Who will you be voting for for president?

[Cabin4]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

[Cabin4]

I just love it when politicians tell us to "Vote Your Conscious". Its there way of telling you to vote for them if you feel you like them the best. The reality of voting as a voter is, its a strategy to win the most or loose the least for the issues you care about. A vote for Barr is a vote to loose it all since he can't win. Sad but true.

[Sitting Duck]

Why don't you turn on the History Channel and educate yourself as to how and why this nation was created.  You can't miss the correlation between our situation now and their situation then.

It's showing as I type.

I think it would be an eye opener for you.

[Cabin4]

I don't need to watch TV so some talking head today can tell me how the nation was created 232 years ago. I can read the declaration of independance and have, I can read the constitution & its amendments and have and I can read the many letters & papers written by our founding fathers and have. Thats the real education so you know for certain what was said & done. TV shows today love to rewrite history.

Watch TV all you want.

[ironglow]

 I'm with cabin4; sometimes the History channel is accurate..sometimes it is a joke. I am convinced for instance, that the History Channel is incapable
  of relating an objective program on the global warming theory or any Biblical study..even though they TRY to do both !

[powderman]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

[ironglow]

  I just HAVE to "ditto" that, PM..

  Then, if Obama does get elected and our taxes go up..while rights go into the trash, one can tell his children either of two things:

  A) I did my best to stop it !

           ....OR

  B) I helped to get him elected !

[hardertr]

  B) I helped to get him elected !

I am already dreading the day I have to tell my son he is going to Iraq because I voted for George Whocareswhatthepublicthinks Bush....TWICE.

[Dee]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

Barrack Obama, and John McCain are BOTH LIBERALS. Everyone admits that, and everyone knows that. So vote for the liberal already, and stop whining about what other people are doing. There is nothing you can do about it, and you sound like a broken record, which by the way so does your voting method. A liberal votes for a liberal. So powderman, vote liberal. I have never seen some one so relegated to voting out of such fear, that they will vote against one liberal by voting for another liberal. You have become obsessed with an issue that you can do nothing about.

[Cabin4]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

Barrack Obama, and John McCain are BOTH LIBERALS. Everyone admits that, and everyone knows that. So vote for the liberal already, and stop whinning about what other people are doing. There is nothing you can do about it, and your beginning to sound as if you bottle is empty and you mother is not hearing you. A liberal votes for a liberal. Everyone know that also.

Who's bottle is empty?? LOL LOL

And since when is voting for McCain mean your a Liberal? LOL

[bilmac]

I have to change my vote. I was going with McCain but a guy (from this forum) who was going to vote Barr agreed to trade votes with me. He lives in a state where his vote might count, but was fed up with the Republican party so was going to vote for Barr. I live in Wyoming and is is guaranteed that her 3 electoral votes will be Republican, so I will cast my friend's protest vote and he can cast my pragmatic vote. Who knows maybe enough libertarian votes will be cast this year that the Republicans will take notice. The primary system needs to be reformed. Lets all vote on the same day just like the final. Maybe with a runoff for the top 2 or 3 or 4. A few liberal States in the east where Dems were crossing over is what gave us McCain. Time for a change.

[Dee]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

Barrack Obama, and John McCain are BOTH LIBERALS. Everyone admits that, and everyone knows that. So vote for the liberal already, and stop whinning about what other people are doing. There is nothing you can do about it, and your beginning to sound as if you bottle is empty and you mother is not hearing you. A liberal votes for a liberal. Everyone know that also.

Who's bottle is empty?? LOL LOL

And since when is voting for McCain mean your a Liberal? LOL

McCain IS A LIBERAL. Even the republican party says so. If you vote liberal, you ARE liberal. Spin will not change that. In california, you should be used to liberal. Perhaps that's why you don't think McCain is. But ALMOST everyone agrees that he is. He and Fiengold are great buddies. McCain himself has proven that.
California has basically given up it's freedom voting the way you vote. I won't give mine up as easily as you guys have. You probably voted for ARRRNOLD. He's republican too. Conservative? Now that would be a stretch, wouldn't it.

[Cabin4]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

Barrack Obama, and John McCain are BOTH LIBERALS. Everyone admits that, and everyone knows that. So vote for the liberal already, and stop whinning about what other people are doing. There is nothing you can do about it, and your beginning to sound as if you bottle is empty and you mother is not hearing you. A liberal votes for a liberal. Everyone know that also.

Who's bottle is empty?? LOL LOL

And since when is voting for McCain mean your a Liberal? LOL

McCain IS A LIBERAL. Even the republican party says so. If you vote liberal, you ARE liberal. Spin will not change that. In california, you should be used to liberal. Perhaps that's why you don't think McCain is. But ALMOST everyone agrees that he is. He and Fiengold are great buddies. McCain himself has proven that.
California has basically given up it's freedom voting the way you vote. I won't give mine up as easily as you guys have. You probably voted for ARRRNOLD. He's republican too. Conservative? Now that would be a stretch, wouldn't it.

This discussion never discussed if I or anyone thought McCain was or was not a Liberal. You never asked me that question about him or me. So your wrong on that point or just delusional.

I've only lived here for 3 years and think this state is full of nut case Liberals. I don't live here because I really wanted too and you never asked me about my thoughts on this. So your just wrong on this or again, just delusional.

Just because I will vote for McCain does not mean I'm a Liberal. What it does mean is I understand math and I am willing to do whatever it takes to beat Obama. Apparently you love Obama and you are willing to help him get elected. So calling me a Liberal because I'm willing to hold my nose and vote for McCain while you give our country away and vote for Obama is pretty dam ridiculous on your part.

Try some medication Dee... It should help.

[S.B.]

From Redhawk1, I voted for McCain, to vote for anyone else would be a vote for Obama the terrorist.

I agree to vote for Matt Barr of anyone else is a thrown away vote and only goes to help the opposition to our freedoms!
Has no one here ever heard the phrase "Divide and conquer"?

[powderman]

The score??? Mccain 50, obama 8. POWDERMAN. 

[Dee]

Yes, sometimes voting is about who your voting against. In the case of me voting for McCain, its not a vote for McCain as much as its a vote against Obama. If you vote for Barr, your voting against McCain which will mathematically helps the Muslim Obama.

YEP. Thats exactly how it works. Voting for Barr now is like betting on a 3 legged mule in the KY derby. You know you can't win, but ya jes gotta play the game your way.  POWDERMAN. 

I'll take the meds if you take an enama. Your full of it. Talk about delusional.

Barrack Obama, and John McCain are BOTH LIBERALS. Everyone admits that, and everyone knows that. So vote for the liberal already, and stop whinning about what other people are doing. There is nothing you can do about it, and your beginning to sound as if you bottle is empty and you mother is not hearing you. A liberal votes for a liberal. Everyone know that also.

Who's bottle is empty?? LOL LOL

And since when is voting for McCain mean your a Liberal? LOL

McCain IS A LIBERAL. Even the republican party says so. If you vote liberal, you ARE liberal. Spin will not change that. In california, you should be used to liberal. Perhaps that's why you don't think McCain is. But ALMOST everyone agrees that he is. He and Fiengold are great buddies. McCain himself has proven that.
California has basically given up it's freedom voting the way you vote. I won't give mine up as easily as you guys have. You probably voted for ARRRNOLD. He's republican too. Conservative? Now that would be a stretch, wouldn't it.

This discussion never discussed if I or anyone thought McCain was or was not a Liberal. You never asked me that question about him or me. So your wrong on that point or just delusional.

I've only lived here for 3 years and think this state is full of nut case Liberals. I don't live here because I really wanted too and you never asked me about my thoughts on this. So your just wrong on this or again, just delusional.

Just because I will vote for McCain does not mean I'm a Liberal. What it does mean is I understand math and I am willing to do whatever it takes to beat Obama. Apparently you love Obama and you are willing to help him get elected. So calling me a Liberal because I'm willing to hold my nose and vote for McCain while you give our country away and vote for Obama is pretty dam ridiculous on your part.

Try some medication Dee... It should help.

I'm delusional, and your voting for a liberal (McCain) but say your not voting liberal. I believe your the one whom is delusional. If I need medication you need an enema, cause your full of it. Whether Obama is muslim is purely conjecture at this point. That he is sympathic toward the muslim, I would guess yes. But you guys are beting on a liberal magically turning conservative, when the liberal is dripping off him. Talk about delusional. You are indeed. This is becoming circular, you may have the last word, it is all now, redundant.

[Cabin4]

Dee,

I've diagnosed your problems and have isolated it to one or both of the following issues:

1. Your just not very smart
and or
2. You can't read worth a horses behind.(that's the end where the tail is connected)

Now go back and read this thread in its entirety and report back to us your final findings. At that point I will re-diagnose your problem. If your not willing to read the thread in its entirety, then please just go away or you run the risk of people feeling very sorry for you.

Thanks,
Cabin4

[DakotaElkSlayer]

NOBODY voting for osama or a 3rd party this late in the game can possibly support the private ownership of firearms. POWDERMAN. 

  Actually, I started to think about voting for Obama when I first heard him speak.  The idea of voting for a candidate that was actually intelligent, I found intriguing.  The next was all those emails spreading lies about the guy...and most of you repeating them on here as if they were Gospel.  I thought that was very un-American....kind of like Goebbles in Nazi Germany.  Kinda' sad when one can't stick to the facts and instead has to do some sort of character assassination with blatant lies.
  Don't possibly see how voting for Obama is voting against private ownership of guns.  Democrats and Gore saw that being even perceived as anti-gun was a loser.  Why don't you think they pushed through a assault weapons ban even though GWB promised he would sign it if it got to his desk?  This is just more of the crap that has been being preached for the last 20 plus years...
  I, on the other hand, think voting for John "BushLite" McCain, is a vote against private gun ownership.  McCain's following of GWB's footsteps, will drive the economy even deeper into the abyss, forcing many Americans to sell their guns in order to feed their family.

JIm

[S.B.]

Another twist of fate?
http://www.pantagraph.com/articles/2008/07/07/news/doc48714d2fdddda026827439.txt

[Dee]

I have heard many times that it is unwise to discuss politics or religion with anyone, as there will always be strife. I believe that this thread and others, have proven that to be correct.
I have both observed "and participated" in the downward spiral of this thread, (and others)  to be not much more than a peeing contest of insults, and degradations directed toward one another.
It is contentiousness at it's worst, and I accept my part in the contention. I am as convicted in my feelings, as anyone here but, we as adults have not expressed ourselves as gentlemen (me included) toward one another and I regret that. I have learned in other arenas of discussion to state your beliefs, and then leave it alone and walk away. This arena as others, has proven to me my weakness at not walking away after stating my beliefs. It is a weakness in character to continue, so therefore I am with drawing. I have stated my case, and nothing more needs to be said.
Jefferson observed about the assembly of men trying to decide whether to secede from the rule of the king and wrote: The assembly is divided into three groups. One third is loyal to the king, (in this case the two party system). One third is afraid to go against the king, (in this case the two party system), and one third is true blue. In other words this last third was willing to risk everything for freedom from the king, (in this case the two party system).
It is a fair comparison of the two, and it is FINALLY, all I have to say about this election.
I have nothing further to say to, or about anyone, and regret my participation in ALL character attacks, and will not further proceed. Some will no doubt give in to their weakness, and go for one more last shot, but so be it. They will be sparing with themselves, not me.
My apologies gentlemen, I am finished with this juvenile nonsense that I have participated in.

[S.B.]

Dee, in your last paragraph you aligned yourself with the hero's or founding fathers of this country, while taking one more swipe at your opponents? Many here take this stance but, fall short of those men and their deeds? The real villain isn't the two party system our country operates on but, decention among ourselves, from the civic duties of every citizen.
Victory has a thousand fathers while defeat is always an orphan.

[Cabin4]

Dee,

That's what happens when you start the peeing contest. You & only you started the personal insults.

If I thought your apology was sincere, I would have not said a word but you just left out this significant point.

Cabin4

[30-06man]

NOBODY voting for osama or a 3rd party this late in the game can possibly support the private ownership of firearms. POWDERMAN. 

  Actually, I started to think about voting for Obama when I first heard him speak.  The idea of voting for a candidate that was actually intelligent, I found intriguing.  The next was all those emails spreading lies about the guy...and most of you repeating them on here as if they were Gospel.  I thought that was very un-American....kind of like Goebbles in Nazi Germany.  Kinda' sad when one can't stick to the facts and instead has to do some sort of character assassination with blatant lies.
  Don't possibly see how voting for Obama is voting against private ownership of guns.  Democrats and Gore saw that being even perceived as anti-gun was a loser.  Why don't you think they pushed through a assault weapons ban even though GWB promised he would sign it if it got to his desk?  This is just more of the crap that has been being preached for the last 20 plus years...
  I, on the other hand, think voting for John "BushLite" McCain, is a vote against private gun ownership.  McCain's following of GWB's footsteps, will drive the economy even deeper into the abyss, forcing many Americans to sell their guns in order to feed their family.

JIm

I don't see how you could say he is intelligent. I only see someone way worse then Clinton and I hear someone lie directly out of his teeth and he spoke what he really thinks of us that cling to our guns but yet the people that vote for him pay attention. This is just another example of someone who is brainwashed and doesn't care what happens and doesn't pay attention to the facts. The reason we have to sell our guns or such is because of gas prices and guess what Chevron said today they have oil and natural gas deposits off shore that they can start work on today on their current leases but they needed it to be approved by congress and the Dem Congress stopped it yet you and others alike listen to them and continue to blame it on the Conservatives and Republicans which are the ones wanting to drill. Obama said he doesn't want to drill and not drilling raises oil and gas prices which kills our economy and our wallets and yet yall support him and blame the everyone but the ones causing the problems the dems. Bush said that to get the Dem vote for president and that's just being a politician which Obama is if you didn't know and he didn't follow through and let it expire a pro gun move. Obama has said he is going to reinstate the assult weapons ban and then he said he is largely against pistol ownership and said he supports gun bans in Cities like Washington.

[nw_hunter]

Wouldn't it be nice to vote for who we like for a change, instead of against who we don't?
We will never get that choice in the two party's that run things. The only way change can come, is with a third party, and it looks like that day will come, when Rosie O'Donald picks a man to wed!

Obama is a gun grabbing, open border puking liberal, and so is John McCain. Their records speak for themselves. We will see very little change no matter which one is elected.

What we should really be worried about is, getting rid of the Liberals in the House and Senate.
We actually have a chance to make a difference there! We don't have a say so in the Presidential freak show!

[DakotaElkSlayer]

NOBODY voting for osama or a 3rd party this late in the game can possibly support the private ownership of firearms. POWDERMAN. 

  Actually, I started to think about voting for Obama when I first heard him speak.  The idea of voting for a candidate that was actually intelligent, I found intriguing.  The next was all those emails spreading lies about the guy...and most of you repeating them on here as if they were Gospel.  I thought that was very un-American....kind of like Goebbles in Nazi Germany.  Kinda' sad when one can't stick to the facts and instead has to do some sort of character assassination with blatant lies.
  Don't possibly see how voting for Obama is voting against private ownership of guns.  Democrats and Gore saw that being even perceived as anti-gun was a loser.  Why don't you think they pushed through a assault weapons ban even though GWB promised he would sign it if it got to his desk?  This is just more of the crap that has been being preached for the last 20 plus years...
  I, on the other hand, think voting for John "BushLite" McCain, is a vote against private gun ownership.  McCain's following of GWB's footsteps, will drive the economy even deeper into the abyss, forcing many Americans to sell their guns in order to feed their family.

JIm

I don't see how you could say he is intelligent. I only see someone way worse then Clinton and I hear someone lie directly out of his teeth and he spoke what he really thinks of us that cling to our guns but yet the people that vote for him pay attention. This is just another example of someone who is brainwashed and doesn't care what happens and doesn't pay attention to the facts. The reason we have to sell our guns or such is because of gas prices and guess what Chevron said today they have oil and natural gas deposits off shore that they can start work on today on their current leases but they needed it to be approved by congress and the Dem Congress stopped it yet you and others alike listen to them and continue to blame it on the Conservatives and Republicans which are the ones wanting to drill. Obama said he doesn't want to drill and not drilling raises oil and gas prices which kills our economy and our wallets and yet yall support him and blame the everyone but the ones causing the problems the dems. Bush said that to get the Dem vote for president and that's just being a politician which Obama is if you didn't know and he didn't follow through and let it expire a pro gun move. Obama has said he is going to reinstate the assult weapons ban and then he said he is largely against pistol ownership and said he supports gun bans in Cities like Washington.

Did you ever hear him speak?  The intelligence is rather obvious to me.  What did he say, that people who cling to guns and religion are bitter?  Buddy, read a lot of posts that are already on this thread...  You don't detect any bitterness?  Now be honest!  The guy is entitled to his opinion; just like everyone on here.  He lied?  Who was the last President that didn't lie?  Carter?!  Don't even see how drilling offshore would really have any effect on oil prices.  All that oil is sold on the world market...  OPEC cuts production 5%, and the prices will jump faster than they do now.  Why risk our coasts before you demand higher mpg standards and LOWER the speed limit?  Best case scenario...we delay the shortage a few years.  Why not instead invest in the technology so we no longer depend on the middle east, instead of leaving that problem for our children.
  As for blaming the Conservatives about the economy...  Who do you think stopped forcing higher mpg standards for automakers?  China, CHINA has higher standards than we do eventhough they are 10years behind us in technology.  Heck, who gave us a war without raising taxes?  Sure, great idea....if you like owing China even more money.  That debt is playing a huge part in our weak dollar.
  You really think Obama is going to reinstate the assault weapons ban?  Or did he just say that to get votes...just like Bush?!!  They know that stuff kills them in elections, so I personally have no worries.  Speaking of the Constitution...I guess you are looking the other way with the republicans walking on the Constitution the last 7 years?  Seems like they never heard of the 4th Ammendment.  Can't really be pro- Constitution if you only really care about ONE Ammendment.

Jim

[Cabin4]

Before you wish for a 3 or more than 2 party system, take a look at places like the UK and other western countries that have this. Their a wreck. It rarely happens that in a 3 or more party system the president is elected with a majority. So there's never a mandate!

What we need is NOT a 3rd party. We need to get rid of both parties we have and replace it with 2 good ones.

A 3rd party will do nothing accept spawn yet more parties that offset any gains.

Be carefull, you may just get what you wish for. I like our founding fathers idea and I just think we need to stick with them. They seem to know more about the flaws in political systems then anyone today.

[S.B.]

cabin, I disagree. What we need in my opinion, is for all registered voters to be informed of current issues and to vote!
Granted, one has to be able to "Read between the lines" in most of the yellow journalistic print(bias) and TV programing, today?
My hope is that "politically corrects" run out of ways to spin their lies before it's too late for America.
If I didn't know better, I would think some here were politicians by the $100 words they use and the way they cut others down and spin their views to make others believe their OK?

[Fazak]

cabin, I disagree. What we need in my opinion, is for all registered voters to be informed of current issues and to vote!

Who do you trust to inform them?

[ironglow]

  We've got to bring the Reps back to their conservative roots..and just bite the bullet for now. Remember; 4 stupid SCOTUS "justices" still couldn't bring themselves
   to admit the truth about the 2nd amendment !
   Where will we be if B. Hussein Obama gets elected, and has Congress in his corner ?
       
   We get back to the roots; by starting at the grassroots...

[Dixie Dude]

The best answer I heard about the energy problem was from Dick Morris on Fox.  He said we have to do it all.  The Environmentalists have to compromise and allow drilling, building of nuclear power plants, and expanded refineries.  The oil people have to compromise and through taxes and tax credits made to invest in alternative fuels like algae, alcohol, and synthetic fuel from coal, and more wind and solar power production.  Nuclear power plants built to navy standards to replace coal, natural gas, and fuel oil power plants.  Then we must through taxes and credits kick start the hybrid vehicles.  Only the feds can coordinate this massive work through the tax and tax credit bills.  Tax the coal produced power, tax imported oil at the barrel.  Then give tax credits to corporations that invest in solar, wind, nuclear, hybrid engines, and synthetic fuels, algae oil, etc.  We must do it all.  Both sides have to compromise on this to solve the problem.  All of this work will create a lot of good paying jobs down the road.  Become completely energy independent.  This also helps solve our trade imbalance.  Over have of our imports are oil, not Chinese products.  We should become an exporter of synthetic oil products and fuel from coal and algae.  Just the amount of natural gas used in power production is the equivilant of fuel needed to run all the cars in America.  I know, I work in the natural gas industry.  We shouldn't be burning natural gas to make electricity, but in our cars at least.  We should be using nuclear power along with wind and solar.  All the coal used to make power could make twice the synthetic fuel we need, and we could export the rest.  Congress is the problem, not the American people and industry.  We could do it if they would quit being so socialist oriented, thinking they can solve all the problems, instead of revising the tax structure, and put money into research and development instead of giveaway programs that doesn't solve anything.  Sorry for the rant.