Experiences with 45 Colt on Whitetail Deer

[GLC]

Just bought an S&W Model 25, 6.5" barrel for target work and hopefully for a short range PA Whitetail deer gun. 

What load do you use?  Cast Lead or Hollow Point? 

Powder type, charge, etc? 

Scope or irons?

How was performance on the deer? 

I'm thinking that 50 yard shots or less would be typical for me where I hunt in the thick stuff. 

Thanks.

[Castaway]

A 45 Colt is bad medicine for deer.  Your Smith can't be driven to Ruger velocities, but a 255 grain cast bullet at 1,000 f/s will make an inney and outey on a broadside shot 90% of the time.  When it doesn't exit, you'll still have a dead deer.  My experience with big, slow bullets is an entrance hole that is larger than an exit.  My theory is it's not going fast enough to vent pressure at the back side, so something has to give on the front side with bone and tissue coming out the front side. 

[kennisondan]

255 to 300 plus cast hard, 900 past 1000 fps; suggest a flat nose, like LBT style or Keith wide meplat for close range...complete penetration with 255 broadside and 300 grainers end to end at 1000 fps and surely above that speed ... with xtp hornady Hollow points, check the speed the manufacturer says it expands at... I would not count on expansion for my uses.. too close it fails to hold together and fragments due to too much speed... too far/too slow and it expands not at all and penetrates possibly but probably not sufficiently... it has a window of performance... the cast, if heavy is going through regardless of distance or speed up to a point..
Point is >> the lack of expansion on big non deforming bullets with a sharp shoulder and flat point is more reliable for real world big game than the high tech expander relying on performace contingent on speed and resistance relationship...
I just go for the reliable... but you can have a heap of fun/success with hollow point bullets and well placed shots at sufficient speed to penterate the vitals... but if you hit sufficient resistance at too great or too little speed the round will fail...not penetrate... to the vitals...
with rifle rounds it is different, they move at sufficiently fast pace to perform within the large window they operate ... pistols are meant to kill by penetration and blood loss.. so the larger diameter and the longer the wound channel the better...
that is just what I have learned..
I would use hard cast and count on penetration in any large bore pistol...regardles of make or round... at pistol ranges irons are fine, with practice sufficient to put it in a pie plate...I would go with a 300 grain or just less and a cast flat nose and practice and not look back... but do sharpen the skinning knife....bone and muscle will not stop it..
dk

[Cheesehead]

I have taken one deer with the 45 Long Colt, chambered in a Ruger Blackhawk 4 5/8 inch with adj. iron sights. The range was over 50 yards. One shot just ahead of the front shoulder and bang/flop. The cartridge was charged with a maximum amount of Unique. The bullet was your standard cowboy 250 grain cast round nose flat point. Nothing fancy or expensive. Bought the bullets in a 500 pack at a reasonable price. Lots of bullets to work up an accurate load and create reduced loads for practice, practice, practice.

Cheese

[Lloyd Smale]

any 240-275 grain swc or flat nosed bullet  pushed to 900-1000 fps out of your smith will kill any deer or blackbear or hog on this planet. Good powders to do it with unique herco, powerpistol, universal clays, hs6, or 2400. Theres plenty of loads at this level in any loading manual.   

[BIG Dog454]

11 gr of Herco and 250 gr xtp at 1024 fps drops deer in their tracks.  I like herco because it is bulky and fills the case, also very accurate.  I also like to use unique in the 45 colt.  My ruger BH seems to like 250 gr bullets at between 1000 and 1150fps.

[GLC]

A lot of good ideas here.  Thanks for the responses. 

It seems that shooters either hate the 45 Colt for deer and will tell you sell it for a 44 mag or love it for excellent penetration with a heavy slug at moderate velocities.  Obviously, I subscribe to the latter theory.  I don't think the Smith & Wesson puts me at any disadvantage when compared to a Ruger.  I've had a Ruger Blackhawk in the past and loaded some hand numbing loads but they seem to be overkill. A heavy slug at a moderate 900-1000 fps used at a reasonable distance sounds just fine. My S&W is much nicer overall than any Ruger I've had in my opinion.   

Thanks again.

[AtlLaw]

A lot of good ideas here.  Thanks for the responses.

A little bit ago I dug a couple of 45 Colt SAA clones outa my gun closet and decided I wanted to try one out next deer season should I get a standing broadside shot at <25 yards.  Now   I always said they ain't much a 250 +/- grain, 40 odd caliber bullet goin 900 +/- fps won't do that needs do-in but I was generally referrin to people punchin, so I have followed this thread with interest.  A few posts up Lloyd said it, I believe it, therefore I'm a gonna try it out!     Thanks for asking the question!

[John R.]

Lloyd said it best. Any 250 to 300 gr. bullet @ 900 to 1000 fps. will kill any Whitetail on the planet. The RCBS 2700 SAA bullet is a good choice also. I get mine from Montana Bullet Works (they actually weigh 280 grs.) I run them  1050 fps. out of my Bisley. The load is 13 grs. of HS6.

[StrawHat]

Your Smith can't be driven to Ruger velocities,

Nor do you need to drive it so.

The old black powder load is a deer killer, and the S&W can easily handle that load.

What Lloyd said has been proved by him and others many times over.

I use the 255 Keith bullet at +/- 900 fps and it takes care of both shoulders of the Ohio whitetail.

Looking forward to trying the 270 Scovill bullet next season.

When you start at 45 caliber, it doesn't need to expand to make a big hole.

Good luck

[huntersmurf]

Before you go and buy some 300 grainers ya might want to check to see if the cylinder is long enough to chamber the long 300 grainers.

[Ole Man Dan]

GLC:

If you are going to shoot iron sights, consider a WFN wieghing  255 to 265gr.  Stoke it with Unique.
The WFN does a good job inside 100 yds.  (Large 'Pass thru' holes. In & out)
You mentioned previous exp. with Rugers loaded hot...  I think we've all gone thru that phase.  We don't need a load capable of stopping a Buffalo to kill deer or hogs. Load it down to more sensible loads.  If you are going to hunt with cast, shoot for the shoulder.  It's a quick stop.
I too have had a couple of failures with hollow points, so I prefer LBT style bullets at a moderate velocity.
(Hunting don't have to hurt us)

[myronman3]

bang flop?     watch out for the truth patrol....

[nilescoyote]

I use Hornady's 250 grain XTP in the 1200 to 1300 FPS range. I don't remember what powder i was using. Shooting it from a ruger bisley and a encore 454 barrel. Shows great accuracy and expansion, penetration w/ weight retention, dropping the deer with in 5-10 yards from point of impact.

[warrior1]

 +1 to 45 colt

[jengel]

I had a Smith Model 625 Mountain Gun and it would keyhole 300gr Oregon Trail cast bullets.  I don't think that the grooves were deep enough.  Don't know if yours would be the same. 

[panman]

Jengel,The reason you don't get the accessiory that the rugers get with 300 gainers is Smiths have a twist rate of 1- 181/2",while the rugers are 1-20".I believe that your SW.is just fine,just use bullets in the 250 range,or under.pan.

[panman]

Well i just double checked my memory Duhhh.[So much for that.lol.]
The Lyman 46th Edition states that smiths are 1-20 and rugers are 1-24!.
Now it gets interesting,In their test on page 406 they used a ruger and it is 1-16 twist???
SOOOO i guess that the rugers are meant to shoot the heavier bullets,and the smiths lighter.pan..

[efremtags]

The smith is a modern gun which can be driven to 44mag velocities at 5-10% lower pressure than the 44 mag. You are giving up nothing to a Ruger. The Rugers claim to fame is that in the Redhawks and super Redhawks, you can drive the ammo 25% over SAMMI specs no problem because the frames are proof tested to almost 2x caliber rating, so if you hot rod, you won't blow yourself up.

On a 6.5" tube with responsible handloads you should be able to drive 250-280GR bullets in the 1200fps neighborhood no problem.

There is a lot of data out there for modern 45 colt.

I personally use both hollow points and hardcast. The hardcast are cheaper to load and can be used on wider variety of game with more predictable performance.
Beartooth bullets offer some great WFN rounds. If you are limiting to deer size game, not need to exceed 250GR.

H110 and A2400 work well with magnum primers.

I would not scope this gun as it's appeal is its light contour is easy to carry and shoot open sighted. If your going to scope it, get a 629 in the hunter model with scope rail and longer barrel.

[Racer X]

The smith is a modern gun which can be driven to 44mag velocities at 5-10% lower pressure than the 44 mag. You are giving up nothing to a Ruger. The Rugers claim to fame is that in the Redhawks and super Redhawks, you can drive the ammo 25% over SAMMI specs no problem because the frames are proof tested to almost 2x caliber rating, so if you hot rod, you won't blow yourself up.

On a 6.5" tube with responsible handloads you should be able to drive 250-280GR bullets in the 1200fps
H110 and A2400 work well with magnum primers.

People who post to this site should be cautious in what they recommend others do in respect to handloading, and particularly, hotrodding their loads.

For one, I would not recommend pushing a Smith M-25 as hard as a Blackhawk nor trying to handload a Redhawk or SRH 25% over SAMMI specs. Furthermore, I am not aware of any responsible loading data source that publishes separate data for the Redhawks and SRH. Without reliable, pressure-tested data, I would not load beyond what the reputable loading manuals prescribe. Without pressure testing equipment, hobbyist handloaders (most of us) have no way of knowing when we have exceeded the outer limits of this 25% threshhold you state Redhawks are capable of handling. Also, today's 2400 powder should only be used with standard primers, not magnum.

[m-g Willy]

Check out( gunnotes smith&wesson mod 25-5)
John Linbaugh tells what loads he has tested and uses in his favorite gun.
It's a good read by someone that really knows what he's talking about.


Willy