Author Topic: A tale of two Ruger carbines  (Read 2127 times)

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Offline Stan in SC

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A tale of two Ruger carbines
« on: April 27, 2008, 04:43:28 AM »
Last year I purchased a Ruger Super Redhawk and liked it so much that I decided to purchase a semi carbine(old style) to go with it.After much looking I found the right condition and price rifle.It's a 1967 year of manufacture pre-warning
which I purchased from a collector in California.I took it to the range after receiving it and was very pleased with the performance and accuracy using iron sights at 25 and 100 yards.
Yesterday I attended the South Carolina Arms Collector's gun show in Greenville,SC.Sitting on a dealer's rack was an "as new" Ruger carbine in the lever action model 96/44.After a bit of haggling I persuaded the gentleman to accept some mere money in exchange for this nice rifle.These are super slick rifles with a short throw smooth action.Very nice.
The old model Ruger carbine was made from 1961 until 1985.They were discontinued and later superceeded by the "Deerfield" model which is now discontinued.The model 96/44 lever action is also discontinued as of 2007.
I'd be interested in hearing any experience or comments any of the forum members might have concerning these two models.Thanks.
Stan
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45/70..it's almost a religion.

Offline targshooter

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2008, 10:07:37 AM »
Stan in SC,
I own a Deerfield. It is more accurate and dependable than the two 44 Carbines I owned in the late 60s and early 1970s. It is a true 2 MOA rifle with a scope and capable of 3-4 MOA at 100 yards with its peep and my eyes. A hunting partner has owned a 96/44 since the year they came out. It is not as accurate as my Deerfield, but its accuracy is fine for the heavy PA woods (no semi autos in PA) he uses it in. He has been hunting the area for over thirty years; thus his shots are planned and the paths clear of brush, and the maximum range is about 50 yards. He uses the same load I do, the Speer Gold Dot 270 grain bullet factory offering. I have not hunted with him for over twenty years, but he gets a deer almost every year and they are usually one shot kills. I have shot four deer with my Deerfield, all within 50 yards, all one shot kills. I have not found the .44 Mag a good brush penetrating cartridge as the bullets have low sectiona densities. On the other hand, the 220 grain high sectional density bullet in the .30-06 is a decent brush penetrator in my experience. I use the .44 Mag for still hunting the cleared hardwood lots here in MN. A decent hit with the 270 grain Speer puts the deer down, much more efficiently than the Ft. Lbs energy would indicate.

Offline Rangr44

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2008, 10:46:01 AM »
The 96/44 is an excellent carbine, except that the stock wood isn't my beloved walnut.   :(
I found the lever case-hardening especially attractive, and it can either be scoped using the built-in mounts, or peep sighted using a New England Custom Gun clip-on peep sight.

I have hunted with the same group of eight, for over thirty years - and we all use Ruger .44 Carbines.

Some are scoped, some red dots, some peep sighted and one with the issue open sights - but all are an effective deer & black bear rifle/cartridge. 
There's a Place for All God's Creatures - Right Next to the Potatoes & Gravy ! !

Offline nrb

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Using the original 44 carbine
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2008, 03:52:56 AM »
My 44 carbine is one of the original ones that I scoped with a 2-7x and handload for and have used regularly since the mid 80s. This is probably the best woods rifles I've handled and is totally dependable. From testing handloads, I have found that the carbine loves 240 grain and heavier bullets, anything lighter does not group well. With 240 up  to 300 grain, I get 1" groups at 100yds. With 170 - 190 grain the groups open up to 4".

Offline Stan in SC

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2008, 10:37:43 AM »
nrb,what powder and what load do you use?Cast or jacketed bullet?

I took the new carbine to the range today.It took about 5 shots at 25 yards to get the scope zeroed.Then at 100 yards I shot a three shot group that had two shots touching and one shot about 1/4" away.The 96/44 is a great little rifle.I still have the greatest affinity for the semi auto carbine though.It is not nor will it be scoped.The 96/44 had a scope on it when I got it.I'll leave it that way.I just like shooting some of my rifles with iron sights.

Stan
The more I listen,the more I hear....and vice versa.

45/70..it's almost a religion.

Offline nrb

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Reloading for the 44 carbine
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2008, 02:15:51 AM »
Stan,
I am not at a location with my reloading notes. However, I found my 44mag liked H 110 or its twin Win 296 best. Check the Hodgdon's web site for their loads or an up to date reloaders manual. I pick a load between mid and max and use a good soft nose or hollow point jacketed 240 or heavier bullet. I have used bullets from several manufacturers successfully.

best,          nrb

Offline MSP Ret

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2008, 05:00:57 AM »
This thread is great guys and thanks for starting it Stan. Thanks also to those who have responded. I also have an early pre-warning Ruger .44 Mag carbine and it is a great woods gun for Maine. I have a matching Ruger 10/22 with a walnut stock that I picked up years ago as a companion piece and practice rifle to match the .44 Mag. I have some W 296 sitting on the bench and am interested in some soft point bullet loads that others have found to be accurate in their Rugers...Thanks again to all and best of luck to you Stan. It sounds as if you have a couple of beauties there....<><....:)
"Giving up your gun to someone else on demand is called surrender. It means that you have given up your ability to protect yourself to a power that is greater than you." - David Yeagley

Offline targeteer

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2008, 09:31:51 AM »
Does anyone know the thread size of the barrel band screw....for the old model tubular feed Carbine ???

Offline Masterblaster1

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2008, 12:16:06 PM »
I have a pre warning 44 carbine also that has a 1.5-5x bushnell on it. It is very reliable but it does need to be clean. I shoot 270 grain speer gold dot soft point and get about 2 inches at 100 yards.  The 270 grain bulllet is awesome last year i shot a does heart in half with it.

Offline targshooter

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2008, 03:02:02 AM »
I have used W296 for many years. The two loads I use in my Trapper and Deerfield are:
1] 23 grains of W296 under a 240 grain Remington bullet. Kills varmints well. Very accurate in Trapper.
2] 21 grains of W296 under 270 grain Speer Gold Dot. This has been a great deer load. Great accuracy in Deerfield.

Offline MSP Ret

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2008, 06:39:17 AM »
Thanks guys, it looks as if I will be picking up some Speer 270 grain Gold Dots. Any other favorite loads out there for the Ruger .44's?....<><....:)
"Giving up your gun to someone else on demand is called surrender. It means that you have given up your ability to protect yourself to a power that is greater than you." - David Yeagley

Offline efremtags

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2008, 08:57:16 AM »
I liked my deerfield, but it has the uncanny ability to jam when unloading if you hesitate in the slightest, especially with gloves on. I sold it after 6 years and got a pistol with the money.

It was very accurate, with a cheap 4x scope it would shoot big 1 hole groups at 50yds with 300gr hornady XTP.

They hold their value well also.

If I had to get another carbine it would be a lever action.

Offline Varmint Hunter

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2008, 01:54:43 PM »
For many years I owned and shot an original 44 mag carbine. Eventually I began to experience failures to feed. The action is difficult to clean and I'm not sure what was causing the mis-feeds. However, the rifle was very accurate and I was able to get groups of 1.5" @ 100 yds with tailored handloads. I contacted Ruger and was told that parts haven't been available for many years and that they will not repair them. I traded the old carbine in for a new 44 mag Deerfield which is totally reliable. Unfortunately it is not as accurate as the old carbine.

For whatever it's worth, both rifles shoot the best with a Hornady 300 gr XTP and a max charge of H110 (or Win 296).

Offline MSP Ret

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2008, 01:10:03 PM »
Thanks Varmint Hunter, I will try a max load of W296 behind that Hornady XTP in my original Ruger .44 Mag carbine....<><....:)
"Giving up your gun to someone else on demand is called surrender. It means that you have given up your ability to protect yourself to a power that is greater than you." - David Yeagley

Offline gstewart44

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2008, 06:06:30 AM »
I have an early model (1961) 44 carbine and I love it.    Yes, it is finicky about what ammo it digests but if you feed it right and keep it clean it is on the money every shot.   I have a red dot sight on it and this little gun goes with me on swamp walkabouts looking for pork on the hoof.  I willl never get rid of it.   I just keep in mind:

Use full power factory or handloads....won't cycle the weaker stuff

Use jacketed bullets only!  They feed well and don't dirty up the gas mechanism.

Keep it clean.............

I shoot Hornady 240 gr XTP's over a max load of H110.    It is very accurate.   Have taken two does, one 5 point buck, two coyotes, numerous pigs/hogs, and four Goodyear truck tires (caught a poacher on our lease) with my 44 carbine.   It is a great companion. 
I'm just tryin' to keep everything in balance, Woodrow. You do more work than you got to, so it's my obligation to do less. (Gus McCrae)

Offline danza

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2008, 03:43:38 PM »
i have a P9 carbine. it's the 9x19mm carbine that was designed for LEO; mostly as a close quarters weapon. it has the featured ability to share magazines with the P-series 9mm pistols and ammo. i think the biggest reason it's not more popular is that most law enforcment now scoff at the 9mm cartridge as a service cartridge.

this is a very fine carbine. i use standard ammo and handloads and have never experienced any difficulties with it. i use the 115 gr FMJ and 115 gr RNL

it runs very smoothly and is VERY accurate out to 120-150 yards but it does require cleaning.

the only complaint i have is the trigger could be better (smoother), but for a semi-automatic shoulder fired carbine it still funtcions fine.

i would not hesitate to own another (i will not part with mine)

Offline Tallwalker

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2008, 12:32:02 AM »
The 96/44 is an excellent carbine, except that the stock wood isn't my beloved walnut.   :(
I found the lever casehardening especially attractive, and it can either be scoped using the built-in mounts, or peep sighted using a New England Custom Gun clip-on peep sight.

There were a couple of prototype 96/44's that had wonderful walnut stocks. They were much slimmer with a Schnabel forend, and the old "S" curve on the pistol grip. They looked very much like styled Savage 99's and I liked them a lot. I always thought the gun would have been a better seller, even at a higher price if that stock had been used. Never hurts to give Ruger an opinion on that kind of thing......... or one of the big distributors like Davidson's, or Lipsey's.

Offline BBF

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2008, 10:27:53 AM »
I got the lever action. One of the first things I did was get that weird looking recoil pad that fits the original butt after that miserable plastic buttplate bruised me up real good and I am not a skinny guy.

That recoil pad makes the Carbine look hideous and adds much more then I like to the pull length. I ended up having the crescent cut off and a regular style recoil pad installed.
My carbine does not like the Speer Gold Dot 270 whatsoever. Neither does it like the Sierra Silhouette bullet or the 250 gr. Nosler Partition.
No luck with 300 grainers either. The heaviest bullet so far that was fair is the Hdy 265 gr.
Two bullets are absolute tops. The Nosler 200 gr HP and the Hdy 240 gr XTE. The Nosler gets pushed with W-296 the Hdy with H-110 I got a fixed 4X on it.
What is the point of Life if you can't have fun.

Offline pigguy

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2008, 10:53:14 AM »
I am going to the big gun show in Tulsa saturday, for the sole purpose of buying one of these awesome guns! has anybody shot the leverevolution ammo thru them?This is the round I shoot thru my superredhawk, and it luvs em.Hope to take my 1st deer with a handgun this year with this load.Seems the golddot is a heavy favorite,but would like to shoot the same loads in both guns.Thanks for the help yall.see ya at wannamachers saturday!

Offline pigguy

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2008, 12:27:48 PM »
well got one today at wannamachers for $435, tried some bargain handloads,wouldnt cycle,put in some leverevolution 225 grn,didnt cycle 1 round.put in 300 grn castcores( federal), shot without a hickup!!! and a nice 3" group off hand at 30 yds,cant wait for opening day here in okieland,yeehaw.GO SOONERS!

Offline Hank08

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2008, 07:17:06 AM »
I won mine along with 10 boxes of Norma special carbine load 240 gr triple jacketed flat pt. .44s in a pistol shoot sometime in the 1970s but I think it was made in the 60s.  It shot the Norma load very well and so did my Super Blackhawk.  Mostly though I shoot Lyman 429421 250 gre. cast with 22 grs. of H110 or 296, shoots great in both pistol and carbine.  I have a old Weaver 2x scope on the carbine.  I don't think Norma makes that load anymore but it was an awesome killer on deer.  Choroned
1500 from my 71/2 Super.
H08

Offline federali

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Re: A tale of two Ruger carbines
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2008, 05:09:10 AM »
I have a Deer Stalker carbine from the early 70s. I've taken a bunch of deer with it in New York's Catskills, using 240 grain Winchesters almost exclusively. I found that my particular carbine would not reliably feed Remington 240 grain HPs as the broad flat point would sometimes catch at the top of the chamber. No such problem with Winchesters. I stopped using the carbine when a change of hunting venues to a different part of the state increased the chances for really long shots in addition to the woodsy shots.

I think Bill Ruger was motivated to build his carbine along the lines of the M-1 carbine which everybody loved to own and shoot but whose cartridge really wasn't enough for big game.