Ruger M77 Tang Safety .35 Whelen Twist Rate?

[deltecs]

Does anyone out there know for sure just what the factory .35 Whelen Mark I, Model 77 twist rate is?  I'd like to know.  I'm thinking of buying one and having it rechambered, but it needs to have a 1:10" twist rate for the new chambering.  Any help?

[3DTESTIFY]

Deltecs, according to my chart for twist rates, the Ruger 77 in .35 Whelen is 1 in 16" rate.

[deltecs]

Deltecs, according to my chart for twist rates, the Ruger 77 in .35 Whelen is 1 in 16" rate.

Thanks, could have done with 1:12", but not with 1:16".  This is a real problem with .35 bore calibers.  Most have too slow a twist to stabilize the heavy bullets that reallly make the .35 Whelen a fine big game weapon.  I think this is a carry over from older and slower calibers.  Too bad, really.  Ruger would have done much better to increase the twist rate in this bore.  It is probably fine for 200 gr bullets and under, but I'd have my doubts about stabilizing bullets over 225 gr.  The venerable 9.3x62 Mauser has a normal twist rate of 1:9 1/2".  It stabilizes 320 gr bullets for excellent penetration and reliability.  This comparison is very close to the .35 Whelen and the twist rate for the Whelen should match or exceed the 9.3. 

[Boxhead]

I have a tang 35 Whelen just as you describe and it throws the 250 gr Partition's and Speer's very well at least out to 300 yards. It's a 1" 100 yard gun with the Speer's and a bit larger with the Partition's. If I need heavier, which I haven't, I would bump up to my 9.3x62. That said, I also shoot 250's (Barnes X) in the 9.3. What weight and velocity are you trying to get down that Ruger barrel?

[deltecs]

Was thinking of using one for plains game in Africa sometime next year, I hope.  I'd like to use some 275 and 310 gr bullets.  I plan to handload my own ammo and take with me and see what the bullets do on various game animals.  My intent is to rechamber a Mark I tang safety Ruger to a .350 Howell.  This is a proprietary cartridge from American Hunting Rifles.  The longer neck would assist in holding the bullets better against any recoil compared to the 9.3x62 and not go as far into the powder column for the same action length.  Not that I have any objections whatsoever against the 9.3.  I'd just like to have the .350 Howell for Alaska big game hunting too.  Thanks for the info. 

[45north]

I do have a 35 whelen and it is a 1 in 16 twist brl. and I have no problem getting good accuracy with 250 gr NP bullets. It may not work well with heavier loads I don't know as I have not tried.But a 250 gr. bullet will shoot lengthwise through an adult moose. There is not an animal in this state (Alaska that is) that will stop a broadside shot from this combo. I am not sure what you will be hunting in Africa but it will have to be big to stop a well constucted 250 gr. bullet from a whelen. Barnes TSX, Swift A frame, Speer grand slam, and the for ever young NP. Nosler partition. For hunting the world over you could do worse than the whelen. But for stopping a charge with DG I would choose something bigger much bigger.

45north

[Boxhead]

What 275 and 310 gr bullets are you considering? To each his own but as 45north has pointed out the 250's are plenty and shots can get a bit long with plains game in Africa so do consider that. I am very familar with the Howell line of cartridges but they are more work than I am willing to do for the field ballistic advantage. Call me lazy... This fall I will be taking my Whelen to northern BC for elk, moose and bear and I will be using the 225 gr Barnes TSX with complete confidence. Good luck with your plans and trip.

[deltecs]

I don't know what work there is to the Howell line of cartridges.  A simple rechamber and headspace on an existing rifle.  Brass can be obtained from American Hunting Rifles with appropiate headstamp from Bertram Brass.  Ballistics of the Howell with modern powders duplicate the venerable .350 Rigby Magnum with both the 225 gr and 300 grain bullets, so why wouldn't one use this for a plalins game rifle in Africa?  From talking to and reading by African Professional Hunters in Africa and a very good personal friend born and living in South Africa, who has a pro hunters license, most game in Africa are taken at less than 200 yards.  Both bullets in this weight will be more than adequate at this range for almost all plains game. 

[Nrut]

Thanks, could have done with 1:12", but not with 1:16".  This is a real problem with .35 bore calibers.  Most have too slow a twist to stabilize the heavy bullets that reallly make the .35 Whelen a fine big game weapon.  I think this is a carry over from older and slower calibers.  Too bad, really.  Ruger would have done much better to increase the twist rate in this bore.  It is probably fine for 200 gr bullets and under, but I'd have my doubts about stabilizing bullets over 225 gr. Remington chambers their 35 Whelen in a 1:16 twist barrel...Why does Remington sell factory ammo in the 35 Whelen with 250gr. bullets? The venerable 9.3x62 Mauser has a normal twist rate of 1:9 1/2". My CZ550FS in 9.3X62 has close to 1:14 twist (CZ uses metric) It :stabilizes 320 gr bullets for excellent penetration and reliability.  This comparison is very close to the .35 Whelen and the twist rate for the Whelen should match or exceed the 9.3. 
[/quote]

http://www.uslink.net/~tom1/twistrate.htm 
Plug your 275gr. and 310gr bullet lengths and your vel. into this calculator and what do you come up with?...
My 314gr, 360" cast bullet is 1.315" long and should stabilize down to 2150FPS in a 1:16 twist... I am no saying that you should get a 1:16 twist...You should get what you want and that fine with me if you want a fast twist 35 cal. and heavy bullets...But I have seen a lot on the interweb lately about the 35 Whelen needs a fast twist to do it's job...That's just not so!...esp. with todays bullets..
 

[deltecs]

I realize Greenhill twist rate formula is not exactly 100% accurate, but any figures within the limits do work good.  Using Greenhill's formula with Woodleigh bullets and advertised lengths, I need 1:12" to stabalize the heavy 310 gr bullets.  That is not to say that other twist rates may not, but this twist rate is definitely known to stabilize them.

[Boxhead]

"most game in Africa are taken at less than 200 yards"

That wasn't my experience. Also, I like to buy my brass at about any store hence my like of the standard stuff and not having to move shoulders. Clearly your desires are those of want and not need which is A-OK as I have many things that I do not need.

[Nrut]

deltecs..
I have seen on another forum were a fella had his M70 in 30-06 re-bored to a 35 Whelen...I don't know if the Ruger M77 has enough dia. to be re-bored or not...The people who do this work could tell you and you might even be able to get the 1:10 twist you want....A re-bore is usually cheaper than a new barrel depending on what brand barrel you get...
It is kinda ironic that I have a Ruger #1 with a 1:12 twist and I wish it was a one 1:16 twist as it is usually easier to get a cast bullet to shoot in the slower twists when you get above 2100FPS....I only shot cast in .35 cal. and larger...