Fighting with Russia spreads to cities across GeorgiaStory Highlights

[ms]

 
   Fighting with Russia spreads to cities across GeorgiaStory Highlights
Cities across Georgia being bombed early Saturday

Russian forces moved Friday into breakaway Georgia region of South Ossetia

Georgia sent troops into South Ossetia on Thursday to clamp down on separatists

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TBLISI, Georgia (CNN) -- Bombs rocked Tbilisi early Saturday morning as the fight between Georgia and Russia over a breakaway region intensified and moved into the Georgian capital.

 
A warplane drops bombs near the Georgian city of Gori on Friday as Russian and Georgian forces battle.

 1 of 3  Government buildings, including the Parliament, were evacuated when the bombs fell.

Heavy casualties have reported on both sides since Russian forces moved Friday into South Ossetia, a pro-Russian autonomous region of Georgia.

Russian bombers were targeting Georgia's economic infrastructure, National Security Council secretary Alexander Lomaia said, including the country's largest Black Sea port, Poti, and the main road connecting the southern part of Georgia with the east and the airport.

Georgian television reported that the port had been destroyed.

Georgia, a former Soviet state, sent troops into South Ossetia on Thursday, aiming to crack down on the separatists, who want independence or unification with North Ossetia, which is in Russia. Russia responded Friday, sending troops into the Georgian province where it had peacekeepers stationed.

"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," Lyudmila Ostayeva, a resident of the South Ossetia capital, Tskhinvali, told The Associated Press on Friday.

"It's impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged," she said after fleeing to a village near the Russian border, AP reported.

"They are killing civilians, women and children, with heavy artillery and rockets," Sarmat Laliyev, 28, told AP.

One U.S. State Department official called the conflict a "very dangerous situation" and said diplomatic moves are afoot around the globe to stop it.

Georgia -- on the Black Sea coast between Russia and Turkey -- appealed for diplomatic intervention.  Watch Georgian minister describe fighting in South Ossetia »

Georgia asked the United States for planes to bring back its 2,000 troops serving as part of the U.S.-led coalition in Iraq, a U.S. official said.

"All day today, they've been bombing Georgia from numerous warplanes and specifically targeting [the] civilian population, and we have scores of wounded and dead among [the] civilian population all around the country," Georgia's president, Mikhail Saakashvili, said Friday. "This is the worst nightmare one can encounter."  Watch the interview with Saakashvili »

Russia's ambassador to United Nations, Vitaly Churkin, put the blame on the Tblisi government.

"What is going on is a massive bombardment of residential quarters in Tshkinvali and other towns, too," Churkin said.

Eduard Kokoity, head of the rebel government in South Ossetia, said that 1,400 people were killed in the province, according to Russia's Interfax news agency.

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Hundreds of people, possibly thousands, are fleeing South Ossetia to the Russian region of North Ossetia-Alania, the United Nations reported Friday, citing Russian officials.

About 150 Russian armored vehicles have entered South Ossetia, Saakashvili said, and Georgian forces had shot down two Russian aircraft.  Watch the Russian tanks moving into the area »

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, quoted by Interfax, said Russians had died because of Georgian military operations in South Ossetia.

Russia "will not allow the deaths of our compatriots to go unpunished," and "those guilty will receive due punishment," he said. "My duty as Russian president is to safeguard the lives and dignity of Russian citizens, wherever they are. This is what is behind the logic of the steps we are undertaking now."

South Ossetia, with a population of about 70,000, declared independence from Georgia in the early 1990s, but it was not internationally recognized. Many ethnic Ossetians feel close to Russia and have Russian passports and use its currency. iReport.com: Are you there? Share your photos, videos

Interfax quoted the Georgian Foreign Ministry as saying that strikes by Russian aircraft killed and wounded personnel at a Georgian air base and that Russian planes have been bombing Georgian territory throughout the day. Georgian officials also report four Russian aircraft shot down.

The U.S., NATO and the European Union have all called for an end to the fighting. President Bush and Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin discussed the conflict Friday, the White House confirmed.

By early evening Friday, a Georgian Cabinet minister said the country's forces have taken control of Tskhinvali, Interfax reported.

The Novosti news agency, citing the South Ossetian government, said Georgian tanks and infantry attacked Tskhinvali, and "a large part of the city has been destroyed. Over 15 civilians have been killed, several buildings are on fire in the city center, and the local parliament building has burned down."

But Russian and South Ossetian officials said Russia was making inroads in fighting Georgian forces.

"Street fighting in Tskhinvali has lasted for many hours. Ossetian home guards are using grenade-launchers to destroy Georgian tanks. Eyewitnesses say tanks are burning throughout the city. The turning point is approaching in the battle for the capital city," said the Web site of the South Ossetian Information and Press Committee.

The committee also said Russian armored vehicles have entered the northern suburb of the city.

Violence has been mounting in the region in recent days, with sporadic clashes between Georgian forces and South Ossetian separatists.

Georgian troops launched attacks in South Ossetia late Thursday after a top government official said a unilateral cease-fire offer was met with separatist artillery fire.


Lomaia said Georgian troops responded proportionately to separatist mortar and artillery attacks on two villages, attacks he said followed the cease-fire and Saakashvili's call for negotiations.

Russian peacekeepers are in South Ossetia under a 1992 agreement by Russian, Georgian and South Ossetian authorities to maintain what has been a fragile peace. The mixed peacekeeping force also includes Georgian and South Ossetian troops.

[ms]

yep!!!!!!!!!

[DalesCarpentry]

Just more senseless killing in our world. Dale

[DalesCarpentry]

President Bush has said that Georgia is our Allie. He also said they are a Sovern nation. Do you guys think we will get involved like we did when Iraq invaded Kuwait? I sure hope not. Dale

[ms]

we have 1000 troops there Israel got people over there. training geogia amry.

[DalesCarpentry]

This really sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have to say there is a some what good chance that we are going to be involved in some way with Iran. Now we have to worry about Russia. Where does it end? Russia is going be a lot harder to take on than Iraq or Iran. I say let them fight it out. We need to stop being the world police. Dale

[beemanbeme]

When Mother Nature sez there are too many people on the earth, She means there are too many people on the earth.  The population is gonna be reduced by fair means or foul. 

[torpedoman]

and people wonder if there are u.f.o.'s how come they don't make contact with us.

[magooch]

Now those folks over there know how to put on a war--no rules, just kill people and break things.

[ironglow]

 Reminiscent of the invasion of Czechs by Nazis in 1939..
  There were many ethnic Germans living in southern Czechoslovakia in 1939, Hitler used this pretext for taking ALL of Czechoslovakia !
  He marched in after Europeans gave him the green light at the conference in Munich.. Putin claims that some people with Russian passports
  live in one province in Georgia; will the Europeans allow Putin to do the same today in Georgia as Hitler did in the "Sudentenland" ?
   eid they learn anything in 1939 ?

  Below see picture of Hitler recieving applause for his dark deed and a Soviet Russian poster of the time, condemning such aggression with the
  permission of the European powers.

[BBF]

my 1 and 3/4 cents worth. There is a big and very important oil pipeline there which is not under Russian control at this time.  "Ivan" doesn't need any more reasons!

Is the EU or US going to do more then just wring hands, talk, talk, and more talk?  NOT on this planet!
It is up to Georgia to defend themselves and make it as costly for the Russians as possible.

[ms]

The TV is saying that Russia attack first that's not true. I think we are getting set up for WW3 . Us troops are there black water Israel the rich people want us to forget about are money problems.

[ironglow]

 
      Wow!...ms tells us that TV tells us that Russia attacked Georgia first..but the TV reports are NOT TRUE !

 
  Not having been in the hot area of the Georgian Republic in the last 3-4 days, I could not make a firm statement about how the action commenced.

   However, since US troops were there until recent weeks and some Israeli troops are there as training instructors, I would suspect there may have been some TV people
  right in the area who did witness the aggression.


 

[ms]

      Wow!...ms tells us that TV tells us that Russia attacked Georgia first..but the TV reports are NOT TRUE !

 
  Not having been in the hot area of the Georgian Republic in the last 3-4 days, I could not make a firm statement about how the action commenced.

   However, since US troops were there until recent weeks and some Israeli troops are there as training instructors, I would suspect there may have been some TV people
  right in the area who did witness the aggression.


 GEORGIAN ADMIT THEY ATTACK FIRST       !Article
Putin: Georgia’s actions are criminal, whereas Russia’s actions are absolutely legitimate
Front page / Hotspots and Incidents / Conflicts
09.08.2008 Source: Pravda.Ru           
 
 
Pages: 12
 
Russian news reports say that Russia's Prime Minister Vladimir Putin has arrived in a region that neighbors South Ossetia, where the armed conflict is taking place.

 
 
Putin: Georgia’s actions are criminal, whereas Russia’s actions are absolutely legitimate
 
 
 BREAKING NEWS
 
 Georgia declares war on South Ossetia
 
 
 Explosions continue to terrorize Russia's Black Sea coast
 
 
 Prons and cons of vegetarianism
 
 
 
 
Georgia treacherously attacks South Ossetia
More...
 
 
They say Putin is visiting the city of Vladikavkaz, the provincial capital of the region of North Ossetia that neighbors South Ossetia.

Also read: War between Russia and Georgia orchestrated from USA

Putin said at a work meeting in Vladikavkaz that he could not imagine how it could be possible to make South Ossetia become a part of Georgia afterwards.

“Georgia’s actions are criminal, whereas Russia’s actions are absolutely legitimate,” the Russian Prime Minister said.

Putin urged the Georgian administration to immediately end aggression in South Ossetia.

“The actions of the Georgian authorities in South Ossetia are obviously a crime. It is a crime against its own people, first and foremost,” Putin stated.

“A deadly blow has been struck on the territorial integrity of Georgia itself, which implies huge damage to its state structure,” Putin emphasized.

“The aggression has resulted in numerous victims including those among civilians and has virtually led to a humanitarian catastrophe,” he said.

The Russian PM stressed out that Russia would always treat the Georgian nation with great respect, as a brotherly nation, despite the current tragic events.

“Time will pass and the people of Georgia will give their objective estimations to the actions of the incumbent administration,” Putin said.

Putin believes that Georgia’s aspiration to become a member of NATO is not based on Georgia’s wish to become a part of the global international security system and contribute to the strengthening of international peace.

“It is based on an attempt of the Georgian administration to get other countries involved in its bloody affairs,” he said.

Russia ’s actions in South Ossetia are absolutely grounded and legitimate, Putin said.

“In accordance with international agreements, including the agreement of 1999, Russia does not only execute peacemaking functions, but is obliged, in case one party breaks the cease-fire agreement, to defend the other party, which is exactly what we are doing in case with South Ossetia,” Putin stated.

Russia has been playing a positive and stabilizing role in the Caucasus for ages, Putin said.

“We perfectly realize what world we live in today. We will strive for fair and peaceful solutions of all conflicting situations, which we inherited from the past,” the head of the Russian government said
 
 


 





 

[DalesCarpentry]

I would think that Georgia has a death wish!!!!!!!!!! They can't win against Russia. Dale

[DalesCarpentry]

You know this kind of reminds me of a friend I had years ago called Tex. We did a lot of drinking together in many different bars. I don't think there was a Friday that went by that he did not pick a fight with the biggest guy in the bar. I can't even tell you how many times I bailed this guy out. He weighted 130 pounds tops and it never failed he would pick a fight with a guy that was 6'6" and 280 or 300 pounds. I had enough one night and told him you are on your own. He really got his ass kicked that night and spent a couple days in the hospital but after that he quit picking fights. Dale

[ironglow]

       Dale;  
   
   The Georgian Republic is a constitutional republic, they would not even be a candidate for NATO membership if they weren't !
    Unlike dictatorships, republics get majority affirmation before attacking anyone ! Such is required exactly so no one person can
    commit their nation to war..unlike one, goofy drunk in a bar !
 
    That is why the idea that the Georgians attacked Russia  is so ridiculous !
  
   Of course there were undoubtedly some Germans in 1939 that probably were "sure" that the Czechs attacked Nazi germany !

  ..And others probably believed in their hearts that the Poles attacked that German radio station, causing Poland to be attacked !

   One way to sort out the BS ..which ones were totally prepared for blitz warfare ? The Czechs ? The Poles ? ..Or Hitler's Germany !

  Employ the same thought process here ! History has taught us that an attack occurs when one side percieves they are much more
  powerful than their intended adversary !  Common sense says the same thing, in a word.."peace through strength". Which country
   is the more powerful ? Had Russia delayed an attack much longer, the Georgians wopuld have been part of NATO, a bigger fish to fry !


    Again, although I wasn't there and cannot make a flat, definitive statement about who attacked whom in  the Russia/Georgia conflict,
  as some here seem to believe they can do...    We can employ a bit of common sense..
  
     Would a very small nation with a small, poorly equipped army attack mighty Russia, especially when a former KGB boss is in charge in
  Russia and trying to expand his power in any way he can ?

  What could Georgia possibly gain ?  

  What could Russia gain, outside of getting some of the old Soviet breakaway republics back, along with it's economy and tax base ?

  Who has been irrationally concerned that Georgia is preparing to join NATO ?

  I  believe that for any thinking person, the deductive reasoning process answers many questions !

[DalesCarpentry]

I say let them fight it out!!!!!!!! I see no reason for us to get involved in something that has nothing to do with us. Dale

[ms]

Here ironglow read bloomberg they have no fight in this.


     Putin Says `War Has Started,' Georgia Claims Invasion
« on: August 08, 2008, 01:41:09 PM »   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 
Bloomberg Press
 
 

Putin Says `War Has Started,' Georgia Claims Invasion (Update4)

By Torrey Clark and Greg Walters

Aug. 8 (Bloomberg) -- Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin said ``war has started'' over the breakaway region of South Ossetia as Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili accused its neighbor of a ``well-planned invasion.''

Saakashvili said in a Bloomberg Television interview that his nation of 4.6 million people is ``fighting to secure its borders'' amid a ``full-blown military aggression'' involving thousands of Russian troops. Aerial bombings and wide-spread fighting in and around the region killed an unknown number of civilians and wounded ``scores'' more, Saakashvili said.

Putin earlier today told U.S. President George W. Bush in Beijing that ``volunteers'' were pouring over the border to help defend South Ossetia from Georgian forces, according to Putin spokesman Dmitry Peskov. ``War started today in South Ossetia'' when Georgia attacked Russian peacekeepers in the disputed region, Putin said. The Defense Ministry later said it deployed ``reinforcements'' in the region.

The ruble dropped the most against the dollar in 8 1/2 years and Russian stocks tumbled today on concern the conflict will worsen. The U.K., European Union and NATO, which Georgia is seeking to join, all called on both sides to end hostilities. The U.S. called for an immediate cease-fire.

Bush supports the ``territorial integrity'' of Georgia, White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said.

``We urge all parties, Georgians, South Ossetians and Russians, to de-escalate the tension and avoid conflict,'' Perino said in a statement from Beijing, where Bush and Putin attended the opening ceremony of the Olympic Games. ``We are working on mediation efforts to secure a cease fire and we are urging the parties to restart their dialogue.''

`NATO Hopes'

``Georgia's immediate NATO hopes have all but evaporated,'' Dominic Fean, a researcher at IFRI, the French Institute of International Affairs, said by telephone. ``Countries like Germany and France were already resistant to the idea of giving a NATO security guarantee to a country with an open dispute with Russia. I can't see how they can get the consensus of 26 states anytime soon.''

South Ossetia, which has a population of about 70,000 and is less than half the size of Kosovo, broke away from U.S.-backed Georgia in the early 1990s and now is a de facto independent state with Russian peacekeepers and economic support. The peacekeepers are deployed under a Commonwealth of Independent States mandate.

``We will not allow the deaths of our compatriots to go unpunished,'' Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, 42, said on state television after the Interfax news service said Russian troops were killed in Georgian shelling of a barracks and checkpoint. ``The guilty will get the punishment they deserve.''

Iraq Pullout

Georgia called today for an emergency meeting of the United Nations Security Council on South Ossetia.

``We've been encouraging everyone involved and every international party to engage in talks for years, months, days, hours,'' Georgian Prime Minister Lado Gurgenidze said by telephone. ``What we get is another column of Russian tanks.''

Georgia, the third-largest member of the allied coalition in Iraq after the U.S. and U.K., will bring home half of its 2,000 soldiers from the Middle East country in the next few days, Kakha Lomaia, head of Georgia's Security Council, said by telephone. The Georgian contingent is stationed in Al-Khut, 185 kilometers (114 miles) southeast of Baghdad.

Fighting escalated throughout the day, with Russian planes dropping four bombs on the Vaziani military base, which the North Atlantic Treaty Organization uses for training, Lomaia said. The base is about 15 kilometers from the Georgian capital.

Russian Tanks

Georgian forces have shot down three Russian planes since the fighting began, Lomaia said. Russia earlier bombed two Georgian towns, Gori and Kareli, he said. Russia's Foreign Ministry denied the bombing claim. The Defense Ministry denied losing aircraft.

Russian troops occupied parts of the South Ossetian capital Tskhinvali, Georgian Interior Ministry spokesman Shota Utiashvili said by telephone. Russian television showed tanks heading over the border to South Ossetia from the Russian region of North Ossetia at about 3:30 p.m. Moscow time.

``We find ourselves in a situation similar to where the Czechs were in 1968, to where the Hungarians found themselves in 1956,'' Lomaia said. ``All we can do is defend our freedom.''

Georgia last month increased the size of its military to 37,000 soldiers and today Saakashvili called up reservists and urged the nation to defend ``every meter'' of land. Russia has a standing army of about 1.1 million.

`Energy Corridor'

``Fighting continues,'' Russian Major General Marat Kulakhmetov, commander of Russia's peacekeeping forces in South Ossetia, said by mobile phone. The peacekeepers have suffered casualties, although it's too early to say how many, he said.

Georgia is a key link in a U.S.-backed ``southern energy corridor'' that links the Caspian Sea region with world markets, bypassing Russia, the world's biggest energy producer. Two pipelines pass through the country linking Azerbaijan and Turkey.

The BP Plc-led Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline, which has been closed since Aug. 5 due to an explosion in Turkey, runs about 100 kilometers south of the South Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali.

The most recent violence in the region erupted on Aug. 1, when South Ossetia said Georgian shelling of the regional capital Tskhinvali claimed six lives. Georgia said South Ossetian forces sparked the fighting.

``The conflict might be short and hot, but my sense is that neither party wants a prolonged conflict,'' said Michael Denison, associate fellow at London-based research group Chatham House and a professor of international security at the University of Leeds.

The EU, in a statement today expressed ``grave concern'' about the fighting and said it is ``working toward a cease fire.''

To contact the reporters on this story: Greg Walters in Moscow gwalters1@bloomberg.net; Torrey Clark in Moscow at tclark8@bloomberg.net
 
 

[ironglow]

ms;
  you had me a bit concerned (reply #15) when you quoted PRAVDA..as an authoritive source of truth...

  We know that ""pravda means "truth" in Russian, but that has been a standing source of jokes in the free world for over 60 years !

[ms]

You just think your free! Your a slave wake up.

[DalesCarpentry]

You just think your free! Your a slave wake up.

I am not quit sure what you mean by this statment but I am an American and I am a free person!!!!!!!!!! We may be slaves to our bills we have to pay and the debts we owe but believe this we are Americans and we are a free nation. Dale

[no guns here]

Just to set the record straight... we do NOT have 1,000 troops in Georgia.  Don't ask for the real numbers, it's classified.  However, the real number is MUCH less than 1k.  They are Marines.  They have been in and out of Georgia for quite a while helping to train the Georgian forces.  My command runs this operation and I see it briefed all the time.  Get your facts straight before you spout off...


ngh

[ironglow]

  Dale;
  Remember, you're talking to a guy that embraces the same "news sources" that TM7 employs !


  no guns here;
  You simply must understand, what you know, just can't compare with what the "conspiracy" bloggers
   are putting out. Then if they can get the "unvarnished truth" from someone like Putin, Pravda,
   Al Jazerra, or some obscure mullah somewhere..what any of us say is just "American propaganda". 

 

[ms]

Dale this country is no longer a republic the law maker are control by big business.  As for ironglow she a sad case !

[ironglow]

 TM;
  Of course I am selective; I wouldn't believe a word that PRAVDA has to say..especially since as before, they are
  lapseing into a "govt controlled" press situation again.
  Do you believe everything Pravda is saying ? If you do, I've got some ocean front land in Nebraska you make like .
 
  You seem to believe the Israelis are playing in Serbia, Ossetia, Iraq, & Afghanistan..Putin is only trying to halt something called "Zionist aggression".
   Too bad Georgia wants some of the oil in the Caspian sea basin..they may just believe it's theirs..must be only Russia & Iran are entitled to that !
   MAN...What have you been smoking ?

  The only thing I can tend to agree with is your estimate of a Russia/Iran partnership. God's REAL book, the Bible says that there will
  come a Russia/ Pan Arab alliance that will TRY to destroy Israel ....But they have a big surprise coming...

[ironglow]

  TM7;
  How is it I, and perhaps many others KNEW you would be defending Russian aggression ? 

[billy_56081]

Reminiscent of the invasion of Czechs by Nazis in 1939..
  There were many ethnic Germans living in southern Czechoslovakia in 1939, Hitler used this pretext for taking ALL of Czechoslovakia !
  He marched in after Europeans gave him the green light at the conference in Munich.. Putin claims that some people with Russian passports
  live in one province in Georgia; will the Europeans allow Putin to do the same today in Georgia as Hitler did in the "Sudentenland" ?
   eid they learn anything in 1939 ?

  Below see picture of Hitler recieving applause for his dark deed and a Soviet Russian poster of the time, condemning such aggression with the
  permission of the European powers.

TrueMUslim whare are you in the top picture? I'm sure this brings back memories of your glory days.

[ironglow]

  I'll just let both our posts stand, and let the others decide who is hysterical...

[superhornet]

TM7--easy son, you'll have a heart attack.  I wonder if the Russian Parliment will try and impeach Putin for going into Georgia ?  My prediction is..........only once...ho ho ho