making muzzleloader bullets

[ihookem]

 I have a .50 cal muzzleloader and have a lee 365 gr. bullet mould. I made some bulets and put some Lee alox on them thinking it would help. Was this a mistake to putting alox on them. The reason I ask is because they seem accurate for one or two rounds and then they shoot all over. Would I be better off with bullets with nothing on them or lube them with something else? Muzzleloader season is close and want to shoot deer with my own bullets. Thanks in advance.

[Larry Gibson]

LLA is not really a very good lube for BP bullets as you've found out.  I make my own with beeswax and olive oil (60/40 by volume) or you can use something as simple as Crisco lard.  Most any store that sells BP loading supplies will have a BP bullet lube such as Bore Butter.  Try one of those.

Larry Gibson

[ihookem]

Thanks Larry, do I just rub in in the grooves and put it down the barrel? Will Bore Buter make it go down the barrel easier? Will it foul the barrel? Can I not lube it at all? Just a bunch of questions for a guy that know little about this stuff.

[Badnews Bob]

Bore Butter is what I use on my front stuffer bullets. I just smear some in the grooves before I load them.

[45-70.gov]

i  used  Crisco  for  years...but don't  know if  they still  make  it

last  few  times  out  i used  wheel Bering grease  seemed  to  work

any  other thoughts  on  wheel Bering grease??

but  any lube  is better  than  none...i  think

[jhalcott]

  from what I have heard petroleum (oil)  and black powder fouling turn into a tar like substance. You did not say what 50 caliber you are using. If it is a new in line type it may be made for a sabot round.Check to see what the twist is. SOME twist are designed for round balls, others are for conical bullets.

[blhof]

If he got a few good rounds, it's probably the right twist for the bullet; but the wrong lube.  As previously stated B/p and petrolium based lubes form a tar.  Alox is a petrolium based lube, go with the crisco or mix, or even one of the commercial B/p lubes sold at most places that sell B/p supplies. Cleaning B/p also requires just soap and water, dish soap or simple green and a light lube with vegetable oil after thorough drying and remember to swab barrel dry of oil, before loading and test fire a cap or two before loading to insure a dry clear spark path.

[Cheesehead]

I have made them sub-caliber and used a sabot. Good results.

Cheese

[ihookem]

It is a T/C Encore with a 1/28 " twist. The way the responses are going it must be the bad lube. I will just try Crisco. Cheesehead I do use the . Rem. 44 mag bullets and it worked on my first deer last year, so I don't need to use my own bullets for good results but for some reason I want to. Maybe it's the money spent on the mould and all the lead laying around for so many years. Thanks everyone.

[45-70.gov]

i  better go back  to crico  only  used  the wb greese
a few  times

what  about toilet bowl  wax rings  they  petrol  also??

[blhof]

They are now, they used to be beeswax and hydrogenated vegetable oil.

[Idaho Ron]

I use a Lee C-501-440-RF 500 S&W mould. When I pour them out of pure lead they weigh 460 gr. I paper patch them and shoot them out of my TC Renegade with a Green Mountain barrel with a 1-28 twist. I am getting sub 2" groups with them at 100 yards. I paper patch them and run them through a Lee .501 sizer dry. When I am ready to load I put just a dab of Hornady Great plains lube on them. They are very accurate out to 200 yards. I have had some good luck with them out to 300 yards but they do very well under 200. My son shot a deer with this bullet a couple of weeks ago. Ron

[45-70.gov]

i  have  that  mold
will  have  to try  it
even  tho  i  have  a 2 liter bottle  of  370g t/c  maxi balls

[Larry Gibson]

45-70.gov

I use the Maxi balls in my TC Blk Mtn Magnum, a .50 with 28" twist made for sabots, also.  I found that with the old "only use pure lead in ML's" addage that I lost accuracy way before any meaningful velocity was reached. I switched to 1-16 alloy I use for my trapdoor bullets (Frankford Arsenal found that alloy to be best with the 500 gr bullet) and worked up to 90 gr 777 fffg which gives 1525 fps and 2 moa at 100yards for 6 shots (one in the barrel and the others are the 5 speed loaders I carry) with no cleaning or wiping needed between shots. They hold well to 200 yards also.  Hammers deer and elk along with the occasional coyote.  I've recently tried 1-20 alloy and it worked well with the limited test so I may work more with it this winter.

Larry Gibson

[moto357]

Larry,
You use those harder bullets with a gas check?  Do you anneal the check as well?  I have only been able to shoot a few with pure lead and an annealed check with good results so far.  But as I said, very limited use so far between moving and huntin season.

[Hank08]

Ihookum, Dont give up on the alox, even though I've heard this story before that it won't work, it's the best stuff I've found.  I had LBT make me a 500 gr. mold for the .50 and I lube it with alox.  I've tried it in at least a dozen makes of fast twist muzzleloaders and it shot great in all of them.  As small as 4" groups at 200 yds.  Usually 12 to 15 shots before they start to get hard to load and then a spit patch run down the bore will clean it out.  Some use a damp patch on the jag when seating the bullet, doing that each time they'll always be easy to seat. I also use alox in black powder cartridge rifles, that is the NRA formula 1/2 alox & 1/2 beeswax.  248 yds. my furtherest kill on a deer, TC Renegade with GM drop in 1/28 twist barrel and TC iron sights, another at 221 yds.  Many hunters in my area use these bullets and report
no problems and many deer and Elk are killed each yr. with them.  90 grs. Goex 2F is the load we use.
H08

[SHOOTALL]

I believe we may use same bullet - R E A L bullet . I use bore butter and have good luck .
coat in advance and allow to dry if the soft tube butter is used , had some in a block and that was better but can't find it anymore .

[Larry Gibson]

Larry,
You use those harder bullets with a gas check?  Do you anneal the check as well?  I have only been able to shoot a few with pure lead and an annealed check with good results so far.  But as I said, very limited use so far between moving and huntin season.

No, I do not use a gas check.  I do use a lubed "Wonder Wad" under the bullet. More recently I've been cutting my own out of felt purchased at a clothing store. After cutting them I put them in a zip lock bag along with a glob of lube (5/4 beeswax/olive oil) and micro-wave until the patches are well lubed.  They stick to the bottom of the bullet in the speed laoder and load in one simple push into the bore.  The harder 1/20 and 1/16 alloy bullets resist setback during accelleration of the heavy loads.  Yet they are maleable enough to bump up to take the rilfling and expand extremely well in game.

Larry Gibson