Gun storage in a damp area

[petemi]

I built a tool room in the barn for working on equipment, reloading, storing cleaning stuff, leadsled, boresight equip, chrono, spotting scope, sand bags etc.  I built a small, wall hung 6 gun cabinet out of OSB, and an aluminum window sash for the door.  The rack is for ''ready service guns," right now, 3 Handis and a Topper, needed on the spur of the moment to shoot from the barn. The room is insulated and has a 2000 watt electric baseboard heater installed about 4 feet below the gun cab.  The problem is dampness gets in through the old poured concrete half walls and the floor sweats with temperature change.  In addition, the two horses in and out toward the back of the barn also give off a lot of moisture.  Mostly breath condensation in the winter.  I was thinking about venting the top of the cabinet and putting a small heater or light bulbs in the bottom to convect moisture away from the guns.  I don't want to run the baseboard when I'm not working there, I could let them rust and buy new ones in the Spring for that!!  Anybody have any ideas?  Thanks, Pete

[trotterlg]

I have seen these for years, don't know if they work, but they have been around forever, calle golden rod gun saver or something like that.  Larry

http://cgi.ebay.com/Gun-Saver-Dehumidifier-buy-Golden-Rod_W0QQitemZ140234587082QQihZ004QQcategoryZ52501QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1247

[stimpylu32]

I 2nd the Golden Rod , for what you want they will work fine , or if you want something that will work for the whole room look at a small dehumidifier that runs on 110 volt . It will help keep the moisture down for powder & primers .

stimpy

[petemi]

Larry, Thank you bud!  I'll check it out.  Pete

[petemi]

Stimpy, thanks, I think probably both are a great idea.  Wouldn't hurt to keep everything dryer.  The irony is that in the house, we have to run a humidifier in the winter.

[quickdtoo]

Sounds like my basement Pete!! This is what I use, I have to dump the reservoir every day or two, but it works well, I recycle the water, either flush the toilet with it or water the garden. I paid $140 for it at Home Depot 2yrs ago, the normal setting keeps humidity at ~55%, it also provides a little heat in the winter, unfortunately, it does the same in the summer, but it doesn't run as much then either.

Tim

http://www.whirlpool.com/catalog/product.jsp?src=DEHUMIDIFIERS&cat=138&prod=1002

[petemi]

Tim, you guys are fantastic.  Three great answers in not many more minutes.  The worst time is in the Spring.  The room is on the east eave side of the barn.  The morning sun takes the snow off the metal roof, dumps it close to the wall where it melts and refreezes all winter.  It is impossible to shovel, blow or plow and in the Spring it all becomes water.  The barn floor is so cold all winter, it'll still freeze your butt on the 4th of July.

[petemi]

Tim, would that waste water be good for house plants or probably too impure for fish??

[quickdtoo]

I think it's more akin to rain water without the acid!! Might have some mold and mildew spores, possibly some airborne bacteria, may be cleaner than some municipal water supplies....and no chlorine!! 

Tim

[LaOtto222]

In addition to those great ideas, make sure you frequently wipe down the guns with a good rust prohibiter, especially after handling them. I use Break Free CLP, but there are others out there that do a good job. I put an a generous amount (but not too much that it runs off) and let it "dry" for a couple of days. I would keep a soft cloth that had some on it in the gun cabinet and every time I returned it to the cabinet, wipe it down or once a month or so, which ever comes first. At least once a year but maybe more often, take the gun down and put on your favorite preservative on the surfaces you can not get to with a regular wipe down. Good Luck and Good Shooting

[Tencubed]

Petemi:

I read your post carefully but still don't believe I have the full picture of what you are trying to do.  As I understand it you have a tool room with a cabinet containing guns that is in an uninsulated area.  Much of the surface is concrete that stays damp thru most of the year.

If you are just trying to protect the guns you may want to reconsider your storage method.  Having a wood cabinet mounted against damp concrete is going to make for a very wet and difficult to control storage area.  The "Golden Rod" suggested is really a very low wattage heater and does nothing more that add a bit of heat to the area as a small incandescent bulb would.  This device will do nothing to protect the other areas of the shop where reloading components and such are stored.  A dehumidifier is a possible answer but the limited capacity of the smaller units would, I suspect, be overpowered by your conditions judging from your subsequent posts.  These small dehumidifiers can be reasonably expected to remove several pints of moisture from the air each day.  They are not effective at drying really damp rooms that have a continuing source of moisture.  You could build a good size, insulated and sealed, cabinet with one of these in it that would stay dry and protect the items within.  We found that most of the household dehumidifiers have a control that allows setting the humidity to a low of around 40%.  At this level rust can still be a problem.  Adding an after market control that will bring the RH to around 20% seems to work much better.

One of the major problems encountered when trying to keep an area dry is airflow.  You need to have lots of air movement thru a dehumidifier from all parts of the room to move the moisture away from the wet areas and allow it to condense on the cooling coil in the machine.  The use of fans helps but makes for a drafty and noisy area.  If the area is not well sealed up with a membrane seal and allows outside air to enter easily the problem becomes more difficult.  You mention you have livestock in the same building.  This will be a major source of moisture unless their area is well sealed from your storage room.

Question was ask about the uses for dehumidifier condensate.  Whatever is floating around in the air will be in the condensate water.  Generally it is recommended this water be treated as mildly contaminated as dander, hair, pollen, spores and other airborne garbage will be present.  It is definitely not fit for human consumption and I would suspect it would not be good for fish.  Watering grass would seem to be a good use as would flushing the toilet.  An easy solution is to have the dehumidifier drain into a sewer or into a pan and use a condensate pump to pump the liquid outside.

You may be able to find a used walk-in cooler at very low cost from a local HVAC/R company that you can set up in your area.  These are often available as equipment is upgraded.  You don't want/need the refrigeration equipment, just the box.  These seal up well, are heavily insulated and make great small work areas for needs like yours.  A small dehumidifier would keep a good size box very dry.

Mike

[petemi]

Thanks guys, all good thoughts.  Mike, the gun cabinet is on a framed, insulated interior wall. and the room is closed off from the rest of the barn.  During January to March, humidity is near zero here because it is all in ice or ice crystals.  Using a dehumidifyer, I would have to keep the room above freezing when it was working.  That should be Oct - Dec and April and May.  April would be the dampest month with rain and snow and Spring break-up.  I would have to run it all summer also.

[Tencubed]

I can see where you are concerned and have a real problem.  Keeping that cabinet heated would be a big step in the right direction but may not be a real answer to the moisture build up.

I should have mentioned that for a dehumidifier to do a decent job the ambient air temperature needs to be above about 55 DF.  Better if you keep it above 60.  What I did for our RV's over the years was to use a thermostat set up that would turn on the dehumidifier at 60 and at the same time shut off the heater.  When the temperature would fall below 60 the dehumidifier would be shut off and the heater would come on.  This was so I could run both units off one 20 amp circuit.  Maybe you could rig up something along these lines just in that cabinet. 

I have a similar system in place in the small storage room where long term storage guns and other family treasures are kept.  We don't have a moisture problem but keeping the humidity and temperature at a constant level seems to make old books, photographs and such last really well.

Good luck with your project, you might get some good advice from a local HVAC/R technician, they often have experience in this field and are familiar with your area.

Mike

[krod47nw]

Why not start by sealing and insulating the concrete wall?

Kevin

[quickdtoo]

I was gonna mention that but forgot! I sealed my basement with Thoroseal, has worked pretty good now for 21yrs. 

Tim

 http://www.thoroproducts.com/products_waterproofing.htm

[petemi]

Great idea on the humidifier/heater.  I'm a retired electrician and can easily rig up a single pole douple throw switch to turn the heater off and he dehumdifier on or off as needed.  Yeah, I'm putting Dry Loc, Thorough Seal or Thompsons on the concrete.  The floor too.  It is kind of a pain in the butt to do this for 4 or 5 guns, but it will be worth it in the long run for all the other stuff too.

[krod47nw]

Great idea on the humidifier/heater.  I'm a retired electrician and can easily rig up a single pole douple throw switch to turn the heater off and he dehumdifier on or off as needed.  Yeah, I'm putting Dry Loc, Thorough Seal or Thompsons on the concrete.  The floor too.  It is kind of a pain in the butt to do this for 4 or 5 guns, but it will be worth it in the long run for all the other stuff too.

It's a pain in the butt, but only a one time expense, as opposed to running electrical appliances.  Here in Florida where 95% of homes are built out of concrete block, it is common practice to insulate concrete walls.  Most are done with foil faced foam board, either 3/4" or 1" thick.  The foam is an insulation, and the foil is a radiant and vapor barrier.  The more dampness you keep out, the less you will have to get rid of to get the humidity to an acceptable amount.

Kevin

[petemi]

Hi kevin, We already thought of that, and it won't work well with what we've got to deal with.  My Wife, Patty is a Florida Cracker and I lived there 14 years.  In Jacksonville and between Ft. Pierce and Jensen Beach on the Indian River.  Where are you?

[Tencubed]

Great idea on the humidifier/heater.  I'm a retired electrician and can easily rig up a single pole douple throw switch to turn the heater off and he dehumdifier on or off as needed.  Yeah, I'm putting Dry Loc, Thorough Seal or Thompsons on the concrete.  The floor too.  It is kind of a pain in the butt to do this for 4 or 5 guns, but it will be worth it in the long run for all the other stuff too.

Johnson control, and I'm sure some others, make a commercial thermostat that has a SPDT switch rated at 20 Amps @ 120 VAC.  It's a broad range from below freezing to around 120 DF with an adjustable differential.  Makes setting up this sort of system very easy.

Mike

[krod47nw]

Hi kevin, We already thought of that, and it won't work well with what we've got to deal with.  My Wife, Patty is a Florida Cracker and I lived there 14 years.  In Jacksonville and between Ft. Pierce and Jensen Beach on the Indian River.  Where are you?

There are many ways to insulate a concrete wall.  The one I mentioned is just one example.

I am on the other side (West side) of the state, in Inverness (Citrus County).

Kevin