redistribution of wealth

[Redhawk1]

Here is a creative approach to redistribution of wealth as offered in a local newspaper.........

Today on my way to lunch I passed a homeless guy with a sign that read 'Vote Obama, I need the money.'
I laughed.
 
Once in the restaurant my server had on a 'Obama 08' tie, again I laughed as he had given away his political preference--just imagine the coincidence.

When the bill came I decided not to tip the server and explained to him that I was exploring the Obama redistribution of wealth concept.  He stood there in disbelief while I told him that I was going to redistribute his tip to someone who I deemed more in need--the homeless guy outside. The server angrily stormed from my sight.

I went outside, gave the homeless guy $10 and told him to thank the server inside as I've decided he could use the money more.  The homeless guy was grateful.

At the end of my rather unscientific redistribution experiment I realized the homeless guy was grateful for the money he did not earn, but the waiter was pretty angry that I gave away the  money he did earn even though the actual recipient deserved money more.
I guess redistribution of wealth is an easier thing to swallow in concept than in practical application.

[ms]

Don't believe everything in the paper.   

[gypsyman]

Reminds me of the story, of a teenage daughter, getting into disagreements about the Dem's and the Rep. Daughter always siding with her college professor about the Democratic way of sharing the wealth. Dad finally said, well, if your that's your atitude, lets take a point off your grade,which is an A, and give it to the goof off in class, that's always out partying and missing class's, that way, they can pass with a D. She responded with outrage, why should I bust my butt and study all the time to get an A, while that loser is out screwing around, just so they can pass. Dad's response, welcome to the Republican party!! gypsyman

[Graybeard]

Well at least you didn't try to pretend it was you that did it as another poster did in another thread. I doubt it really happened anywhere to anyone but is merely another of those urban legend tales folks like to spread and some just can't avoid saying it was them that did it or personally knew the person who did.

[Redhawk1]

Don't believe everything in the paper.   

True or not, I believe it was as I posted "a creative approach to redistribution of wealth as offered in a local newspaper". I believe  that is about what OBAMA wants to do..... There was a message in the story people seem to miss.

[nomosendero]

It is a good illustration.

[deltecs]

Well at least you didn't try to pretend it was you that did it as another poster did in another thread. I doubt it really happened anywhere to anyone but is merely another of those urban legend tales folks like to spread and some just can't avoid saying it was them that did it or personally knew the person who did.

I am the poster who said it happened personally.  I did read the story in an email.  I also did try the exact same scenario when my wife and I went to dinner on our last night in Anchorage before returning home.  She talked me into going to a small restuarant known for its fine Greek/Italian food.  On the coner of the mall was a homeless man holding a sign stating homeless vet.  I don't know if he was or wasn't a vet or homeless, but I was determined to see what happened.  Yes the waiter did have a tie on but with an Obama pin for President on his lapel.  I did refuse to tip him, told him the reason why I refused, told the homeless man to thank the waiter and left.  I made sure other patrons nearby heard the exchange and one man even laughed out loud.  I nodded to him on the way out with a smile.  Needless to say my wife was not in good humor even though she is definitely for McCain and dislikes Obama.  The restuarant was Pizza Plaza on Northern Lts Blvd.  It serves steak and seafood along with typical Italian and Greek cuisine. 

[zombiewolf]

Well at least you didn't try to pretend it was you that did it as another poster did in another thread. I doubt it really happened anywhere to anyone but is merely another of those urban legend tales folks like to spread and some just can't avoid saying it was them that did it or personally knew the person who did.

I am the poster who said it happened personally.  I did read the story in an email.  I also did try the exact same scenario when my wife and I went to dinner on our last night in Anchorage before returning home.  She talked me into going to a small restuarant known for its fine Greek/Italian food.  On the coner of the mall was a homeless man holding a sign stating homeless vet.  I don't know if he was or wasn't a vet or homeless, but I was determined to see what happened.  Yes the waiter did have a tie on but with an Obama pin for President on his lapel.  I did refuse to tip him, told him the reason why I refused, told the homeless man to thank the waiter and left.  I made sure other patrons nearby heard the exchange and one man even laughed out loud.  I nodded to him on the way out with a smile.  Needless to say my wife was not in good humor even though she is definitely for McCain and dislikes Obama.  The restuarant was Pizza Plaza on Northern Lts Blvd.  It serves steak and seafood along with typical Italian and Greek cuisine. 

I guess you won't be eating there anymore...
...they'll probably spit in your food!

[deltecs]

In the previous post, I've already stated my resolve not to eat there again.  If the company tolerates political statements on its uniformed employees, I have to presume the company also has the same persuasion, which substantially disagrees with mine, so no eat no profit from me. 

[zombiewolf]

I would tend to agree, but who knows?
Could be another waiter or waitress there wears a Mcain pin and will give you a free meal when they hear about your ridiculous little stunt....

[Graybeard]

If this waiter, the hypothetical one or the presumed real one in your case, had a tie on that met the dress code for the restaurant and then a tack on it that showed his preference for Presidential candidate that strikes me as falling within his First Amendment rights. I think the employer would be treading on thin ice to attempt to prevent that.

Even the Federal government as strict as it is in such matters does not and cannot prevent such for its employees. We were allowed to wear such pins and even to have bumper stickers on our vehicles for our political party of choice. We were NOT allowed while on duty to try to sway the opinions of others or to mention our employment status if rallying support outside the work place.

If all he did was wear a pin on his tie for his choice of candidate in my opinion he was within his first amendment rights to do so. You of course are within your rights to chose not to tip him and also to not go back to said restaurant. But to make an issue over him wearing a pin on the tie as something the restaurant should not allow I think is totally improper. I think it highly unlikely all employees there are for any one candidate and the owners or management might or might not be for the same. They just know their employees have a first amendment right to wear that tie pin. Did he in any way try to sway you to his candidate while waiting your table?

Certainly it is our right to tip or not tip for whatever reason we wish. I do not feel I owe any tip to any person serving me at a restaurant. If I feel they did more than the minimum required of them by virtue of their job then I might if I feel it was worth it. Just because they brought my food to me is hardly reason to give a $7 tip. If the job doesn't pay enough to get by on they should find another job. Tip if you are pleased with their over and above service not because of the job they hold. Poor service is best dealt with by tipping a penny. That lets them know you didn't accidentally over look the tip and/or that you are not just stingy but that you intentionally didn't provide them a tip for their lack of service to you.

[Dee]

Let's see here. If I am to understand re-distribution of wealth, is that not what "welfare" already is, and "food stamps" (cards now), and SOCIAL security for folks whom have never worked?
Example? Many teachers in this state are a member of the teacher's union, and DO NOT PAY SOCIAL SECURITY TAXES! Yes, that's right they never EVER paid the Social Security taxes. What many DO HOWEVER DO IS, after they retire, and start drawing their "teachers retirement check" they will work ONE DAY, usually for a school, as a janitor or some other non-skilled laborer, and based on that one days pay which is strangely WAY ABOVE MINIMUM WAGE average FILE AND DRAW Social Security for the rest of their lives.
Oh, and yes, I PERSONALLY KNOW one whom has done this. It is quite common, and the funny thing is, they are Republicans.
Obama, whom I would never support, is not coming up with anything new. Merely expanding on it.

[Graybeard]

Hmm, are ya real sure? To draw a Social Security Retirement Check you must have worked 40 quarters and I think you have to have worked in the three years prior to retirement not just at some time in the past. At least that's how I understand it.

We are working to get Faye qualified for it and it does require a full 40 quarters to get her eligible. All farm and her share of the GBO income goes toward getting her qualified as she didn't have enough quarters from when she worked. Most of her working income was from the school.

[oldandslow]

Graybeard is right. One day won't get it. You have to have forty quarters to draw SS on your own. My wife didn't have quite forty quarters so she draws SS from me like a lot of wives do.

[Dee]

I am not gonna argue with what you guys think, and I personally know. It happens all the time, and folks are clueless to the fact. I have known the woman and her husband for almost 50 years.
It is just like me. If I were not married, but suddenly fell head over heals for this wonderful 30 year old and at 60 years old, married her, and then that very day, within the hour in fact, died. She could if unable to work, draw my social security, OR! If years later she got old enough to draw social security, and had never worked a day in her life, she could file on, AND GET, "my social security". This is, even if she had been RE-MARRIED for years, but in checking found that MY SOCIAL SECURITY check would pay more than the husband she had been married to for 30 years after my death.
But it gets better. Even if she HAD WORKED, but didn't pay as much as me, she could draw mine.
This is all fact. Take it or leave it. Everyone has been obliviously living under numerous aspects of socialism for their entire lives, and never put two and two together.
You pay taxes, you register your cars and pickups, and THEN. You PAY FOR A DRIVERS LICENSE for the privilege of driving on roads you paid for. Government control, common guys. Think. What was the new deal Roosevelt came up with?

[oldandslow]

You are right about the marriage deal with SS. What does that have to do with working one day and then being able to draw SS?

[deltecs]

My refusal to tip the young waiter with the Obama pin was an attempt to educate him to Obama's tax strategy of spread the wealth.  (Admittedly I did read this on an email and an exact opportunity presented itself, so I did it to see the results for myself.)  I totally agree that the waiter certainly had a right to wear or express his political point of view.  I certainly agree that he has every right to place political bumper stickers on HIS PERSONAL vehicle.  As a PRIVATE businessman, I can limit all polical activity or indications of political influence, or support at my place of business and working on my time.  The restuarant chose not to employ this policy, so I choose not to do business with them because of it.  The waiter could certainly have worn his pin on his own time and exposed himself to the public at some other place than his employment.  I don't have to tolerate as a PRIVATE BUSINESS OWNER, the political expressions of employees that may affect my business profits.  The waiter further was indignant about his profits that are completely opposite those of his chosen candidate.  Why would he want to vote for Obama then?  Mob mentality of social reform by the uninformed.  I chose to inform him with experience instead of books.

[torpedoman]

the government redistributes wealth only to those that agree with them as an old cyclist i recall "no highway funds without a helmit law" then it was seatbelts, then 55 m.p.h. limit, Just the feds proving states rights could be bought without a moments protest from the states only a few rabel rousing protesters that could be ignored.

[deltecs]

If you own stock, do you send the dividend for profits back to the company?  The natural resources in Alaska are owned by people of the State, not the property owner.  This is according to Alaska's State Constitution.  So, any excess taxation from windfall profits belong to the people of the State, not necessarily the State itself.  Also, unlike other States, Alaska was smart enough to create the Alaska Dividend Fund, a corporation of the residents of Alaska that share in any dividend returns over a 5 year rolling average rate of return.  So, no this is not redistribution of the wealth by taking from those more able to pay and then giving it to those not so deserving.  Since all residents own a portion, they equally divide the profits, much like any other corporate investor.  Alaska chose by Constitutional Amendment to create the Alaska Dividend Fund and disperse its excess tax revenue back to the people instead of letting government elected officials spend it on campaign promises and give away programs to get re elected.  I see a big difference in increasing taxes to some, turn some of the money over to those not so deserving, keep the balance for more government intrusion and welfare programs compared to an equal share return on natural assets owned by the residents of the State.  In addition, our State dropped all State taxes on fuel due the extremely high cost to the consumer.  Our dividend has grown to over several billions of dollars during the last 30 years with no State income or sales taxes.  Can your State say the same?  Last I checked Texas had lots of oil revenue too. 

[Redhawk1]

deltecs great explanation, but I am sure TM7 will try to make more out of it.

[Explorer1]

So he claims "redistribution of wealth" is a postive thing?  Even JFK admitted high taxes were bad.  Billy Boy Klinton said we could not give the taxpayer a break as "They would not spend it right."

My question is simple.  Please show me ONE poor person who has hired someone to do a job.  No, not carry something across the street, but a productive job with longevity and some potential for lasting.  Successfull people are successfull for a reason, albeit it may be they were in the right place at the right time but even then they took advantage of it and did something.

People may be down on their luck for reasons outside their control but generally those who put in the effort manage to recover somehow.

Remove the motivation to go the extra yard and the result will soon be few will try to excel.

[deltecs]

I need to clarify a couple of other things about this redistribution of wealth in Alaska.  Most of the natural resouces currently in production are not on federal regulated land.  Most is on Alaska State lands that were part of the transfer of land during the Statehood Act.  The feds have a different tax structure in place for natural resources on it.  The feds take 1/2 and the State gets the other 1/2, unlike any other States in the US.  There the feds take only 10-25% of the taxable assets, while up here businesses pay 50% to the feds and the State loses 25-40% less revenue as compared to the rest of the US.  I think that is to pay for the higher ratio of federal spending per capita in Alaska as compared to the rest of the US.  I meant that with a little tongue in cheek as the media is quick to point out.  We also probably pay more per capita into the federal coffers than any other State.   Alaska is still very much a frontier with all the growing pains, social problems in transition to modern times, absolutely immense with little infrastructure, yet most of the people are extremely well read, adventurous, trusting, independent and generous in hard times.  Our wealth is derived from hard work and intelligent government policies that enacted a public disbursement program back to the people of the State.  If anyone thinks Sarah Palin doesn't understand the economy and what people need in the US, all they have to do is come to Alaska and see a micro cosmic model of the US with the diversity, crime, energy costs, manufacuring, natural resources, transportation, shipping, communications and defense reliance.  For what it is worth, Alaska is the leading state in communications.  Anchorage, Alaska was the first telephone utility in the entire US to go completely digital in the 80's.  By the time the system was in place, it was already obsolete due technology expansion.   Alaskans are not the uneducated fools the rest of the US seem to perceive us to be regardless of media elitists spin.  Our State is financiall solvent with no State taxes and dividend returns to the residents.  The rest of the US could easily use our State as a model for change along constuctionist principles.  By the way, our dividend money is taxed by the federal government, so much of it goes into federal coffers along with our income taxes. 

[woodchukhntr]

Our local paper had an editorial cartoon recently on this topic.  If I remember the sequence:  Obama is standing and a man approaches him and asks if he believes in distribution of wealth, Obama says yes, the man takes a portion of Obama's political funds and takes them for McCain.

Redistribution of wealth is typical liberal double-standard:  we need to redistribute YOUR wealth for the common good, but I really need mine so I can help you, so you can't have it!

[Explorer1]

TM7

I must agree, but do we really want to go back to communial living where survival is the only goal?  I support the idea globalization has not been the greatest thing.  While specialization is sound in theory, we have have a military that depends on foreign sources for parts, we depend on foreign food sources, etc.  Our oppresive laws (i.e. big brother government) has driven our corporations to countries with lower tax rates, fewer regulations, and cheaper labor.  Remove the union headaches, high cost benefits, extreme environmental laws, and change the fact we have one of the highest business taxes in the world and maybe businesses would come back to the US.  Many of us feel we have probably gone too far overboard for such intelligent practices to return without a dramatic driver.

Our politicans are driving us to a global economy, well folks - look at what that means.  No more middle class is one thing we will get, remember the US is the ONLY nation that has ever really had no class system.  Crocked politicans run the rest of the world, we are not far behind!  Shortages are common elsewhere, well look what has happened recently when we found out some food source was crapped up.

Our forefathers gave their all so we could live differently, now our politicans are working to return us the those same policies we fought!  And the public is generally too busy/lazy to get involved!!!

Want an elightenment on where our gun rights are going? Just go do some research on Canada, no innocent until proven guilty, place you in custody while investigations are happening, no warrants are needed for searches, .....the list goes on and on.

Interested in the First Admendment?  Just look at the Obama campaign responses to recent questions to Bozo Biden.  He not only challenged the question (rather than answer it) but then the campaign has censored those stations.  Get used to it, that is the core of the so-called Fairness Doctrine - something the "great" Democrapic leadership wants REAL BAD!

[deltecs]

TM7's last post is most enlightening and I personally believe one of the ultimate goals of the liberals and socialists in the Dem Nat Party.  Today on Fox news, Obama was reported as removing 3 jouralists from his airplane corps whose newspapers endorsed McCain.  Filling those seats were journalists from both Chicago newpapers and magazines Ebony and Jet, all supporters of Obama.  Is this is not an example of the Fairness Doctrine, I do not know what is.  With threats to remove ads and revenue from any newpapers, tv or radio of any anti Obama campaign ad by the NRA, all interviews with Barbara West and her employer and now removal of all correspondents from newspapers supporting McCain, it becomes clearly obvious to anyone of the trend in Obama's philosophy and restriction of 1st Amendment rights.  Who will be the reporters admitted to White House Press releases, if Obama is President?  Do you think he and Congress will not re enact the Fairness Doctrine again and either limit or prevent opposition views regarding his social reforms?

[Graybeard]

You're too paranoid TM7 and this conspricacy theory ain't gonna wash. I looked and none of your posts have been deleted. What might have happened is that while you were making it someone else made a post. What you saw might then have been yours with a message saying a new post had been made and suggesting you might want to take a look at it before posting yours. IF that happens and you do not again click POST you lose it.

But I looked in the trash can where ALL deleted posts go and it's not there. No one but me or Matt could have placed it anywhere else. I didn't and I think you know Matt didn't.

Hey at least you managed to make a post that didn't say anything nasty around zionist. I think it might be the first you've ever managed to do that.

[deltecs]

Deltecs...Funny thing is my post after Explorer's post #26...if that is the one you are referring to....is now gone. Saw it there after refreshing but now it is gone...? But I did not reference any journalists, libs, or Obamanites.


..TM7

That was the one I was referring to.

[Graybeard]

Someone must be dreaming. The ONLY way a post can be removed from a thread is to delete it in which case it goes to the Trash Can. You have access to the Trash Can see if you can find it there. Or it can be edited to remove the text in which case the post remains.

The software will not allow anything else to happen. I looked at posts by you and there just are none in the trash can. You can look at your own profile and click on Last Posts by and see every post you've made regardless of where it is located on the site to include the trash can.

The software prevents anything else from happening.

[woodchukhntr]

Maybe it got redistributed.  Man you have got to watch those Liberals, they will redistribute everything that is not theirs!