Lake City 223 brass

[lendar]

Does all lake city 223 brass have crimped in primers?  I have some 84 and 85 year stamped brass and it doesn't look like its crimped in.

[jhalcott]

Len, the brass MAY have been reloaded prior to YOU getting it. If it is still original factory loaded, it is best to ASSUME it is crimped. A few turns of a chamfering tool will remove the crimp.That is the SAME tool to chamfer the case mouth after trimming.

[mountainview]

That is an interesting tip JH. I have a bunch of LC brass that needs to have the crimp removed before I can use the brass for reloading. I just wanted to make sure but it sounds like lightly chamfering the rim of the primer pocket will accomplish the same thing as the Hornady tool will, is this correct?

[Old Syko]

There are 2 methods for dealing with crimped primer pockets.  One is the removal of the crimp by trimming as described above.  The other is to swage the pocket which removes no metal but merely forces it back onto place.  I'm a believer in the swage method in order to keep as much of the original metal in place as possible.

[Tn Jim]

I use the RCBS Primer Pocket Swager on any brass I suspect may have a primer crimp, and I have done several thousand Lake City pieces. It has always done great. It is definately worth the $24.

[bilmac]

I've done both the camfering tool and the RCBS swager. Cutting the crimp out is a little imprecise. Sometimes it looks like you have it cleaned up but the primer still won't seat. Other times it seems like you cut too much metal away. The swage does good work, but it takes some time to get it adjusted, and it seems like it is hard on even my compound press.

[LaOtto222]

I just purchased 1000 5.56 Lake City '06 brass. It is virgin with no crimp. They have not been fired or loaded before. So it is possible to get Lake City brass that are not once fired.

[bilmac]

I believe 06 and 308 match brass doesn't have cromps. Are they finally making match brass for the 556?

[LaOtto222]

I do not believe that the brass I got was "match" brass. I have not done a lot of work with them yet, but they look like run of the mill LC '06 brass. They are very uniform in length (1.755 +/- .001") after a light chamfer on the case mouths. A large percentage needed the neck mouths straighten out and I found 1 in the first 500 batch that had a split neck (they were bulk packed). Here is a comparison of the LC '06 brass to some others. The LC '06 brass is thinner and holds more powder than Military brass of the past so powder charges for civilian cases will (or should) work in these cases.

.223 Rem Case Weight vs. Capacity

Case Manufacturer   Case Weight   H20 Capacity
Lake City 06                  92.0                   30.6
WCC99                          95.5                   30.5
Sellier & Belloit                  92.3                   30.5
Remington                          92.3                   30.4
PMC                                  93.5                   30.4
Hirtenberger                  93.7                   30.4
Lake City 04                  93.0                   30.4
Federal                          96.3                   30.2
Hornady                          93.9                   30.1
IMG (Guatemalan)          95.4                   30.1
Lapua (new lot)                  93.4                   30.1
Winchester                          93.9                   30.1
Olympic                          97.4                   30.0
Radway Arsenal                  96.1                   30.0
PMP                                 104.5                   29.9
FNM 93-1                          97.3                   29.8
Lapua (old lot)                 104.0                   28.0

[Old Syko]

Kind of blows the old wives tale theory of military brass being thicker and having less capacity than commercial doesn't it?  Those of us who use LC extensively have known this for quite some time.  The main difference is in the alloy used which allows for the heavier pressures accepted by the military while still allowing for adequate case capacity to achieve max loads within those pressure limits.  Most LC brass from the last 8 years or so fit this same category + or - standard specified variables.

I'm yet to see any "match" brass in 5.56/.223 leaving all LC to have crimped primer pockets.  Bilmac is correct in that most '06 and 308 "match" brass is not crimped. 

[bilmac]

Otto
Thanks for the list, I did similar lists for 06 and 308, but never have made one for 223. I am copying it and it will be reference material for me. I have already started loading differently in 223 based on case capacity. My W748 load comes up to about the middle of the neck on thin cases, but on heavy cases it comes up to the top, so I dropped .2 for these. I shoot them interchangably, and can't see any difference.

[AtlLaw]

Kind of blows the old wives tale theory of military brass being thicker and having less capacity than commercial doesn't it?

While I believe you are absolutely correct with regard to 5.56 brass, which is of course the topic of this thread, the general nature of your statement just makes me a little nervous!     Military 7.62 brass IS thicker and DOES have less capacity then commercial brass.  I proved this to myself some time ago with many, MANY rounds of various year headstamped, sized, trimmed, weighed and volume measured LC 7.62 brass.     Unfortunately I forget the actual percentages and which brand brass I used as a base.  But the difference is significant!

I assume the same is true for 30 cal. brass, but believe me, after doing this little test with 7.62 brass, I had no desire to spend that much time doing it again!  

[Old Syko]

You are correct that most 7.62 is heavier and of less capacity than commercial but this too is is not always the case as there are those that are on par with commercial.  And yes this thread is about 5.56/.223.  The 7.62/308 suffers from many other anomalies all to itself.

I think the moral to all this is to always sort by headstamp and double check capacity before loading, especially if you're loading anywhere close to max.

There are other considerations with many brands of 5.56/.223 brass to also be considered such as the tiny flash holes in the guat, brittle material used in Remington, etc.

[AtlLaw]

I think the moral to all this is to always sort by headstamp and double check capacity before loading, especially if you're loading anywhere close to max.

+1   

[jhalcott]

  I recently got a box of Sako .223 brass that weighed from 105 grains to over 110 grains. They "seemed HOT" to the guy who gave them to me . I tried several and concurred with him. I pulled the rest and weighed the components. The bullets went from 54.8 to 56 grains.The unknown powder went from 24 to 25.5 grains. The cases went 105.2 to 111.8. They are waiting to be sold to a recycler!