45-120

[tykempster]

So I plan on reaming out a Buffalo Classic to 45-120.  I saw you guys are the experts on all things H&R, so I came here with a couple questions:

1. What is the thickest/best recoil pad available that will fit the Buffalo Classic?  It's fine if it's grind to fit, I just wasn't sure if the BC butt was an odd size.  I also have longish arms, so being extra thick will help with LOP.

2. Is a recoil reducer very much better than some lead in the stock?  How much weight can I add to the stock? 

3. Looking at the forend, it's very small.  Is there any room to add weight anywhere other than the stock?

4. How much elevation does the Williams Target sight with the knobs have?  I definitely want to replace the sight, and a tang sight mounted on the wrist seems a bit fragile for hunting, although it offers plenty of elevation.  The Williams Target looks to be easy to adjust with the knobs, as long as it will get me out there a ways.  I'm looking to be able to get to at least 600 yards.

5. Does anyone make a nice aftermarket stock for H&Rs?  I would like something better for handling recoil possibly, but still a more classic looking stock.

6. Anything else I forgot?

Thanks a bunch for helping,
Tyler

[quickdtoo]

Welcome aboard Tyler! All of those questions are answered in the FAQs and Help sticky including a warning not to add weight to the forend, spend some time in there, if you don't find what you want, be sure to ask. 

The FP-Target sight with a .404" 17A front sight is good to 600yds+ with 500gr cast bullet as you'll see in the long range sights links.

Stocks are available from GBO sponsor www.gunstocksinc.com as well as Boyd's laminated thumbhole stocks from H&R, all H&R stocks will fit the BC, it uses the same SB2 frame as the Handi.

Tim
(aka wrongtarget)

[tykempster]

Thanks for the quick response! (Just noticed you were wrongtarget, I keep running into the same people ) I have lots of reading to do.  A 10 lb gun for $400 with the power of a Lott?  Oh yeah!

I looked at the gunstocksinc.com website, how come the stocks don't have a good fit with the rear of the action?  Also looked at Boyds, but had trouble locating anything.

[quickdtoo]

You won't find the Boyd's stock at Boyd's, they're only available from H&R and one other Boyd's dealer on Ebay, see the link in the FAQs Let's see some Handis, there's about 7 pages of pics. The fit of the GSI stocks is up to you, they come unfinished, there's a pic of a GSI stock on a BC in the link below, plus recoil pad info, dunno if it's one of the links on pads in the FAQs, but it has some good info. Search is your friend!!

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,100287.msg1098263925.html#msg1098263925

[knight0334]

the BC's  have a curved butt plate - so you'll have to cut it square to use the aftermarket recoil pads available.   Another option is to use a slip on type like I think Quick has.

I recommend NOT adding weight to the forearm because it may result in breaking off the mounting lug from the barrel.

I couldn't tell ya if those mercury recoil things help, never used one.  But filling the stock full of lead does help.  Any additional weight will help with recoil.

[tykempster]

Wow, I love that stock and forend in the link you gave.  I think the cheekpiece may require a lot of sanding down to use with sights though.

[tykempster]

Do I need a small or medium grind to fit Limbsaver?

[quickdtoo]

Small for any H&R stock including the BC.

Tim

[tykempster]

Is the H&R action close to a Ruger #1? 

"A shooting partner of mine rechambered a No. 1 in 45-70 to 45-120. He kept loading it to higher and higher velocities and had to quit as to the brutal recoil. It was basically a 7 lb 458 Lott. He also had no pressure signs. I think he stopped right around 2200 fps with a 500 gr Hornady."

"I have a .45-120 in a Ruger #1 and have loaded as high as 90 grs. of IMR-3031 (I don't recommend it), 96 grs. of WW785 with good results. Recoil can be described as "vicious" with the heavy loads. I ABSOLUTELY WOULD NOT LOAD ANY .45-120 TO THESE PRESSURES IF YOUR NOT USING THE RUGER #1 OR EQUIVELANT ACTION. None of the Sharps reproductions have the strength to take these loads. All my loads were with the Hornady 500 gr. FMJ's."

"I have a converted 45-120 Ruger #1 (actually rebarreled with a heavier barrel). I load 300 grain bullets with a mid load for the 458 Lott. Action opens easily and brass pings right out with no pressure signs. This is with Norma brass.

Haven't tried any heavier bullets in it yet, but I know the gun is strong enough."

[knight0334]

Is the H&R action close to a Ruger #1? 

"A shooting partner of mine rechambered a No. 1 in 45-70 to 45-120. He kept loading it to higher and higher velocities and had to quit as to the brutal recoil. It was basically a 7 lb 458 Lott. He also had no pressure signs. I think he stopped right around 2200 fps with a 500 gr Hornady."

"I have a .45-120 in a Ruger #1 and have loaded as high as 90 grs. of IMR-3031 (I don't recommend it), 96 grs. of WW785 with good results. Recoil can be described as "vicious" with the heavy loads. I ABSOLUTELY WOULD NOT LOAD ANY .45-120 TO THESE PRESSURES IF YOUR NOT USING THE RUGER #1 OR EQUIVELANT ACTION. None of the Sharps reproductions have the strength to take these loads. All my loads were with the Hornady 500 gr. FMJ's."

"I have a converted 45-120 Ruger #1 (actually rebarreled with a heavier barrel). I load 300 grain bullets with a mid load for the 458 Lott. Action opens easily and brass pings right out with no pressure signs. This is with Norma brass.

Haven't tried any heavier bullets in it yet, but I know the gun is strong enough."

The NEF/H&R's are not Ruger #1 strength guns, but can handle Marlin levergun pressure loads easily.    You will find a few NEF/H&R's that will take the lower Ruger #1 pressure loads, but for the most part they should be avoided.

[tykempster]

Does anyone have quickload so they can run some pressures?  As in what powder for the best velocity at 40k pressures with 300, 400, 500 grain bullets?

[knight0334]

Does anyone have quickload so they can run some pressures?  As in what powder for the best velocity at 40k pressures with 300, 400, 500 grain bullets?

Given the nature of the beast, I'd keep pressures closer to 35-36K PSI.   Pressure isn't the only thing you have to worry about, but recoil and rearward thrust as well.   Forearm mounting lugs on the barrel have been known to snap off with too much recoil.  And the violent thrust of the recoil can damage the underlug where it pivots on the the receiver pin.

With 35-36K being mid level #2/marlin levergun area with a 45-70, to get that high with a huge 45-120 case in pressure you have to be really launching some serious lead or kicking a lightweight one really really fast - if you're doing either, you're into some seriously heavy recoil and trust.


http://www.accuratearms.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Rifle/ObsoleteCartridges/45%20120%20Sharps%20Straight%20page%20365.pdf

[Smokin Joe]

If you want a .458 Lott, buy one. Here's approved data for the .45-120:

http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Rifle/ObsoleteCartridges/45%20120%20Sharps%20Straight%20page%20365.pdf


I'm not being snotty or facetious........if you load to Ruger #1 pressure, you're looking at gun damage at the least and injury at the worst. With the capacity of the 120, you can load to lower pressures and still get performance that will poleaxe anything in the world.

[tykempster]

I wasn't sure if this was safe in an H&R, that's why I asked.

I thought since the capacity was greater, pressures would be lower, possibly low enough for H&R actions.  I wish there was any easy source for loads (other cartridges) for a 45-120 at higher pressure. 

[Smokin Joe]

The pressure will be lower due to the increased capacity. That's the secret; same amount of powder equals the same amount of gas. You might start with Ruger # 1 .45-70 loads (using medium burn-rate powders) and work up slowly.

[tykempster]

I read that you don't see "pressure signs" until well over 60k pressures.  If I started from Ruger #1 loads, what would I be looking for as far as when to stop?  My shoulder my not take a ton of 45-120, but my lead sled will.

I will be needing filler too, I usually use cotton balls for my 45-70/Unique loads, is there anything better?

[quickdtoo]

Sorry fellas,  but this thread is locked due to the discussion of unpublished and possibly unsafe reloading info.

Tim