FBI NICS Brady check, 4473 rant- don't get upset with me

[bluebayou]

Just a little rant here:

First off, I know that some of you don't like my employer, WalMart.  Please save the WalMart hate for a different post.

Alright, when people come in to purchase a gun they have to complete a 4473 and someone from the store calls into the FBI's NICS call center.  The FBI determines if a purchase is "proceed, denied, delayed". 

The FBI does!  This has NOTHING to do with WalMart versus YOUR gunstore.  I have NO IDEA why you got delayed or denied.  I dont' have access to that information.  I have no input into the decision.  I have no influence on the decision.  You supply the answers, I relay the answers, and the FBI's call center guy reads the reply on the screen. 

Maybe the state DMV computer is down today, maybe there is another person with your name in that town, maybe you got a new license, I HAVE NO IDEA!!!!!!!!!

It mystifies me how it is WalMart's fault or my fault that the FBI gave a "delayed" or "denied".  The fact that you have bought guns in the past at "regular gunstores with no problems" means NOTHING.  As of TODAY, RIGHT NOW, the FBI will not permit the transfer of a gun. 

And no, you don't get to have the form back when it is denied.  I don't care if it has your personal information on it.  It is a federal record after you fill it out. 

A guy this week really got to me.  "No" wasn't good enough, he wanted to call the NICS center.  He wanted to use the NICS phoneline (we have a dedicated line).  He wanted to "get this straightened out right now".  Of course the whole time he is implying that a) I am stupid or b) I am incompetent. 

Got news for you pal, if there was a way to straighten it out right now.........then they would have just given you a proceed........

[powderman]

BLUEBAYOU. Well said, and true. I work there too. POWDERMAN. 

[DalesCarpentry]

When I moved back here to Pa I went down to the DMV and had my drivers license changed over to a Pa license. Maybe a few months later I was in a gun store and found a rifle I liked and wanted to buy. I filled out all the paper work. He made the phone call and I was told that I could not buy the gun right now. He said they needed to do more checking on me and he would give me a call with in a couple days. He called me the next day and said I could come down and pick up my rifle. I just figured there must of been some kind of glitch that prevented me from buying that day. Well a few months later I went to Gander Mountain and the had a Handi 30-06 that looked new on the used gun rack. They only wanted $126.00 for it and it came with a cheap scope. You know that rifle was going to follow me home. I filled out the paper work again and they made the same call. They first turned me down again. I explained to the lady at Gander I went through this same crap a few months ago and the sale went through the next day. She explained this to the person on the phone. Then she ask me if I had my social security card on me. Seems like it had something to do with my SS card. They approved the sale and I took the Handi home. I had problems every time I tried to buy a gun until I had to renew my drivers license. When I went to the DMV to renew it they guy asked if I had my social security card on me. I said yes. He checked it against their records and it was one digit off. He corrected the error and I have not had a problem buying a gun since. Dale

[rex6666]

I have never bought a gun at Wal-Mart not that i wouldn't, I have bought several guns or had them
shipped to my favorite gun store, some times they go right through some time we get a delay that last
1 hour or 20hrs. This is not the store problem no matter what store, some times things get in
a wad. I know what is on my record, also know their is no reason why i can't buy, so i don't
get excited unless it is one of those guns i just can't wait to hear it go POP.

[GRIMJIM]

I did some stupid stuff as a kid and sometimes my purchases will get delayed longer than the usual waiting period. Sometimes not though, I have no idea why, maybe it depends on how new the officer going over the application is.

[TribReady]

I remember my first purchase after NCIS went into affect. Rem 870 from a hardware/sporting goods store.  The guy just told me it was "Delayed" - at the time I didn't know how common it was. Well it made me pretty mad that some guy/gal at some desk in some city was deciding if I can purchase a gun or not.  I joined the NRA soon after--just to have someone to be a voice for us.  I know the NRA isn't perfect either, but I do think it helps having them out there.

There's so little we can do actually, and my fear is that it will get worse.  Of course, there's nothing the salesman or store can do either. 

One thing you can say when they complain is the store (Walmart) doesn't want this transaction to fail either. Walmart doesn't make any money when the NCIS check fails.  Walmarts goal is to get product into the customers hands...period

[AtlLaw]

I've not had anything but a proceed on my purchases so I have little experience with the other possible answers.  However, I've received a number of calls from these instant check people checking on the status of cases.  So I know if you get a "delayed" response to your "application" to purchase a firearm there is some glitch they actually make an effort to check on.  I'm sure that you tell the purchaser what is happening and what the possible scenarios are so he can complete his purchase.

My question is on a "denied" response.  And I'm asking this out of ignorance; I'm not trying to start an argument or being critical.  If the response you get is "denied," what are the purchaser's options and do you tell him what they are like you would if the response was "delayed."

[SHOOTALL]

I was delayed at Dick's Sports and they furnished me a phone number to call . I called  gave them my name then SS number they informed me a felon in OK had used my SS number . As he was in jail i was informed that the sale could proceed . I returned to the store and everything went OK .
It has never happened since . The system worked . Wally world may need to provide better training as to who to call for help when things ain't as smooth as we like . If they can train to film  all gun buyers then they should be able to post a phone # and teach the floor people where it is .

[victorcharlie]

It is an awkward situation at best, and I've had to deal with a few of these.  There are things you can do and say to defuse the situation.

I have the appeals form ready before telling the customer they've been denied.

So, I usually start with I'm sorry Mr. Doe, but you've been denied.  However, there is an appeals process.  If you read the back of the form, (which I turn over and point to), it will explain the process.  You will need to fill out the rest of the form and fax it to this number.

I've had several requests that have been denied, approved  later, and some times TICS calls several days afterward and approves them.

One thing about retail, the customers always right, and never take things personally.  Some times a simple "I'm really very sorry", or a response such as "I'm sure you can get this resolved", is what the customer needs to hear.  It's at times such as these that good customer service goes a long way.

[bluebayou]

I've not had anything but a proceed on my purchases so I have little experience with the other possible answers.  However, I've received a number of calls from these instant check people checking on the status of cases.  So I know if you get a "delayed" response to your "application" to purchase a firearm there is some glitch they actually make an effort to check on.  I'm sure that you tell the purchaser what is happening and what the possible scenarios are so he can complete his purchase.

My question is on a "denied" response.  And I'm asking this out of ignorance; I'm not trying to start an argument or being critical.  If the response you get is "denied," what are the purchaser's options and do you tell him what they are like you would if the response was "delayed."

I think that most know before they try to purchase a firearm if they are going to be denied.  Out of a conservative estimate of 2000 firearms sold by me in the last 3 years, I have had 2 "denied".  In Oklahoma at least, most of the firearms were purchased by women.  The wife supposedly picks out the firearm and pays for it.  As a firearm can be gifted to a spouse then.....what do you do?  Do you ask, "oh, are you buying this because your husband is a felon?"  If in doubt............we just declined to sell them a firearm.  THAT causes more conflict than anything else. 

The worst is the two guys at 9:30 on Saturday night scenario:  We stop selling at 10:00 pm and one guy is obviously buying it for the other guy, or one guy's ID doesn't match what he writes on the 4473 for his address.............

Anyway, to answer your question, if someone is denied then I handle it the same as with cigarettes or alcohol, "I am sorry, but....."  Most know that they are going to get denied I am sure.  If they genuinely seem shocked or upset, then I hand them the pamphlet from the FBI. 

This guy that got pissed about the delayed, well I still think that he was just blaming WalMart more than anything.

[bluebayou]

It is an awkward situation at best, and I've had to deal with a few of these.  There are things you can do and say to defuse the situation.

I have the appeals form ready before telling the customer they've been denied.

So, I usually start with I'm sorry Mr. Doe, but you've been denied.  However, there is an appeals process.  If you read the back of the form, (which I turn over and point to), it will explain the process.  You will need to fill out the rest of the form and fax it to this number.

I've had several requests that have been denied, approved  later, and some times TICS calls several days afterward and approves them.

One thing about retail, the customers always right, and never take things personally.  Some times a simple "I'm really very sorry", or a response such as "I'm sure you can get this resolved", is what the customer needs to hear.  It's at times such as these that good customer service goes a long way.

I appreciate the advice, I just get frustrated by trying to help someone out and having them blame me personally for something that logically I cannot control. 

I think that I could have been more helpful to this guy, but it was 6:45 and I was working 9:00 to 7:00 that day.  I probably was a little short with him to be honest.

What really stinks is that we got a "proceed" later last week.  He had already bought the shotgun at another store.  Of course he got a proceed from the OTHER store, so............"WalMart wouldn't sell him the gun, blah, blah, its his fault, blah, blah". 

Not a good transaction all around. 

Whatever the problem was at NICS got resolved and coincidentally this other transaction that the guy initiated benefited from it...........oh, well.  Going to be more patient with explanations next time. 

[powderman]

HEH. About 2 years ago a woman wanted a shotgun, saying she was going to kill a trespasser, not burglar or thief, a trespasser. Our clerk refused to even show her a gun, she was shocked. POWDERMAN.