My thoughts on this election

[Brett]

"He who would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will lose both and deserve neither."
-- Benjamin Franklin

It grieves me that many of my fellow gun owners (maybe even some of you here) voted for Obama or a third party candidate rather than McCain due to your bank accounts rather than your principals.

By some accounts there are 80 million, yes 80 million, gun owners in the US.  If we had all stuck together we would not be faced with the loss of our Second Amendment rights.

People our economy is not, I repeat, not that bad. 

Sure it is not great and it has been better but this is not India, Pakistan, Puerto Rico or South Africa.

The vast majority of our citizens are employed.
The vast majority of our citizens have a bed to lie in and a roof over there heads.
The vast Majority of our citizens have enough to eat.

Sure we have homeless, the majority due to drug addiction and or mental disorders.  Most of those who have lost homes due to the current banking crunch bought above there means to begin with or really did not qualify for a mortgage to begin with.

Sure some people have lost jobs.  But I firmly believe that anyone who truly wants to work can find some kind of work. It may not the work they want to do and it may be below their educational level but it would be work none the less until they could find better.

Every one of you has access to a computer and the internet or you would not be reading this now.  I venture to guess every one of you ate today and most likely ate meat with at least one meal today.  Most of you own at least one vehicle.

So you we are paying $3+ a gallon for gas... so what?  So our retirement savings have taken a shot... so what?  So we have to settle for hamburger instead of steak... so what?  So we have to skip a few dinners out or drive to the beach instead of taking that trip to Disney... so what?

So is a "hope" of financial security worth pissing away our freedom?   Not to me it isn't and I am not wealthy by any means.   

   
     

   

[Spanky]

Are you serious??
This is one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read.



Spanky

[victorcharlie]

Well Brett, Swampman was good enough to post a map in a previous post.

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,155820.0.html

It looks like to me, the urban area's are what swayed the election.

I had a hard time with McCain, but when Palin came on the ticket it got somewhat easier.

Maybe next time the Republicans will pick a conservative instead of a liberal.

[slim rem 7]

  bret theres holes in your statment ,one being many gun owners of a gun put up somewhere that they never really think about,,don t even consider it a right but they just own a gun..doesn t play in thier political thinking..should but it doesn t..
  however theres lotta wisdom in your reasoning also..
 most any time i post an opinion ,,its chocked full of holes but
 i post it any way..
  yours is certainly loaded with things worth considering ..

[Troyboy]

I fwiw think you are spot on




                                          unwilling to comprimise

[Heather]

Are you serious??
This is one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read.



Spanky

To me Spanky's post wins the award of one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read!

Heather

[Spanky]

Are you serious??
This is one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read.



Spanky

To me Spanky's post wins the award of one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read!

Heather

Thanks


Spanky

[billy_56081]

Are you serious??
This is one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read.



Spanky

To me Spanky's post wins the award of one of the most ridiculous posts I have ever read!

Heather

+1 Heather.

While the lead post may have some small flaws, it is generally on track. I'm not starving or in danger of losing my house and posesions.  I lived within my means, kept my dept low and pulled my retirment out of the markets when they were high and put it in fixed interest.

[Spanky]

Thanks again.


Spanky

[billy_56081]

Spanky in front of your signiature you should put former owner of, sold at gun show for cash, cash donated to charity. 

[Spanky]

Hey Billy Bob GFY



Spanky

[torpedoman]

I totally agree with this ridiculous post.

[Spanky]

People our economy is not, I repeat, not that bad. 

Sure we have homeless, the majority due to drug addiction and or mental disorders.
 
Sure some people have lost jobs. 

So you we are paying $3+ a gallon for gas... so what?

So our retirement savings have taken a shot... so what? 
  

   
     

   

These statements aren't ridiculous??







Spanky

[Don Fischer]

There is always someone running around yelling "The sky is falling". And false profits have been claiming the end of the world for as long as I can remember. This whole thing reeks of little more than fear mongering to me. There will probably be changes, but you won't lose your guns, will be able to buy more and you'll still find ammo to shoot. Bet we spend more on gas than we do guns and ammo! You really want to be pissed at someone, be pissed at the Republican party for running someone like McCain in the first place. I can't believe they even though they had a chance this time so he was the sacrificial lamb. This was as big a joke as when Dole ran.

[Brett]

People our economy is not, I repeat, not that bad. 

Sure we have homeless, the majority due to drug addiction and or mental disorders.
 
Sure some people have lost jobs. 

So you we are paying $3+ a gallon for gas... so what?

So our retirement savings have taken a shot... so what? 
   

   
     

   

These statements aren't ridiculous??







Spanky

No, I don't think so. Let's look at some stats.

Homeless: The most recent official count, in January 2007, found 671,888 people living on U.S. streets or in shelters, down 12% from January 2005.   According to the US population clock there are approx. U.S. U.S.
305,618,211 people living in the US.  So 98% of us have a home.

Unemployment: In October, the unemployment rate rose from 6.1 to 6.5 percent, and the number of unemployed persons increased to 10.1 million.  So 93.5% of us have jobs.

Gas Prices:
Netherlands     Amsterdam     $6.48
Norway    Oslo    $6.27
Italy    Milan    $5.96
Denmark    Copenhagen    $5.93
Belgium    Brussels    $5.91

Our current average = $3.20/gal

Per Capita income:
According to the World Bank the US is ranked 10th highest in the world.

Who's being ridicules?? 

[kevthebassman]

People our economy is not, I repeat, not that bad. 

Sure we have homeless, the majority due to drug addiction and or mental disorders.
 
Sure some people have lost jobs. 

So you we are paying $3+ a gallon for gas... so what?

So our retirement savings have taken a shot... so what? 
   

   
     

   

These statements aren't ridiculous??







Spanky

No, I don't think so. Let's look at some stats.

Homeless: The most recent official count, in January 2007, found 671,888 people living on U.S. streets or in shelters, down 12% from January 2005.   According to the US population clock there are approx. U.S. U.S.
305,618,211 people living in the US.  So 98% of us have a home.

Unemployment: In October, the unemployment rate rose from 6.1 to 6.5 percent, and the number of unemployed persons increased to 10.1 million.  So 93.5% of us have jobs.

Gas Prices:
Netherlands     Amsterdam     $6.48
Norway    Oslo    $6.27
Italy    Milan    $5.96
Denmark    Copenhagen    $5.93
Belgium    Brussels    $5.91

Our current average = $3.20/gal

Per Capita income:
According to the World Bank the US is ranked 10th highest in the world.

Who's being ridicules?? 

Just a note, the unemployment rate is much more complicated than simply saying  "93.5% of us have jobs."

EXPLANATION: Civilian Unemployment Rate

Released by Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS)
Released Monthly

The unemployment rate is a percentage of the labor force that is unemployed but actively seeking work.  The labor force is defined to be all people except the following:

   1. potential workers that are not seeking work
   2. juveniles 16 years of age or younger
   3. people that are institutionalized - e.g. in mental hospitals or correctional facilities

The three types of unemployment:

    * Frictional unemployment - consists of search unemployment and wait unemployment. This correctly implies that labor markets do not operate perfectly nor instantaneously in matching workers and jobs.  Unemployment will never be 0% because frictional unemployment will always exist.
    * Structural unemployment - unemployment resulting when the skills do not match those required for jobs. That is skills become obsolete.
    * Cyclical unemployment - unemployment caused by the recession phase of the business cycle

 

Measuring Unemployment

    Unemployment rate = (unemployed / labor force) * 100

This calculation of unemployment rate is criticized for many reasons

   1. by counting part-time workers as fully employed, the calculation understates unemployment
   2. there are numerous workers who, after unsuccessfully seeking employment, become discouraged and drop out of the labor force. The number of discouraged workers is larger during recession. Because discouraged workers are not counted, this calculation understates the unemployment rate
   3. People provide false information

In my area at least, the Chrysler truck and van plant has been cutting jobs for years, and just recently closed.  A lot of the employees have found other jobs, so they aren't unemployed, but for many of them, their new jobs don't pay anything near what they used to make. 

Underemployment is every bit as serious as unemployment.  Right now there's a lot of college kids graduating with bachelor's degrees in business, marketing, etc, and taking jobs sweeping floors for $8 an hour.

[Casull]

Right now there's a lot of college kids graduating with bachelor's degrees in business, marketing, etc, and taking jobs sweeping floors for $8 an hour.

Yeah.     Very easy to claim, but how about some statistics.  I'll bet they don't even keep statistics on the number of floor sweepers in this country.   

[billy_56081]

 Right now there are alot of kids that graduated college with bachelors degrees that should be sweeping floors for $8 an hour. Not everyone can be the CEO or management. We do  need laborers in our country, and being a general laboer is not something you should insult Kevin, that is con disending and insulting to many. Maybe you feel superior to them, that is degrading to the backbone of our workforce.

 Also now gas is $2 or less a gallon, my retirement did not take a hit, I was not greedy and invested wisely. People have lost jobs, people always lose jobs then they go find a new one. The agricultural industry is going strong as farmers received record high prices on their crops if they marketed well.Agricultural manufacturers have a several year backlog on orders. Consruction in the agricultural market is booming, in the last 2 years they have built 3 new huge ethanol plants withing 50 miles of me and we have at least 3 or 4 more already running within that radius.

 And Spanky reread my Post and think about it, There was a little wink at the end of it I don't think you get what i meant.

[bilmac]

The economic "crisis" was probably created by the media. They know that this is a way to unelect incumbant republicans, ie George Bush 1. It probably got out of hand and scared folks more than they thought it would. Also some of the really big money super liberals and Arab oil shieks were probably able to add to the chaos. This will quickly pass now that they got their guy elected because they will want to show us idiots how good their guy is.

[kevthebassman]

Right now there's a lot of college kids graduating with bachelor's degrees in business, marketing, etc, and taking jobs sweeping floors for $8 an hour.

Yeah.     Very easy to claim, but how about some statistics.  I'll bet they don't even keep statistics on the number of floor sweepers in this country.   

I don't give a rat's ass about statistics, I'm talking about kids I know personally.  Bright kids with degrees who cannot find jobs.  Nobody is hiring white collar workers.

Consruction in the agricultural market is booming, in the last 2 years they have built 3 new huge ethanol plants withing 50 miles of me and we have at least 3 or 4 more already running within that radius.

All subsidized by the government, by the way.  Ethanol isn't good business without .gov money.

[Graybeard]

Ethanol isn't good business period. Ya ain't supposed to be burning your food you're supposed to eat it.

[Casull]

Quote
Right now there's a lot of college kids graduating with bachelor's degrees in business, marketing, etc, and taking jobs sweeping floors for $8 an hour.

Yeah.     Very easy to claim, but how about some statistics.  I'll bet they don't even keep statistics on the number of floor sweepers in this country.   


I don't give a rat's ass about statistics, I'm talking about kids I know personally.  Bright kids with degrees who cannot find jobs.  Nobody is hiring white collar workers.

Exactly.  That is what I thought.  So, you know a couple of kids in that situation and you make a statement like it is an epidemic or something.   

[deltecs]

There is always someone running around yelling "The sky is falling". And false profits have been claiming the end of the world for as long as I can remember. This whole thing reeks of little more than fear mongering to me. There will probably be changes, but you won't lose your guns, will be able to buy more and you'll still find ammo to shoot. Bet we spend more on gas than we do guns and ammo! You really want to be pissed at someone, be pissed at the Republican party for running someone like McCain in the first place. I can't believe they even though they had a chance this time so he was the sacrificial lamb. This was as big a joke as when Dole ran.

Instead of spouting your opinion, did you read Obama's agenda on his websiter before it was removed?  If you did not, then everything you posted above has no logical conclusion based on any research.  You have expressed an opinion and conclusions regarding your emotional desire.  If one had read Obama's own website agenda, he certainly would not call McCain a joke above calling Obama a Marxists socilist and gun grabber.  Not to mention his Civilian Security Force.

[billy_56081]

  GB while I tend to agree that Ethanol is not a great buisiness as a whole. It is a buisiness we will have to live with. The loss of livestock feed is not complete in the corn used in ethanol as they ony lose the sugars to the fermentation and retain all the other food values to be used as feed. Ethanol is only a part of the good ag industry in the grain belt. My friend workds for a company that makes farm equipment and with foriegn orders from the weak dollar and domestic orders from record crop prices they are backlogged on orders for several years. Constuction of machine sheds and other out buildings, along with hog confinment barns is also booming.

  Kevin, why can't these guys have a blue or gray collar job? Are they too good for these jobs? Today going to college and getting a degree is pushed so hard that the working man is looked down on as an underacheiver. As a blue collar guy I find remarks like that very offensive. Many of these guys who have thier bachelors degree and can't find a job are the ones who would not be able to handle that position whether they were educated or not. Some guys no matter how much education are still stupid, like the old saying goes you can put lipstick on a pig.

[kevthebassman]

Chrysler cuts white collar jobs.

GM cuts salaried jobs.

USG cuts white collar jobs.

It's more than a couple of kids, Casull.  Folks with college educations are getting put out of jobs.  That fact is undeniable.  In this economy, employers are lucky to be able to keep the employees they've got, much less hire newly graduated workers.

Facts are, we're in a recession, and finding a job is tough.  Have you looked lately?  Pretending that everything is peachy only slightly less idiotic than running around like the sky is falling.

  GB while I tend to agree that Ethanol is not a great buisiness as a whole. It is a buisiness we will have to live with.

It's only a business we're forced to live with because it's been crammed down our throats by lobbyists in the pocket of corn growers.  Corn to gasoline isn't a winning equation... it takes as much or more energy to produce the ethanol as we get out of it.  The only way anyone is making money off of the crap is the federal subsidy!  (read: taxpayer money)


 

Kevin, why can't these guys have a blue or gray collar job? Are they too good for these jobs? Today going to college and getting a degree is pushed so hard that the working man is looked down on as an underacheiver. As a blue collar guy I find remarks like that very offensive. Many of these guys who have thier bachelors degree and can't find a job are the ones who would not be able to handle that position whether they were educated or not. Some guys no matter how much education are still stupid, like the old saying goes you can put lipstick on a pig.

You ARE offensive billy, and besides that, I earn my living as well.  No office for me.

Aside from that, where are all these blue and gray collar jobs you're talking about?  I'm looking for a change.

[Brett]

Hey, we might get a federal holiday out of this deal!  I feel sooo much better now. 

Planning under way for Obama holiday
The Capital-Journal
Published Sunday, November 09, 2008

Plans are being made to promote a national holiday for Barack Obama, who will become the nation's 44th president when he takes the oath of office Jan. 20.

"Yes We Can" planning rallies will be at 7 a.m. and 7 p.m. every Tuesday at the downtown McDonald's restaurant, 1100 Kansas Ave., until Jan. 13. The goals are to secure a national holiday in Obama's honor, to organize celebrations around his inauguration and to celebrate the 200th birthday of President Abraham Lincoln, who was born on Feb. 12 1809.

At 7:30 a.m. on Inauguration Day, Obama Cake will be served at the downtown McDonald's, and a celebration is scheduled for 8 p.m. to midnight Jan. 20 at the Ramada Hotel and Convention Center, 420 S.E. 6th.

For more information, contact Sonny Scroggins, (785) 232-3761, 845-6148 or at biasbustersofkansas@yahoo.com; Lamont Lassiter, McDonald's general manager, 608-2739; Ava Chander-Beard, (785) 234-9138, ava.beard@sbcglobal.net

[deltecs]

You know what I think, this is BS.  Just because a black man is elected president, this is no reason alone to create another holiday.  This man has done nothing but win an election and the rest of the US is celebrating, as if he had done something unique.  A black elected to president, was bound to happen at some point.  Do we have a holiday for a white president, not for great presidents, but just for being white.  No, and we should not have one, just because he's the first black.  We celebrate Presidents day and that should be enough for any one president.  I'm not going to get on the bandwagon and think just because Obama got elected, this entitles him to some sort of preferential treatment, by any means whatsoever.  He is the one, who stated the campaign is not about race but about policies.  So for my $.02, that is all he is going to get.  I know it was racial and most here know it was about race, but I'm not going to assist this trend in anyway. 

[nomosendero]

Ethanol isn't good business period. Ya ain't supposed to be burning your food you're supposed to eat it.

Yep, but then again Grandpa had his corn in liquid form to drink instead of eat. 

[Skunk]

Instead of spouting your opinion, did you read Obama's agenda on his websiter before it was removed?

It has not been removed from his website. It's just been placed under "Issues/Urban Policy." The part about gun issues is towards the bottom of "Urban Policy" page, under "CRIME AND LAW ENFORCEMENT."

[billy_56081]

Quote Kevin

"Aside from that, where are all these blue and gray collar jobs you're talking about?  I'm looking for a change."


Well Kevin, go to Jackson MN. Agco Allis will hire you tomorrow, as long as you can pass a drug test. They are hiring and are the palce I am talking about. Well that is if you are not too good for the job!!!!! All it takes is a good work history. I for one am sick of all these KIDS who think is all it takes is an education and they are right to the top. Try working your way up once, you will have a little better self esteem.