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Offline Max Caliber

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British mortar bed
« on: September 29, 2008, 04:09:01 AM »
Here's something a little different. This is my first shot at making a copy of a British 5.5 inch mortar bed. This type bed used a removeable quoin that, when in place, held the barrel at 45 degrees and when removed, 15 degrees. Would have been interesting to see one fired at the lower elevation. The barrel is a GB size, 1/3 scale U.S. Coehorn. The rope loops are not handles as such but were for inserting stave's to carry the piece. The bed is made of white oak with a tung oil finish.

Max





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Offline RocklockI

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2008, 04:15:49 AM »
It looks great ! I like the removable quion . Classy piece .
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Offline thelionspaw

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2008, 05:45:14 AM »
Very nicely done. Excellent craftsmanship. You have a reverence for wood.
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Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2008, 06:40:52 AM »
Wow, what beautiful work, you won't hear me nag for paint on this one.  It looks great in natural finish.  Good job!
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Offline GGaskill

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2008, 09:29:13 AM »
How about a pic in the 15° position?
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Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2008, 10:18:30 AM »
     Max,   Mike and I both agreed that your last project was superb, so how can we say that we like this mortar even better.  Well, it is simply magnificent, and to attempt to describe it with further superlatives, would most certainly bankrupt the English language!  Remember too that Chistmastime is coming up pretty soon, so keep us in mind.   ;D ;D

Congratulations, you earned a Cannon Board Kewpie Award!!

Mike and Tracy
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Offline EL Caz 66

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2008, 01:58:12 PM »
NICE !!!
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Offline Terry C.

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2008, 02:34:45 PM »
Excellent!

Congrats on fine job and a well-deserved Kewpie.
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Offline Cat Whisperer

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2008, 12:18:30 AM »
I'd LOVE to see some details on how you built the trunion caps.

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Offline Max Caliber

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2008, 04:18:17 AM »
Thanks for the compliments guys.

DD, thanks for the Kewpie and thanks for cutting me some slack on the natural finish. Do I detect a bit of mellowing since you moved back to the beautiful state of Montana? 

George, Since the bed was not designed for this barrel the lowest it will go is around 30 degrees. Now, if you can reach into that large bag of goodies you have and pull out a drawing or picture of an original 5.5 inch mortar that I can make a casting pattern from, I will make a proper barrel for the bed.

Cat, The cap squares, chin bolts and key bolts were cast from wood patterns.

Max
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Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2008, 07:01:29 AM »
Quote from: Max Caliber on September 30, 2008, 04:18:17 AM
Do I detect a bit of mellowing since you moved back to the beautiful state of Montana? 
 

Absolutly not! There is a time and a place and this was it.  Well deserved Kewpie!!

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Offline Cannoneer

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2008, 01:34:14 PM »
Max,

   Superb work on the oak bed: Did you get the idea for the British 5.5 - inch mortar bed from Cannons Online?
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The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline Max Caliber

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2008, 02:54:29 AM »
Boom J, Thanks. I got the idea from the book, Gun Carriages; An Aide Memoire to the Military Sciences, 1846 by R. J. Nelson. I checked the Cannons Online site but did not find a 5.5 inch British mortar bed.

Max
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Offline Cannoneer

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2008, 07:38:21 AM »
   Thanks for the info on the book, Max. The C-O site is where I first saw the 5.5 mortar bed, so I thought you might have gotten plans from them.


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RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline MikeR C

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2008, 07:09:08 PM »
Max,
I really liked your mortar, especially the bed. I really like the idea of removing part of the bed and and being able to lower the barrel. I looked around and found the 5 1/2" "Royal" mortar very difficult to find pictures of. The following is what I did find:


I don't believe this is the correct barrel for this bed. I suspect it is the smaller 4 2/5 Coehorn. I'm not all that convinced it is an original bed considering there are no loops for transporting it.


However I do believe this is the correct barrel.

These were the only two picts I could find.

If you go to this site:

http://civilwarfortifications.com/index.html

Click on the "Fortification Library", click on the first document:

 Aide-Memoire to the Military Sciences. Framed From Contributions Of Officers Of The Different Services, And Edited By A Committee Of The Corps Of Royal Engineers In Dublin, 1845. Part A. B. C. Sketch Of The Art And Science Of War. Abattis - Contours. With Eighty-Nine Plates And Numerous Woodcuts. Volume I, Part I. London: John Weale, 1845. iv, 230 (1 - 230), Publisher's Catalogue. Plates and Illustrations in Text.
 
And look at the entry under "Artillery" there are two plates, the second illustrates what I believe is a 5 1/2" Royal mortar barrel. There are also some tables in the text with measurements.

Should you, or anyone else for that matter, come up with a better picture or better dimensions I would REALLY be interested in seeing them.


Thank you,
MikeR C
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Offline Max Caliber

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2008, 04:32:07 AM »
MikeR C, Thanks for the info and picture, good research job. I tried to find pictures before I started the project but came up empty. The barrel does look like the 12 pdr Coehorn barrel but no way to tell for sure. I suspect the 5.5 inch barrel looks similar to the Coehorn barrel but sure would like to find a picture of one. The bed looks like it is painted in the correct blue/grey paint. I don't think I will run out and paint mine that color though.

Max
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Offline MikeR C

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2008, 05:16:54 AM »
Max,
I don't blame you a bit for not painting it, not with that piece of wood anyway.
I think the ticket for getting it past DoubleD is to build it, finish it natural, take the photo, then use photoshop to paint the photo  ;D

Thx
MikeR C
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Offline irishman

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2008, 05:31:23 AM »
Max,

     Absolutely Top Shelf from A to Z!

                                           Michael
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Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2008, 09:33:13 AM »
Quote from: MikeR C on October 08, 2008, 05:16:54 AM
I think the ticket for getting it past DoubleD is to build it, finish it natural, take the photo, then use photoshop to paint the photo  ;D

Thx
MikeR C

ROTFLMAO!!!  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Offline intoodeep

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2008, 06:51:09 PM »
Quote from: MikeR C on October 08, 2008, 05:16:54 AM
Max,
I don't blame you a bit for not painting it, not with that piece of wood anyway.
I think the ticket for getting it past DoubleD is to build it, finish it natural, take the photo, then use photoshop to paint the photo  ;D

Thx
MikeR C

 Do you think DD will notice this mortar with an "Antique Painted base" ?   :D



 Max Caliber,

 Sorry to fudge with your photo. It was just for fun. I say it looks Great as it is and do not paint it. ;D
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Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2008, 03:41:07 AM »
Notive what?  ;D
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Offline Max Caliber

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2008, 04:17:57 AM »
intoodeep, that doesn't look bad, doesn't look good either, but now I can see how it may have looked had I painted it.

Max       
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Offline intoodeep

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2008, 04:33:39 AM »
Quote from: Max Caliber on October 09, 2008, 04:17:57 AM
intoodeep, that doesn't look bad, doesn't look good either, but now I can see how it may have looked had I painted it.

Max       

 :D  :D That's what I thought too. So, save the paint for another project.  That mortar is just too nice for paint!
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Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2008, 10:02:20 AM »
Should you paint that, you will have to turn in your kewpie.
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Offline Cannoneer

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2008, 07:22:12 AM »
Quote
The barrel does look like the 12 pdr Coehorn barrel but no way to tell for sure. I suspect the 5.5 inch barrel looks similar to the Coehorn barrel but sure would like to find a picture of one.


Max,

   These pictures aren't of the highest quality but it's all I had in my photo storage. Your suspicion that the Royals and Coehorns are similar in appearance is right on. What is a little confusing about the British Royal mortar is that they are called 5.5-inch but their actual caliber is 5.62-inch. The first pic is of a mortar owned by a private party in South Africa, it was cast in 1822. The last pic is of a British Artillery Table of Brass Ordnance - Ranges and Application; if you save the pic you can enlarge it and see the last two items listed are the Royal and Coehorn mortars.

 





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RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline and7barton

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2008, 10:23:25 AM »
Quote from: Max Caliber on October 02, 2008, 02:54:29 AM
Boom J, Thanks. I got the idea from the book, Gun Carriages; An Aide Memoire to the Military Sciences, 1846 by R. J. Nelson. I checked the Cannons Online site but did not find a 5.5 inch British mortar bed.

Max

That wasn't the famous R. Ratio Nelson, was it ?
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Offline and7barton

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2008, 10:25:56 AM »
Quote from: Max Caliber on October 02, 2008, 02:54:29 AM
Boom J, Thanks. I got the idea from the book, Gun Carriages; An Aide Memoire to the Military Sciences, 1846 by R. J. Nelson. I checked the Cannons Online site but did not find a 5.5 inch British mortar bed.

Max

That wasn't the famous R. Ratio Nelson, was it ?
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Builder of Cannons and models for South-Western Artillery, Fort Amhurst, Coalhouse Fort and private commissions.
Technical Consultant for two episodes of Scrapheap Challenge. Ex Pyrotechnic Safety Officer at Coalhouse Fort. I go trekking and survivalist camping - build experimental tents and survival equipment - caving.

Offline Double D

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2008, 10:33:10 AM »
R.Ratio Nelson? I'm slow real slow and was reading down two post be for I got this....
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Offline Cannoneer

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2008, 06:44:59 PM »
Quote
That wasn't the famous R. Ratio Nelson, was it ?

and7barton,

I got it right away, I just couldn't respond because I was speechless; your almost as bad as I am. 
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RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline Max Caliber

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Re: British mortar bed
« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2008, 04:56:37 AM »
Just back from a stay in the mountains of Northeast Tennessee, very beautiful there this time of year. Also, visited one of my Sons and his family in Haymarket, Virginia. While there I went to the Washington Navy Yard, mainly to take some detailed pictures of an early breech loading cannon that I saw on a previous trip. We also went to Gettysburg NMP to see the new visitors center and museum, very nice. Also drove around the battlefield to look at all the guns. Some new monuments have been erected since my last visit in 1983.

Boom J, Thanks for the pictures and information. Looks like there were three bronze British mortars, two were called Coehorn mortars and the other was the Royal mortar. All three were apparently of the same pattern but varied in bore size and dimensions.

Looks like it will take me a while to catch up on two weeks of posts made here. I tend to lose my patience with a computer after about an hour, sort of like going grocery shopping with my Wife, I usually start losing my patience about the time we get to the dairy products section, if I even make it that far. :)

Max

 
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