mediocre groups CZ 527M 7.62x39

[bluebayou]

I mounted a Nikon 4X Monarch on my new CZ.  I will recheck the rings and such, but I have some pretty mediocre results from factory Russian ammo.  I will try some handloading after deer season. 

My concern is the inletting and possible torquing of the action.  When I disassembled the rifle to clean it, I had a difficult time reassembling.  The magazine would not go into the rifle.  I disassembled 2 more times before I tried inserting the magazine BEFORE tightening the action screws.  That is the only way to get the rifle back together.

There is pressure on the right side of the action where the magazine release is.  I fired these groups at 50 yards today with the scope.  You can also see how the forearm is tight to the left side of the barrel. 




I plan on relieving the barrel channel (after deer season).  Does anyone have any other advice?  I have epoxy bedded 4 rifles so I will probably do this one too. 

[Skunk]

bluebayou,

You seem to know how to fix it and it sounds like you could do the work by yourself quite easily, but if you were asking for opinions, I think I'd contact CZ and tell them your story. I'm thinking they would happily take your rifle back and fix it up like it's supposed to be or maybe even send you a new stock. I'd say fix it yourself if you had bought it used, but you paid for a new rifle and should at least not have to correct CZ's error on the barrel channel. I guess it is just a matter of principle for me.

[Swampman]

I would try some American made ammo like Remington or Federal.

[wareagleguy]

First try Remington factory loads.  Brass using small primers does much better in mine.  I tried several loads but the Remington gave me the best groups @100.  I can get aout 1-1/14 inch 5 shot groups.  

[kyelkhunter3006]

Are those 1" squares on your target?  Assuming so, the Barnual is shooting close to 1" groups center to center, that would be 2" at 100 yards.  I'd say that's not too bad with cheap ammo in the first place, and will likely get much better if you bed the gun.  Since it's a new gun, like everyone said, call CZ about the issues first and let them correct it. 

I had one that would shoot the Wolf metal case 122gr HP into 5/8" 3 shot groups at 100 yds.  That was it's best shooting load, conveniently for me, since it was also cheap.  The Wolf 123gr FMJ metal case shot just over an inch, and the Remington shot under an inch, that's the only three I tried in it.

[tlyne]

Use Lapua ammo.

[bluebayou]

So has anyone else had an issue with assembly of his rifle?  The action and the inletting are my more immediate concerns. 

The ammo is an easy fix. 

I think that CZ is one of the "3" is an acceptable group" kind of companies.  Otherwise, I can relieve the barrel channel.  I was going to strip that godawful finish off anyway.

Something isn't right in reassembly.  I guess that I could call to ask them about that......but the hassle....

I love the rifle.  The main reason that I chose the caliber was because it is a light recoiling, large bore cartridge.  Have always loved the cartridge in my SKS.  I figured that using cheap, Russian ammo was a bonus. 

2" is acceptable, just mediocre.  Nothing to get excited about, but pleny accurate for killing stuff.

[wareagleguy]

When you put the rifle back together make sure the upper and lower (trigger guard) fit correctly.  There is a the upper fits in the lower ridge.  It takes a few trys to get it right.

[Swampman]

I believe it was Townsend Whelen who wrote that, "Only accurate rifles are interesting."

[kyelkhunter3006]

I don't that making a phone call is too much of a hassle to ward off any problems that you might have with the gun.  It might be an easy fix.  Now if they want you to send in the gun, that could be a hassle, and you are the only one who can decide if it's worth it, or you can just fix it yourself.

I never had problems with my rifle when I took it apart.  Well, as long as I remembered to put in all of the parts.   

[bluebayou]

I believe it was Townsend Whelen who wrote that, "Only accurate rifles are interesting."

?
Well, then I am trying to make it interesting.  That would be the point of asking for advice.

[wareagleguy]

Try the Remington ammo.  It made all the difference in the world on mine.  The problem will be finding Remington brass.

[R.W.Dale]

Try the Remington ammo.  It made all the difference in the world on mine.  The problem will be finding Remington brass.

especially If I have anything to do with it, I've been buying all the R/P 7.62x39 brass I can get my hands on.

I think the groups you're getting with the ammo you're using are in line with what my CZ or ar15 would do with the same ammunition. You simply cannot expect sub MOA performance with sub $5 a box ammo

Something I did to help the bedding on my CZ was to fold a insurance card up underneath the recoil lug thus spacing the bbl ever so slightly up out of the bottom of the bbl channel

[wareagleguy]

I really must give Krochus the credit on the Remington ammo.  I tried it and my groups closed by half.

Krochus,
I may have a chance to buy some bulk Remington brass but it will be the first of the year.  If I can get it you want in?

[bluebayou]

I have my handloads from the SKS which is Win brass, CCI Large, 28.0 H4895, and Hornady .311 VMAX.  They were pretty darn accurate in the SKS.  

Kind of a trade between good ammo and poor rifle, now poor ammo and good rifle, eh?

I am eyeing the Lapua brass from Grafs.  For 33 bucks it is same price basically as 2 fifty piece bags of Winchester.  

I figure that I won't lose as much brass as I did with the SKS.  

I have some 123 Hornady 311 SP's, but no brass for them.  

Like I said, my bigger concern is the reassembly process.  Why is it so hard to assemble.

Krochus, my barrel doesn't have pressure point in the channel, it is pretty much free floated.  Except of course that it is rubbing on the left side of the forearm.  This is easily fixed, just need to do it.

Hope to load some next weekend.  Going to Arkansas to look for some deer this weekend.  

I will be ridiculed by the others for having a "baby" rifle.  They all have 7mm Mags and 270's.  Hope to tag one with the CZ.

[bluebayou]

What primer are you guys using with the small pocket Remington brass?

[wareagleguy]

CCI Small Rifle

[R.W.Dale]

I typically use the CCI's as well.

I will be ridiculed by the others for having a "baby" rifle.  They all have 7mm Mags and 270's.  Hope to tag one with the CZ.

Don't listen to em! Go check out my thread in the deer hunting forum where I filled my doe tag with a 7.62x39mm AR15 at a range of 278yds

Krochus,
I may have a chance to buy some bulk Remington brass but it will be the first of the year.  If I can get it you want in?

I've bought a lot here recently but if the price is right I would prolly buy another 100 cases

I am eyeing the Lapua brass from Grafs.  For 33 bucks it is same price basically as 2 fifty piece bags of Winchester. 

I haven't been able to achieve nearly the level of accuracy or case life with LR primed cases. The Small primed Remington cases are where it's at in terms of 7.62x39 accuracy. I don't know why manufacturers insist on using LR primers to light off a paltry 30grs of powder

[bluebayou]

It would suck to buy a $20 box of Corelokts just to get the cases for reloading.  But, I can see myself doing it.

[R.W.Dale]

It would suck to buy a $20 box of Corelokts just to get the cases for reloading.  But, I can see myself doing it.

I think wally-world has the UMC FMJ fodder for closer to $15.  I've bought the stuff just for the cases myself.

[Badnews Bob]

I just started buying the grean box rem It shoot great outta my CZ been getting it for 11.99 a box I'd like to be able to buy some brass but its kinda hard to find the rem.

Dose the UMC have small rifle primers?

[R.W.Dale]

I just started buying the grean box rem It shoot great outta my CZ been getting it for 11.99 a box I'd like to be able to buy some brass but its kinda hard to find the rem. Cool

Dose the UMC have small rifle primers?

I think we're talking about the same stuff here

[Badnews Bob]

I've been buying the SP green and yellow box Rem. I'll have to look for some of the UMC stuff, I just priced some SP rem at wallmart and its now 16.99 a box.

I am going to try and build a .358X39 and I want the small primer cases to work with.

[kyelkhunter3006]

If you've been getting the Remington softpoint hunting load for $12 a box, you better buy'em all.  Around here they start at $19.99 (Bass Pro Shops) and I've seen them as high as $24.99.  Matter of fact, if I get another CZ, I might have you buy a bunch of that stuff and ship it to me, LOL.

[bluebayou]

Well, I pulled them out of the box at work.  The UMC appears to be a large primers.  We were sold out of the Corelokts. 

Why the crap would Remington make the UMC ammo with Large primer and the regular Remington with Small primers? 

[R.W.Dale]

Well, I pulled them out of the box at work.  The UMC appears to be a large primers.  We were sold out of the Corelokts. 

Why the crap would Remington make the UMC ammo with Large primer and the regular Remington with Small primers? 

I've heard that remington is changing over to LR primers <"I know it sounds retarded as hell" > Appearently the changeover is already underway. That's why myself and others have been buying all the small primed cases we can get our grubby fingers on.

[bluebayou]

Yesterday, after you guys brought up the point of Remington cases I started looking around on the internet.  Seems that the PPC shooters prefer Remington 7.62x39 cases because they can neck them down and they are 1/2 cost of the smaller bores and, specifically, they have small primers.

I wonder if a large primer in such a small case, 30 grains like Krochus said, makes more turbulent flame?  Was thinking that a more consistent ignition is what we want anyway.  I deburr flash-holes and ream pockets all of the time.  Just thinking.