Author Topic: Any Traditional Shotgunners Here? (Read 1174 times)

Dan Chamberlain · « **on:** July 20, 2003, 01:55:09 PM »

Hey, hope there are. I have a nice Pedersoli double 12 and I have some questions for knowlegable shotgun shooters.

The barrels are chrome lined and supposedly rated for steel. This doesn't mean you load them like lead - straight down the pipe with no shot cup does it?

Second, will steel in a shotcup pass through full chokes with no damage?

I'm thinking about trying to take a goose out of my favorite farmer's corn field this fall and darn, even when you are no where near water, you still have to shoot that infernal steel shot! He also has a little creek that runs through his property that I ocassionally jump a duck out of.

Any takers?

Dan C

1860 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 21, 2003, 03:12:33 AM »

Dan,

I have the same gun, probably, you can't just load steel in there without a cup rated for steel. Your biggest problem will be loading one through a full choke tube, they can be hard to start. I use mine for deer, buckshot and xfull choke, I start the cup and keep the shot in a dime wrapper which I just stuff down, then an overshot cad, works well.

1860

Dan Chamberlain · « **Reply #2 on:** July 21, 2003, 04:54:47 AM »

1860;

Thanks. So if I understand your method, you start the plastic cup with the chokes in place, and then pour the shot in after the cup has been started, or do you insert the dime wrapper as well? Also, that steel trying to force its way past the choke when firing, doesn't present a problem? Thanks.

Dan C

1860 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 21, 2003, 05:08:59 AM »

Yes, I start the cup by itself, with a healthy glob of lube, If I'm using small shot I pour it in from the wrapper, the buck I just stuff in the cup, wrapper and all. They are heavy enough that the wrapper doesn't effect the pattern. I can't say for sure about the effects of steel, but it's probably just like one of those newfangled cartridge guns. The Pedersoli is a quality firearm, just get cups rated for steel, they are different from the regular ones.. If I could cook a goose I'd try it myself but they turn out like old boots when I try it... :roll:

1860

KING · « **Reply #4 on:** July 21, 2003, 06:51:18 PM »

I would not even bother with the steel shot. I would get the bismuth shot,or the new composite shot. Load em like lead,and you are all set. It is a little more expensive that steel,but,lots heavier......stay sfe........king

Dan Chamberlain · « **Reply #5 on:** July 22, 2003, 02:04:17 AM »

I thought I'd read that these shots were harder than lead and had to be loaded more like steel? Is there a reference you can point me to? Thanks

Dan C

KING · « **Reply #6 on:** July 22, 2003, 06:51:07 AM »

Dan.+ If I remember corectly the first stuff that came out in Bismuth was a little hard,and that was several years ago. Two years ago I talked with a rep,and he said that there would not be a problem with the Bismuth in the ML shotgun. I still would use a shotcup ,but I get mine out of the cataloges and load it without a cup for moderate ranges like out to 30 yards. I have not experianced any problems with it as of yet. It hits hard also. I have been using the factory shotshells in my old 16 ga. model 12 and it works outstandingly well in size 7.5 & 6. At present I have a call out to Olin corp in ref to this question soooooooooooooooooooooo....maybe they can shed some light on it for us. I hope...........stay safe........King

KING · « **Reply #7 on:** July 22, 2003, 08:25:41 AM »

Talked with the reps and the R & D guys at Bismuth Corp. Information is as follows ref the hardness scalefor shot. Lead is 13.........Bismuth is 18............steel shot is 110 and tungsten is about 296. As long as you have the proper shot and powder charge go fer it. For what it is worth,I use 100 of 2f and an over powder wad,and a fibre wad,then a charge of 1 1/2 oz shot volume(bismuth),and then a over shot wad. I never had a problem out to 30 yards with this on ducks and a few geese,which is about the max I would shoot at them anyway. I hope that this helps anyone that is interested,and wants to keep steel out of thier shooting sports for waterfowl. I reread my last post and I said" moderate ranges of 30 yards,"I cant remember shooting over 40 with any type of shotgun for waterfowl. Dont like cripples getting away. ..................Sorry..............Stay safe........................King

daddywpb · « **Reply #8 on:** July 22, 2003, 01:22:14 PM »

I'm glad to see there are other shotgun shooters out there. Mine isn't traditional (one of those nasty inlines), but I sure do have fun with it. My daughter and I took it rabbit hunting last weekend. Now we have one more rabbit in the freezer - she shot it with her .22. I kicked up a lot of dirt, and made a pleasant amount of smoke though!

Dan Chamberlain · « **Reply #9 on:** July 23, 2003, 01:44:28 AM »

Thanks for all the input and effort. It looks like Bismuth is the way to go. It's more expensive...but then what isn't now a day. I bought my Pedersoli double from Cabela's 18 months ago for about $500 including tax and shipping. They are now over $600!!! Glad I got mine when the windfall came in.

Dan C

crow_feather · « **Reply #10 on:** July 23, 2003, 07:34:14 AM »

also, If you e-mail Pedersoli, the give you an article written for their shotguns that tells about buck n ball - steel shot, and round ball loads - I have a 10 guage kit that I put together - easy to do - and I have a blast shooting clays. The people at pedersoli are really decent when you write to them.

C F

crow_feather · « **Reply #11 on:** July 23, 2003, 07:56:23 AM »

you should read the federal law regarding steel shot - they talk about the "shell" containing the shot.

C F

KING · « **Reply #12 on:** July 23, 2003, 12:36:06 PM »

For what it is worth guys,a ML is not exempt from the non toxic shot laws for waterfowl. I know that the regs say "shell" and a ML does not have one,but it still has to use non toxic shot. I know..........I used to chase violaters all the time. Stay safe.......King. Besides.......That Bismuth I think out performs lead............

crow_feather · « **Reply #13 on:** July 23, 2003, 05:21:56 PM »

King,
I do believe your comment - it's too bad they worded the law that way because it leaves enough out there to make hard heads like me think there might be a chance to use the cheaper - yes I'm cheap - lead shot.

Where I live - the state law covers what the Feds left up for interpretation.

Thanks for the facts

C F

KING · « **Reply #14 on:** July 23, 2003, 06:12:15 PM »

C.F. ............... I dont really think that you are cheap at all. I think that you are someone that wants to enjoy his sport of ML as much as possible and still be legal. I have to give you a lot of credit for that,and respect Many years ago steel shot was required only in the 12ga for waterfowl. I was using a 20ga for ducks and geese,and for that matter still do a lot of waterfowling with that gauge.(1200fps is still 1200 fps regardless of gauge) I remember when I was using my 12 s/s ML for ducks and one of the DNR guys came by(we are all in law enforcement). We got into a discussion of the ML effects on ducks and geese and the best size of shot,etc. You know how it goes. At any rate,I mentioned that there was not a whole lot of differance,lead is still lead,and my buddy from the DNR mentioned that the laws dictated the wording as of " gun will hold no more than three(3) shells for waterfowl and that the shells must be loaded with steel(at that time). I was not using a loaded shell so ,inturn I was exempt. The more I looked into it( this was many years ago) the wording in some places was consistant with non toxic shot ,the word "shell" was not mentioned...............soooooooooooooooo. It was changed that it reads all waterfowling will be done with non-toxic shot. Wish I had the regs in front of me,but I dont,and it is late,and I am tired. But.................There is nothing........nothing in this world like the big boom from a front stuffer,and a goose or mallard heading for the last splash,and my labs heading for it. I really like the bismuth,and it has left my ml waterfowling days open for me. Stay safe. .......King

crow_feather · « **Reply #15 on:** July 24, 2003, 04:39:31 AM »

King,

I had 28 years in the business myself. When I hit 50, I retired and moved to Idaho. I think Ma Nature was born here. Or when they asked God to pretty up a state - he chose Idaho. Anyhow, I tend to agree about the sound, smell, and visual effects of black powder shooting. While us Trads are slowly being burried under the deluge of the more modern rifles and shotguns, future generations will once again feel the urge to relive the history of the Hawken and smooth stuffers.

Hope I'm around to see it.