New member - and questions on my old H & R shotgun

[SweetD]

Hi Folks,

My name is Dave, and I am a brand new poster to this forum.  I've been lurking and searching for a while, trying to gather some information before asking questions.  I have inherited an old H & R 12g single barrel shotgun.  It was literally found propped in the corner of my grandfather's dirt-floor basement at the old family homestead in upstate NY in 1995 shortly after he passed.  I'm sure it was a true "farmer's gun" that spent most of it's working life behind the kitchen door, at the ready.  It is in fair condition - i.e. - mechanically sound (except badly cracked stock) and shoot-able.  Not great cosmetically. 

I would like to give a shot (pun intended) at a bit of refurbishing.  I am by no means a gunsmith or even a real shotgun hobbyist - mostly air guns as a matter of fact.  I realize the gun has little monetary value.  It has great sentimental value to me, as my grandfather (probably like many of yours) was an important part of my life in my early years.

Here is the information off of the gun:

Left side stamped "Harrington & Richardson Arms Co. Worcester, MA USA Pat. FEB 27, 1900

Top of barrel stamped: 12 GA Choke

I have some pictures I will attempt to post here.  My questions are:

Can anyone help ID the year of this gun?  I think it is "pre" whatever the published list dates back to.

Is there a model number or name for this model?

Are there parts available?  For example, as you can see, the stock is severely cracked.  I would like to attempt to fix it, but could I purchase another if I had to?  The stock plate is broken.

Is there a source somewhere for an exploded diagram of this gun?

How does the for-end disassemble from this gun?


Now for some pictures:



















Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks very much!

Dave

[quickdtoo]

Welcome Dave! I have one that looks pretty much identical to it, but there's no serial number on it, my Granddad bought it in the mid '20s, so I can't tell ya when it was actually made, but the design has been around since the late 1800s. The forend comes off with a stout pull away from the barrel, it has a spring detent that goes over a notched stud on the bottom of the barrel. Mine has seen lots of use, my Dad used it when he was a kid, as did I, I camoed it in the mid '90s and Dad killed his first and only turkey with it at 79yrs of age with a standard 2¾" #6 pheasant load.

Tim

[stimpylu32]

Dave

Welcome , I see a dimond in the rough there , you may want to check Brownells for parts like the plastic butt plate , they also have schmatics for the older H&R's . ( at least they did at one time )

As Tim said the design has been around a long time so one of the newer shoulder stocks should fit it also , give it a good cleaning inside and out after sitting that long , and you should have a nice shooter there .

stimpy

[quickdtoo]

The newer stocks may be modified to fit, I've never removed mine, but the frame has top and bottom tangs that are inletted into the stock, a side lever barrel release, and a real steel trigger guard. Numrich would be the only source for parts I would imagine.

Tim

www.e-gunparts.com

[PHATINJUN]

There is a Fajien stock on gun broker that has good pictures to see what it should look like on the inletting that Tim refers to also a frame from the same time frame as your gun might give you some answers as to model #. The stock is a little pricey but it is a old custom made one. Kurt

[SweetD]

Guys,

Many thanks for the welcome and replies!

Kurt, I just looked up that stock on guntrader - looks very similar.  Kind of steep, and the auction ends in an hour of course!

I was able to get at the gun for a few minutes tonight.  I removed that tape around the stock - ancient stuff with some major black, tar-like gunk underneath.  Managed to carefully scrape a good bit of it away.  The stock is certainly heavily cracked, but seems possibly repairable.  I have some fiberglass repair experience which might come in handy in that regard...

I also have a co-worker that is very knowledge-able with firearms - so he has a lot to offer with advice.

Here's a rookie question - how does the stock disassemble from the frame?  I removed the forend, removed the barrel, and after removing that nasty tape, I was able to twist the broken stock just enough to be able to see what I think is a bolt holding the stock and frame together, but I have no idea how I would get to that fastener - ?

Thanks again guys - this is going to be fun.

Dave

[quickdtoo]

If it's like modern stocks, there's a bolt that can be reached with an extension and 9/16" or 14mm socket after you remove the butt plate.

Tim

[SweetD]

Thanks Tim -

I thought of removing the butt plate after I was done with it for the evening.  Shows you how much I know!  I'll check it out later - thanks again.

Dave

[stimpylu32]

Sorry Dave , I forgot about those little tangs on the older frames were the butt stock fits up . I do have a plastic butt plate if you need another one , and judging by the pics , you do , if you want it , its yours . send me a PM with your address and I'll get it in the mail .

Richard

[SweetD]

Richard,

Email sent - thanks very much!

Dave

[PHATINJUN]

Yes it is a little pricey I can't check it from work but I think he has a researve price on it and a buy it now for $65. I think he has been trying to sell it for awhile. Fajien is or was one of the premier stock makers . I think but don't know that it was probly custom made yrs ago. That is probly a decent price for it if someone was looking for just such a beast but kind of hard to put on and old athough important farm gun. Welcome aboard. Kurt

[Cookiemann]

I can't help with your question.  I just wanted to say Welcome aboard. 

cookiemann

[jlchucker]

It looks just like my grandfather's, which seems to have been a model 1908.  Gramp's gun had a broken stock as well.  I had my gunsmith go over it, and he was able to fashion a Savage or newer H & R stock onto it, because he couldn't find a replacement.  The resulting drop is nearly that of an old muzzle loader.   It's mechanically OK to shoot but would probably kick like a mule with a drop like that.  Later, my brother found an identical model at a gun shop--only in 16 gage.  Except for worn bluing, it's perfect in every way.  These are good old guns, but hard to find wood for.  In the old days they were most likely the average farmer's mainstay--in spite of what you read in the gun magazines.

[SweetD]

All-
Thanks for the great replies.  Based on what I have been able to find on-line, it looks like this is a Model 1908, manufactured between 1916-1931 most likely.  I did disassemble the gun.

As I stated before, all mechanicals seem in good shape.  My number one goal is to keep the gun original.  The worst damage is to the stock:



It's cracked pretty good.  You can definitely give it a twist and open her up pretty good.  It's intact however - it is not completely split in half or in parts.  There is one piece that comes apart from the rest, but when "squeezed" against the receiver, it still fits tightly.

Now the $60k question - can anyone recommend an outfit that can do a quality repair on the stock?





Frame and forend are in good shape overall:







I cleaned up the thru-bolt that runs thru the stock to the receiver - it's about the only thing that shines on the gun at this point:



Found the serial # under all of that tape:




Finally, take a look at this link:  http://www.joesalter.com/detail.php?f_qryitem=3579

Questions:  Would this gun be good for replacement parts on mine?  Is it a good price?

Thanks again for all of the replies - and to emphasize -

Can anyone recommend a source for rebuilding the gun stock?

Regards,

Dave

[Alice Cooper]

if you just want to make the stock solid, and not pristine,devcon two part epoxy works wonders.I repaired a few old remington stocks for a guy that just wanted them functional.one was split all the way from the forearm down thru the trigger guard in five splits, like opening the pages of a book!using electrical tape as a non bonding "dam"on the outside surface of the stock,I seeped epoxy into the cracks, holding a match close to the epoxy over the really hairline cracks to thin it and make it wick into the crevices.pulling the tape off 24 hours later, the epoxy was flush with the surface,filling up all the spaces left from missing splinters of wood.and it didn't look half bad!I suspect it's much stronger now than when new.

[PHATINJUN]

I would not worry about sending it out for repair anything they will do you can do use epoxy or gorrila polyuathane glue... tape like suggested you can sand or file off whatever you don't like.PS your grandfather would of done it that way had he had those products availible to him I suspect all he had to work with would of been a hide glue or elmers white and cloth electrical tape you can do this!! Look at it again you certainly can't screw it up any worse Kurt

[PHATINJUN]

By the way since your new here I'll give you a break. But you must post warning when posting pics of old H&R forearms with steel spacers on them as it causes much drool on the Handi key boards Kurt

[stimpylu32]

By the way since your new here I'll give you a break. But you must post warning when posting pics of old H&R forearms with steel spacers on them as it causes much drool on the Handi key boards Kurt

You got that right , those suckers are getting hard to find . 

stimpy

[b44mag]

welcome aboard dave i had a old savage the stock was cracked about the same i put good wood glue inside the crack predrilled and countersunk little brass screws hand tight till the glue ran out wiped it down with a damp rag i used that gun for 10 years my buddy still dose worked for me maybe it will work for you be sure to drill holes where the tip of the screw dosent interfear with any workings of the barrel release and you should be fine good luck
                                                                                                                                                   b44mag

[STUMPJMPR]

Here is a good source for parts....I found them to be fairly reasonable in the past....

http://www.e-gunparts.com/dept.asp#TheHs

[kevinsmith5]

Having spent considerable time and energy restoring my grandfathers model 97 12 Gauge (it actually had been his father's before that) I can say do the best work you possibly can. I have a lot of experience in refinishing gunstocks and old wooden furniture and would recommend looking at furniture refinishing products to match the wood grain color as closely as possible. Some of the Thompson furniture repair kits (especially the ones rated for chair legs) would be very strong and match the color of the wood grain).

As for the actually mechanical parts of the frame and action I'd take it to a gunsmith for them to look at. Don't take it to some place like Dick's sporting goods either. Take it to some old guy with a strong southern accent or maybe German that works out of a shed behind his house. This gun is going to be a family heirloom long after you are dead if you do this work right so that even someone who doesn't like guns can see it and say "oh what a lovely antique" (my city girl wife still doesn't connect the '97 with dead squirrels and quail).

[johnnybravoo77]

This place probaly has what you need.    http://www.gun-parts.com/stocks/