New 30-06 barrel and range report + frame pin

[Slufoot]

I sent in my frame a while back to get a loose pin in the frame fixed and to also get it refinished because of a couple of scratches that happened while I was getting my second barrel. Gordon from H&R told me the same thing that Tim told me about the pin. If the pin was under size they could replace the pin, but if the holes in the frame were too large they would have to replace the frame with a new one and refit my barrels. I told Gordon that I hated to send the frame back and not get another barrel and he told me to send it in and he would waive the fitting and shipping fees. So I sent the frame back to get it refinished, the pin fixed, a new wood Monte Carlo stock set and a 30-06 barrel.
I got it back on Wednesday and installed a Leupold VX-II 3-9 scope in Leupold Rifleman vertically split medium rings. I noticed that the barrel was fairly hard to open and close and that the opening lever didn't seem to come up as far as I thought it should when the barrel was closed. The forearm is very tight and requires ALOT of effort to pull free from the barrel.
I got to shoot it today and on the first shot the barrel popped open, first time this has ever happened to me. I dried the locking lugs before firing so I knew this wasn't the cause, I then closed the barrel and the opening lever was coming up good like it does with my other barrels. I kept an eye on the lever each time I loaded and it came up good every time and the gun never popped open any more. I don't know what happened on that first shot because I couldn't get the lever to come up good no matter how hard I closed the gun with and without the forearm on, but after the first shot the lever has been working fine through 20 rounds.
After getting it on paper at 100 yards I managed a 2&5/8" five shot group. It shot a little to the left and a little low so I made a scope adjustment and fired another 5-shot group, this one printed 3&5/8" with extreme vertical stringing. I only had 4 rounds left and decided to shoot these with the forearm removed, these did much better and came in at 1&11/16".
After shot #12 I noticed the pin had moved quite a bit to the left, Crap! I opened the barrel and pushed the pin back in with my finger. I hate to have to send the frame back but what else can I do?
I know I'm going to have to do some forearm work to get rid of the vertical stringing and with some load development I think I can get this barrel to shoot plenty good enough for Whitetails and the occasional groundhog.

Here are some pic's of the target I shot and of the frame pin that has worked it's way out to the left.

[McLernon]

Hi Slufoot:

Maddening I'll bet. Looks like another trip to the factory. Maybe they will fix it right the second time...........I hope.

Mc

[quickdtoo]

Remove the forend spacer and flat sand the flat side, test, repeat until the forend just slips on with little pressure to no pressure, that should reduce the vertical stringing.

On the pin, unless they have oversize pins available which they apparently don't, remove the barrel from the frame, remove the pin enough for the splines to just clear the frame, degrease the splined area of the pin, apply a tiny bit of JB Weld to the spline area, let it cure, then install it, should be enough to hold it in place. If it doesn't work, you're only out the time and effort.  

I wonder what they did, maybe peened the pin hole before they refinished it?? If you tear it down, you may be able to do the same thing on the inside, the JB wouldn't require a tear down I don't think.

Tim

[LONGTOM]

I am no expert by a long way but how about a small ping in the end of the pin to swell it a bit. Wouldn't that work also?


LONGTOM

[quickdtoo]

It may be worth a try, but I think it may be too hard to peen.

Tim

[Slufoot]

Hi Slufoot:

Maddening I'll bet. Looks like another trip to the factory. Maybe they will fix it right the second time...........I hope.

Mc

Hey McLernon, Yeah I was pretty dang disappointed with their so called fix. Tim has given me an idea that I'll try before sending it back.

Remove the forend spacer and flat sand the flat side, test, repeat until the forend just slips on with little pressure to no pressure, that should reduce the vertical stringing.

On the pin, unless they have oversize pins available which they apparently don't, remove the barrel from the frame, remove the pin enough for the splines to just clear the frame, degrease the splined area of the pin, apply a tiny bit of JB Weld to the spline area, let it cure, then install it, should be enough to hold it in place. If it doesn't work, you're only out the time and effort.  

I wonder what they did, maybe peened the pin hole before they refinished it?? If you tear it down, you may be able to do the same thing on the inside, the JB wouldn't require a tear down I don't think.

Tim

Hey Tim, Thanks for the info on the forearm!
You have given me an idea on the pin. I've been through two Loctite classes and have several of their products. I have some Loctite 609 Retaining Compound that is made for press fit applications. I'll give this a try and see if it holds.
What would happen if I pushed the pin out too far?
I need to degrease the hole and the pin thoroughly before applying the compound.
Thanks again!
Slufoot

[quickdtoo]

I just knocked one out well past the splines, if you go way too far, the lifter spring will prevent it from being pushed back thru, but I was able to reposition the spring with an awl and push the pin back into position even then. If you're real careful when you knock it out and just go far enough to get at the spines, it will work fine. You can see some pics on page 7 of part II of Perklo's trigger hone. 

Tim

http://www.perkloafm.com/pdf/Handi_instr_twob.pdf

[Slufoot]

Hey Tim, it's done along with fitting the forend and staining and sealing it.
I now know why you prefer the wood/laminate forends, it just took a few minutes with some sand paper on a flat surface and a couple of checks for fit. I applied some stain & filler and then some tru-oil to seal it. I'll put the forend spacer back on in the morning after it dries completely.
I used a drift punch of the proper size to completely push out the loose pin and left the punch in the frame to hold everything in place. I completely degreased the pin and then pulled the punch out just enough to degrease the hole on the left side. Then I inserted the pin and used it to push the punch just far enough to degrease the the hole in the right side of the frame. I then applied the Loctite 609 into the hole on the right side and to the splines of the pin on the left side and pushed it into place. I wiped off the excess retaining compound and it will be ready to try tomorrow.
Hopefully a better range report will follow!

Thanks again!
GOOD SHOOTING!
Slufoot

[quickdtoo]

 

[JBC]

Another thing you may want to try on your pin is a special type of loctite called loctite retention compound it is made to keep undersize pins in their holes, we use it in the tool shop where I work to keep worn or undersize dowels in place

[Slufoot]

Another thing you may want to try on your pin is a special type of loctite called loctite retention compound it is made to keep undersize pins in their holes, we use it in the tool shop where I work to keep worn or undersize dowels in place

Hello JBC, this is what I used. I posted about it last night and tested it today.


Today has been extrememly windy here, 25-30 mph winds with even stronger gusts. Not good for shooting groups!
I wanted to try my gun out and see if the pin was going to move, so I tried to shoot a decent group despite the wind. I loaded some Hornady 150 grain SST's and pushed them with IMR-4350, the first 3 shots went into 1.25". I was happy and went back to the bench and put two more down range, these opened the group up to 2", not so good but better than yesterday and the group was round instead of strung up and down.
I looked at the pin after each shot and it was staying in place. Since it was so windy I thought I would just do some blasting. I've got some 150 grain Surplus FMJ's that I load over a medium charge of Mil. Surp. IMR-4895 and use Military brass. This is my cheap blasting ammo that my dad and I use in our BAR's for having fun and to hone our off hand shooting. This is what I did with the Handi and after 25 rounds the pin never budged!
After shooting I cleaned the barrel and it took alot of effort and time to get it clean. I used several patches on a jag with Birchwood Casey's Bore Scrubber. I dried this out and went to the Sweets 7.62, after that I went to JB's Bore Cleaning Compound with Kroil. After all of this I used a bronze brush and went back to the Bore Scrubber, finally I got the patches coming out clean.
This barrel must be pretty rough due to the amount of effort it takes to get it clean. I've read on this site about barrels not coming in until several rounds have been fired, I've got a feeling this may be one of those barrels.
I've got several different loads ready to try as soon as the weather permits a good range session.

GOOD SHOOTING!
Slufoot 

[quickdtoo]

Sounds good!! While you're waiting for the weather, I'd be smoothing that bore up with Flitz, won't hurt and you'll be surprised how much easier it will be to clean and how much sooner the barrel starts shooting its best.

Tim

[Slufoot]

Sounds good!! While you're waiting for the weather, I'd be smoothing that bore up with Flitz, won't hurt and you'll be surprised how much easier it will be to clean and how much sooner the barrel starts shooting its best.

Tim

Hey Tim, Thank for the tip on the Flitz. Is it more agressive than JB's?
While testing several loads and hoping for good groups, how much time between shots do you recommend to keep from overheating the barrel and causing the shots to string due to the hot barrel?
Thanks!
Slufoot

[quickdtoo]

I think the Fltiz is slightly more agressive, just works a little faster with less elbow grease!!

3 shots in 2 minutes should be doable without too much stringing, if the forend is bedded, you'll likely see less stringing tho. I shot a 6 shot string in my 308 Win bull barrel which just has a pressure point at the tip of the forend, just to see how heat affected it, I shot 2 loads in ½gr steps, 3 shots each, all back to back, the 42gr load of Varget was a diagonal string that measures .911”, each shot even spaced, the 42.5gr load was just above it, but one shot even with the first of that weight and one above and to the right slightly, that group measuring 1”.

Tim