed closed or open season on a chickadee. Can you shoot one? No. Unless there is an open season and animal is protected. Perhaps a better example is moose. I don't know of anything that explicitly says you can't shoot a moose, but there certainly is no open season on them in NY. I would think the same would apply to elk or cougar, regardless of the fact that they are not "supposed" to be here.

I would verify item C with an ECO or some others to double check that answer.

ironglow · « **Reply #4 on:** February 27, 2008, 04:41:43 AM »

Don't hurt to recheck..but I got my info from the area coordinator of the DEC...

Chuck White · « **Reply #5 on:** February 27, 2008, 04:15:39 PM »

ironglow;
That's interesting!

I'll have to run that by some of the local D.E.C. people up here where I hunt.

I know there are cougars, because I saw one 2 years ago.

ironglow · « **Reply #6 on:** February 27, 2008, 05:31:38 PM »

Chuck;
there are a lot of reports of cougar..but the DEC still says ..uh..uh...

Pg 17 in the official NY State hunting & trapping guide tells how to view protected/unprotected species..but it is rather vague.

Leatherstocking;
Pg 17 also covers Moose..says there are 300-500 in northern NY...and they are protected..

Varmint Hunter · « **Reply #7 on:** March 19, 2008, 10:14:38 AM »

Quote

..If that game animal is listed as not being in NY..there is no season for it

And where would one find an official list of animals "as not being in NY"?

ironglow · « **Reply #8 on:** March 19, 2008, 02:09:52 PM »

Go to your hunters manual that you get with your license that outlines species/seasons..if in doubt, call the local DEC..they're not ALL ogres ! LOL

rebAL · « **Reply #9 on:** April 02, 2008, 10:49:25 AM »

I am not disagreeing but a few years ago I was in regional DEC office in Rotterdam where they had a stuffed Mt. Lion on display with caption that it was confiscated & owner was fined for trying to sell it with classified ad. Perhaps it's O K to shoot but illegal to possess?

ironglow · « **Reply #10 on:** April 02, 2008, 01:57:38 PM »

ReBAL ;
I think you answered your own question. It is of course, illegal to keep wild game in captivity without a permit..includes deer and raccoon etc.
Some coon hunters keep a "pet coon" for training purposes (like laying a trail)..but I am quite sure they MUST have a permit..

rebAL · « **Reply #11 on:** April 03, 2008, 02:35:05 AM »

The point then is it's O K to shoot but not take possession.

ironglow · « **Reply #12 on:** April 03, 2008, 03:29:27 AM »

Don't know..you will have to check with DEC...

deltecs · « **Reply #13 on:** April 03, 2008, 01:53:12 PM »

Quote from: rebAL on April 02, 2008, 10:49:25 AM

I am not disagreeing but a few years ago I was in regional DEC office in Rotterdam where they had a stuffed Mt. Lion on display with caption that it was confiscated & owner was fined for trying to sell it with classified ad. Perhaps it's O K to shoot but illegal to possess?

Almost all States have a prohibition against SELLING game. I wonder if it is legal to shoot, possess and keep the game, but is not legal to advertise for sale of game shot?

rebAL · « **Reply #14 on:** April 04, 2008, 03:02:25 AM »

I never thought of a "Stuffed" game animal as "Game". Don't we have the right to sell our trophies? Perhaps we can own & sell a "Game" animal but not a "Non-game" animal like a mt. lion even though we can legally shoot them. Something doesn't add up... but then this is NYS.

spikehorn · « **Reply #15 on:** September 04, 2009, 11:26:12 AM »

I asked a DEC office about the russian bore that had gotten loose in the spafford forest, and his comment was that they are not an indigenous species so you can shoot on sight.

ironglow · « **Reply #16 on:** September 04, 2009, 02:28:18 PM »

I just finished 2nd season teaching hunter safety, so I'll pose you NY state hunting guys another question...

You're out hunting along a creek or beside a marsh, or even dry land. You see an animal in a trap, it's leg or head is all torn up and it is suffering, do you....

1) let the animal loose ?
2) kill it to put it out of it's misery ?
3) just leave it alone ? ...answer below

The trapper is required to check his traps at least once in each 24 hour period..just leave it alone..
....If you come by 24 hours later and the same animal is in the same trap...you still leave it alone..but call the DEC.

The Hermit · « **Reply #17 on:** September 04, 2009, 03:32:27 PM »

I'm not sure what the law is, but I don't let any animal suffer. I'd kill it and leave it in the trap.

The Hermit

bubba · « **Reply #18 on:** September 04, 2009, 03:48:54 PM »

If you kill the animal you have broken the law. I have been teaching for 26 years. when I hit 30 I am retiring. I was asked about becoing a master instrutor and turned it down. I prefer teaching to teaching the teachers. How would you kill the animal in the trap? if you put a bullet in it, you will have one unhappy trapper for ruining the fur. If you try to get close enough to club it, you might have more than you bargain for. The question is designed to teach students that they share the lands with others and have to respect others rights to use the land. The trapper has done nothing wrong, so leave his stuff alone. Trapping is legal and for the sake of argument, the question on the test does not say the animal is alive it just says if you come upon an animal in a trap what do you do.

ironglow · « **Reply #19 on:** September 05, 2009, 11:55:08 AM »

Right Bubba;
I embellished the question a bit, figuring it would elicit a quicker answer. Nevertheless, the law is the same whether the trapped animal is alive or dead...

mechanic · « **Reply #20 on:** September 05, 2009, 12:24:46 PM »

Much the same is true in Ga. except for the fact that a fellow killed a cougar last year here, that is not supposed to exhist. DNA determined it was a Fla. cougar which had migrated. The Fla. cougar is on the endangered species list. The hunter may be in trouble with US Fish and Wildlife, not with state DNR.

kitchawan kid · « **Reply #21 on:** September 05, 2009, 01:33:11 PM »

I question the loaded unloaded firearm,around here the gun must be unloaded and the ammo packed away from it as in locked in a case or in the trunk.

The Hermit · « **Reply #22 on:** September 05, 2009, 02:21:19 PM »

Bubba, I'm sure you know your stuff. I respect that, and the fact you are teaching others. What actually happens around here (my property)where others trap, is that the animal is dispatched, removed from the trap, usually hung on a limb, and the trap reset. I've been doing it for over 50 years. No problems or complaints.
Also, I leave my woods cabin unlocked for others to use and they only time there was trouble was when some boys stole a pair of snow shoes, which their father later made them return.
The DEC has made a mind boggling array of stupid, confusing, and useless rules just to generate money. Look at the new fees and changing senior license to age 70. The game warden around here is very rude and arrogant. You can't ask him anything and get a civil answer.
I encourage youngsters to study and pass their hunting tests. Then exercise common sense. I suspect this will offend some, which is not my intention, but its how I see things.

The Hermit

spikehorn · « **Reply #23 on:** September 06, 2009, 05:03:25 AM »

Kitchawana kid I think you are looking at the rules for transporting a handgun

kitchawan kid · « **Reply #24 on:** September 06, 2009, 08:04:32 AM »

I know the transportation laws of any firearm,but the law about any firearm in a car must be unloaded and the ammo in another place untill you leave the car to hunt.

spikehorn · « **Reply #25 on:** September 06, 2009, 12:49:01 PM »

didn't mean to imply you didn't know the rules. When I am Chuck hunting I always drive around with my rifle in the back seat and the loaded clip either in my pocket or on the passenger seat and have never had a problem.

ironglow · « **Reply #26 on:** September 06, 2009, 03:18:45 PM »

Spikehorn;
I do the same and checked with the game wardens when "training for the training"..they approved of that method. If you have a game warden who is like the Hermit claims his is, he could give you a hassle..but if taken further you should be OK.

spikehorn · « **Reply #27 on:** September 06, 2009, 07:13:18 PM »

We had a pretty reasonable DEC officer in our area all he would ask is if the firearms were unloaded. Which they always were. He retired a few years ago and I have not had the pleasure of meeting his replacement yet.