Author Topic: Whats you opinion? and why? (Read 1939 times)

bigchast1 · « **on:** November 15, 2008, 09:10:40 AM »

Ok fellers' here it is, a place to hale in all its glory your caliber choice between........
A 7mm Rem. Mag, 7mm WSM, 7mm RUM,
or
A 300 WSM, 300 RUM, 300 Win. Mag.
Here is what I know. The .308 caliber bullets are of a higher max projectile weight, and kind of more abundant. The .284 caliber is a faster flatter shooting round. I have shot most and to "me" recoil is not that bad. I am a handloading, small group, little SD perfectionist. This rifle will be either a Remington Sendaro, or a Ruger #1 (I think it's a #1?). The primary use will be for NC black bear, and up to elk, moose and grizzles in the future. I have a Win. Model 70 in a .270 for the black bears down to ground hogs. Also shoot a Remington 700 in 22-250 for a toy and varmint eliminator. I like all my rifles, and pistols to shoot .5 moa or better, so keep this in mind. I will be buying in the next 4-6 weeks. Also if any of y'all have a place to shoot any of the above big animals for the 2009 season I'd like to know about it, maybe we can get together. Thanks for your thoughts, Chad.

RaySendero · « **Reply #1 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:23:12 AM »

If you already have a 270, Why not go even bigger?

.338 to .375 caliber!

deltecs · « **Reply #2 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:30:06 AM »

With a .270, it is good almost all lower 48 game by itself. If one needed something bigger, go to a bigger bore than .308 and don't limit it to magnums. All the choices you have listed are for magnum rounds, which just aren't necessary or the most effective on really big NA game.

30-30man · « **Reply #3 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:53:50 AM »

The 270 you have will handle about anything you want in the US. I think you already have it covered. If you are like me, there's never a time where you have enough rifles. If you're itching to buy, I would not buy anything hard to find shells for unless you reload. Any of the WSM or RUM cartridges are out, you can't even find those at most gun stores most of the time. I just don't think a collection is complete without a 30-06. It is very close to the 7mm Rem Mag when loaded to it's potential. It can handle 100 -220 grainers. That is enough for ground hogs to elephants. There is a reason even Tom, Dick, and Harry owns one. They just get the job done. I'd go with a 30-06.

bigchast1 · « **Reply #4 on:** November 15, 2008, 11:30:17 AM »

I was originally looking at a 375 h&h or a 444 marlin, the 444 cause it is the same bullet diameter as my pistol and smoke pole. The H&H just cause. Cause its seems bada$$ on paper. Yes, from all the research I did before I bought the 270 it will take all game, as long as I do my job(shot placement) the rifle and load will do its job. But..., please continue all.
Tell me more about the 338. Don't hear alot on that round.

onesonek · « **Reply #5 on:** November 15, 2008, 11:39:53 AM »

if I had the .270 already, I too would go with a .338 something or bigger. The .338-06AI would be my choice with .338 Win Mag second.

Dave

jasonprox700 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 15, 2008, 01:00:02 PM »

I'm with the rest of the crew here, why not jump up to the .338? I myself handload for my .280 (hoping to get a .280 AI built soon!). I plan on taking this to Montana next fall for a combo elk/mule deer hunt. I'll be loading something in the 160/175 gr range.

But, if I were to go larger, it would probably be a .338 WM. Another option would be to wildcat the WSM case up to the .338, since you are a handloader.

There isn't anything the .280 can't handle in the lower 48, along with the .270. A .308 caliber wouldn't really be a very big step up, especially since you mentioned the possiblity of grizzlies.

poncaguy · « **Reply #7 on:** November 15, 2008, 03:37:28 PM »

My favorite is the 300 WSM, very accurate in my Winchester Super Shadow and recoil is mild to me.

Skunk · « **Reply #8 on:** November 15, 2008, 03:40:34 PM »

Quote from: bigchast1 on November 15, 2008, 09:10:40 AM

Ok fellers' here it is, a place to hale in all its glory your caliber choice between........
A 7mm Rem. Mag, 7mm WSM, 7mm RUM, or A 300 WSM, 300 RUM, 300 Win. Mag.

The primary use will be for NC black bear, and up to elk, moose and grizzles in the future.

Well Chad, none of those chamberings particularly appeal to me. For Black Bear, Elk, and Moose, I'd use a 35 Whelen, and just bypass all those Magnums. If I had to pick one though, you know, if someone put a pass for a free trip to say Alaska for a Moose hunt in my face, but said, "Buy Magnum!!!!, Shoot Magnum!!!!, or No go Alaska Free!!!!!," I guess I'd take the regular 7mm Mag or the regular 300 Win Mag. None of that short magnum or ultra magnum stuff for me, thank you. My reasoning is that in my opinion, a 35 Whelen will do anything that all those Mags will at a certain distance. Even a 200 grain SP in a 35 Whelen gives close to a ton of stopping power (energy) out to 200 yards. How much more would a guy need. Plus, those Mags are too expensive to reload. My son's hot load for his 300 Ultra Mag takes close to 100 grains of powder, where a hot load for my 35 Whelen uses around 50 grains - 60 grains. And frankly, I don't see much difference in stopping power between the two. Just my opinion.

Swampman · « **Reply #9 on:** November 15, 2008, 03:44:20 PM »

Sell the .270 & get a .30-06.

poncaguy · « **Reply #10 on:** November 15, 2008, 04:08:09 PM »

I'll also agree with the 35 Whelen, and the 338 Federal is a real nice low recoil round..........

WyoStillhunter · « **Reply #11 on:** November 15, 2008, 04:30:34 PM »

The magnums listed can do it all, no doubt. For my money there is no need for the weight, recoil, muzzle blast, and expense of a magnum. I am well served by my battery of .223 Rem., 6.5X55, and 35 Whelen. For up close and personal skulking in the dark timber I often go to a 444S Marlin. Call me a traditionalist (old fashioned?) when it comes to choosing hunting cartridges.

mannyrock · « **Reply #12 on:** November 17, 2008, 05:16:14 AM »

Hmmm,

If you are use to the comfort of shooting the .270, you are going to be in for a big, and very unpleasant, surprise if you go to a ridiculously large caliber like the .375 H&H. It would be a total waste of money.

On the other hand, you will have all bases neatly covered if you go to the tried and true .35 Whelen, or maybe (maybe) a .338 Winchester mag (which I also think is way too much.)

The best advice I can give is this: see if you can find some folks who have a .35 Whelen, and a .338 Win. Mag, that will let you shoot a half of a box from the bench at your local range. (Also, if allowed, fire a half a box standing up next to the bench.) Shoot the Whelen first, then the .338. After you do this, you can pick which one you like best. (I'm betting the .35 Whelen).

If you find that both of these are just too much recoil, then check out the good old .300 Win Mag.

A practical question: do you really think that in your lifetime, you are going to spend $20,000 to go to Alaska and shoot a big time grizzly? Or, spend that $25,000 (or more) to go to Africa and shoot a Rhino or a Cape Buffalo or an Elephant? I mean, . .. . really? If the answer is no, then the .35 Whelen has you covered, and the .338 has you more than covered. (Even the comfortable shooting old .300 H&H Mag would do fine.)

Regards,

Mannyrock

charles p · « **Reply #13 on:** November 17, 2008, 07:45:03 AM »

I vote for the 300WSM also. The other WSM cases and the RUMs might not outlive us.

Swampman · « **Reply #14 on:** November 17, 2008, 07:49:20 AM »

I don't think the 300WSM will be around much longer either.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #15 on:** November 17, 2008, 07:51:28 AM »

300 WIN MAG .

jasonprox700 · « **Reply #16 on:** November 17, 2008, 09:49:35 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on November 17, 2008, 07:49:20 AM

I don't think the 300WSM will be around much longer either.

Out of all of the WSM and WSSM, I think the 300 WSM is the most likely to stick around. I don't see this one going away, ever.

Tunaman · « **Reply #17 on:** November 17, 2008, 12:17:48 PM »

I honestly do not think that any of your choices are grea Brown bear cartridges but short of Brown bear, all will do what you want. I own 3 of your choices, 7mm rem mag, 300wsm and 300 win mag and I also own a 7Stw, which is pretty comparable to a 7RUM. Since you load, ammo avaliability isn't a real issue to you, so that doesn't detract from any of your choices. You have not mentioned what your expected ranges might be so that makes helping you more difficult. If you were planning to shoot 400 yards + I would recomend the 7rum or stw. If your shots were 400 or less, the 300 win mag or 7 Rem mag would be my choice. I have not found that the 300 RUM gives you that much advantage over what you can get using a 300 win Mag. The upside to all of this is that if you do go to Alaska in the future, you can buy another new rifle.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #18 on:** November 17, 2008, 01:25:14 PM »

Another Vote for 338 Win Mag.
It is the happy medium with so much more between the 7/300's and the 375 H&H.
It will do what the other belted mags can do only it drops about an inch more with the standard loads.
It will out perform the 375H&H past 200 yards, ammo is easy to find and you have a wide choice. Recoil is not punnishing. My 338 is not different to me than my 30-06 in recoil and is a lot more pleasant to shoot than my 375H&H.
The 338 does well on game with no meat loss to blood shot.
I made a 250+ yard shot on a running Pig a few years ago after the first shot at 200 yards blew off it's jaw. The second round I shot at the Pig we are going to call a ranging shot rather than a miss and the 225 grain Remington factory soft point entered about the size of my pinkey and exited the Pig with a hole the size of my thumb. Took out two ribs, the heart, and both lungs.
I got the 375 when looking for a second 338 for brush and hills. I found my rifle in a store used and had a Weaver grand slam 4.5-14 scope with an adjustable front objective and while doing a drive I was walking from deep woods to rolling hills and back to deep woods and twisting the front of the scope was a pain in the *$@&. i was looking for a 338 that i could stick a fixed 4 power on and be done. Found a 375 Sako with e 4X leupold on it and it was a good deal so... But the 375 is a lot to shoot off the bench and starts to really hurt after 5 rounds. Standing up off hand is a different story and is a big shove, perfect as a drive rifle with a little more knock down at close range. For Brown Bear I would lean for the 375H&H for the power and the fixed low power scope but the 338 Win Mag would be hard not to choose as I can shoot it better due to less recoil and what game is going to tell the difference between 4200 foot pounds and 3850 foot pounds?

deltecs · « **Reply #19 on:** November 17, 2008, 02:59:22 PM »

I'd agree with mcwoodduck on using the .375 for big brown bear, but not for his reasoning. The .375 has a lot more surface bullet frontal area than the .338 and thus has to hit with a bit more authority. The object is hit hard on big bear along with proper bullet placement. Just having the bullet in the vital zone without breaking down a big bear may result in a charge. And you do not want a big brown bear coming at you with the speed of an express train, especially in the type and terrain normally habited by big brownies. The larger frontal area of the .375 with heavy bullets will hit substantially harder even though the energy levels are comparable.

corbanzo · « **Reply #20 on:** November 18, 2008, 06:48:44 AM »

Unless you are shooting it with a .338 federal, or a .338-06, I don't think it's gonna matter to the bear.

If you hit him with a .338 win mag or a .338 RUM or .340 WB, with a good slow expanding bullet, it is gonna knock him down just as fast as a .375 will.

I also recommend a .338 mag, because it has the power to take out larger game, but also, it can be loaded down, or loaded fast, for smaller or further away game. The ballistics for some of the 210 grain .338 bullets out there are quite impressive.

mannyrock · « **Reply #21 on:** November 18, 2008, 07:11:12 AM »

Hmmm, suddenly this has become a Brown Bear question? Not what the original poster asked, and I'm betting that like me, he doesn't have $20,000 to spend on such a hunt. Probably not 1 in 10,000 hunters will ever go on a brown bear hunt, so I don 't let that "fantasy" rule my rifle choice.

Time to get real. The following calibers all neatly answer his original question:

.35 Whelen
.300 Win Mag.
.338 Win Mag

(And by the way, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a Brown Bear with a .35 Whelen or a .338 Win. Mag.)

Mannyrock

Mannyrock

Drilling Man · « **Reply #22 on:** November 18, 2008, 10:24:15 AM »

Quote

I'm betting that like me, he doesn't have $20,000 to spend on such a hunt. Probably not 1 in 10,000 hunters will ever go on a brown bear hunt, so I don 't let that "fantasy" rule my rifle choice.

When did it start costing 20K to shoot a brown bear? I've shot a few, and i haven't spent 20K on all of them together...

BTW, my .338-06 has no problem flattening any brown bear you put in front of me... Of course, i've always kept it loaded with 250NP's or 275 Speers too...

DM

deltecs · « **Reply #23 on:** November 18, 2008, 10:53:16 AM »

Quote

The primary use will be for NC black bear, and up to elk, moose and grizzles in the future.

As quoted in the original post, so shooting bears with recomendations on rifle cartridges are apporpiate. I'm in agreement with most posters that the .270 Win is more than sufficient for hunting NA game in the lower 48 and most game in Alaska. I too agree that just going to the .30's magnums or 7mm mags for the bigger and more dangerous NA game, is not as good as going to a bigger bore, like the .338 Win, 338-06, 35 Whelen, 9.3x62 or .375 in either Ruger or H&H. There is a world of difference between them and the high speed smaller bore magnums on big game.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #24 on:** November 18, 2008, 11:16:28 AM »

I've seen some of the bear in NC and don't blame you for wanting to go bigger than 30-06.
Again .338 would be the perfect elk rifle and with 225 to 250 grain bullets you will be good to go with the black bear in NC. Two or three years ago I was there for the week Bear was in and someone took a 350-500 pound bear on the far side of our farm. I got to see it in the bed of the F150 when they were leaving and it almost filled the short bed.
It's not too hard to kill the bear but anchoring them to keep them from running to the thick stuff in the swamp is the hard part and like
Deltics said in fewer words, bigger bullets with round noses make bigger holes and tend to break bones to knock the bear down and keep them there. I think the bear that was killed on the farm was shot with either 30-30 or 35 Rem as there was a Marlin lever in the front seat of the truck.
And yes 338 Fed, 338-06 would work for both bear and elk but My opinion is 338 win mag for the amount of loadings offered as well as it is available in most stores in elk country. Heck four of us filled out cards at Wall Mart and the store in Temecula CA was carrying the Remington 225 grain Soft Point loading.

HogFan · « **Reply #25 on:** November 19, 2008, 09:14:50 AM »

I think I would go with either a .308, or a .338 Federal, since you already have a .270.

WSM's, I too think the 300WSM will stick around, as will the .270 WSM. The 7mmWSM, and 325 WSM, may not.

jro45 · « **Reply #26 on:** December 14, 2008, 05:47:59 AM »

Next up from a 270 is the 7mm Mag then the 30/06 then the 300 Win Mag or 300 RUM.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #27 on:** December 19, 2008, 08:38:24 AM »

Given that you already have a .270, and limiting my answer to the cartridges you mentioned, I'd opt for the .300 Win Mag.

If going larger I'd get a .338 Win Mag, .35 Whelen or a .375 Ruger.

GGaskill · « **Reply #28 on:** December 19, 2008, 01:04:46 PM »

Kinda depends on how far away you are shooting at the grizzlies. A .45-70 with 500 grain bullets in a strong rifle should be more than adequate for reasonable length shots.