breach loading cannons. BATF rules on ignitsion sourse

[ratpatrol]

 I have made a breach loading  20 mm cannon using a custom  made brass case.The projectile is not fixed or can be to the case. My question is how to set it off with a cap or primer that is legal ? Can the primer be part of the case like modern ammo?
  I"m a new guy on the block and a long time cannon shooter,this is my first breach loader project and have been told this a gray area with ATF.

[cannonmn]

Sorry but per the rules of this board we don't get into discussions of interpretations of BATFE rules.  The very best thing for you to do is to take your question to your local BATFE office.

[Cannoneer]

I have made a breach loading  20 mm cannon using a custom  made brass case.The projectile is not fixed or can be to the case. My question is how to set it off with a cap or primer that is legal ? Can the primer be part of the case like modern ammo?
  I"m a new guy on the block and a long time cannon shooter,this is my first breach loader project and have been told this a gray area with ATF.

Ratpatrol,

 Your post isn't very clear, I can't follow what it is you're trying to describe. If the cannon you made uses self-contained ammunition: Ammunition in which the propellant, projectile, and primer are held together by a cartridge case, (custom made brass case?) and is called fixed ammunition then it is not an accepted topic on this forum.

[GGaskill]

Check this thread about making a cartridge firing salute gun.

[Double D]

Welcome to GBO Cannons. We are glad to have you aboard.

From your post it appears that your cannon may not be appropriate for this forum.  You did not give us enough information to clearly determine that.

For our board the cannon must replicate a cannon made before 1899. you will find our Read and Heed! Board Rules post clearly defining what guns are allowed on our board.   

We interpret the ATFE regulations to say breechloading cannons made prior to 1899 shooting ammunition no longer made in the U.S and not available in commercial channels is considered an antique and allowed to be discussed here.

That would mean for this board the chambering in your cannon would have to be a chambering of a type made prior to 1899. 

If the gun is a replication of a pre1899 cannon and has been redisigned to shoot fixed ammo it is not allowed

The whole issue fixed ammunition will have to determined by ATFE. If you will provide us with a copy of a determination letter from ATF stating your gun and ammunition meets the definition of an antique we will allow discussion of your gun on our board.

The discussion of the interpretation ATF regulations on our board is always off limits. There is already to much bad information about ATF Regulations on the internet and we do not want to be the source of any additional.  The only place you can get correct interperetations is from the ATFE.

So until you can show us that your gun replicates a pre 1899 gun and ammo, or you provide us with a copy of a letter from ATFE defining your gun as antique you can not post on hti s forum. 

GBO does have an exotic weapons discussion forum  You should be able discuss post 1898  DD's there. 

[ratpatrol]

Double D-- There are pre 1899 breach loading cannons , the problem was sealing gasses,by using a case it solved it. I SAID IT WAS NON FIXED PROJECTAL TO CASE. I now it"s illegal for fixed ammo over 60 cal. except shotguns. My question was how to set it off, I do not want to go to shoot and have problems. I thought if anybody would know you guys would.
  I don"t want to get off on the wrong foot here. I have made several half scale mussel loading cannons also bowling ball mortar, and  won Meany first places here in central ca. This sight surprised me that there so Meany bp cannon shooters out there. This  20mm cannon is still in the design stage.

[Double D]

Read the rules of the board before arguing. Breech loaders are welcomed as long as they meet the board rules.  If your gun meets these rules then go ahead and discuss it.  You will find some great help here and I'll bet even a solution to your problem. 

[Cat Whisperer]

Double D-- There are pre 1899 breach loading cannons , the problem was sealing gasses,by using a case it solved it. I SAID IT WAS NON FIXED PROJECTAL TO CASE. I now it"s illegal for fixed ammo over 60 cal. except shotguns. My question was how to set it off, I do not want to go to shoot and have problems. I thought if anybody would know you guys would.
  I don"t want to get off on the wrong foot here. I have made several half scale mussel loading cannons also bowling ball mortar, and  won Meany first places here in central ca. This sight surprised me that there so Meany bp cannon shooters out there. This  20mm cannon is still in the design stage.

As DD said, WELCOME to the board.
Since BATF plays by both published laws and their own rules and procedures, I suggest doing what you're doing (researching options) and also contacting them for a ruling.  If you have documentation from them that your plan to build by a particular design is OK you're in a very much better position than finding out after the fact that it's not.

There are folks that have gone that route, sent letters of inquiry with designs to BAFTE and gotten back letters of approval.  I'd start (after reading the laws) by picking up the phone and talking to them; and I'd do this before making anything.

[Graybeard]

Unless I am misreading the OP it is too late for that. He said he has built it so it's a feat accomplished now and he's wanting to know if what he did is legal. Kinda late to be asking.

[Cat Whisperer]

Glad to see that you're reading between the lines.  That's what I said without saying it.  Of course, it may well be that he's read the law correctly and it will be legal - that's the gamble.

[Victor3]

This  20mm cannon is still in the design stage.

 The OP says the one in question hasn't been manufactured yet, methinks.

 Sometimes I say "look what I made" when I've only got the drawings done

[Cannoneer]

Victor, the sentence you quote ("The 20mm cannon is still in the design stage.") is taken from Ratpatrol's second post, not his first post. If a person (at least this person) is reading the first post without the aid of clairvoyant powers, and relying solely on a comprehension of the English language, then the first post contains the information that the 20 millimeter cannon had already been manufactured.

[cannonmn]

relying solely on a comprehension of the English language

Sometimes that works and sometimes it doesn't.

I have made several half scale mussel loading cannons

I'm not makin' fun of anybody, I know that only spellcheck could have done this.  But that line brought up visions of a cannon made to launch small clams.

[Victor3]

Victor, the sentence you quote ("The 20mm cannon is still in the design stage.") is taken from Ratpatrol's second post, not his first post. If a person (at least this person) is reading the first post without the aid of clairvoyant powers, and relying solely on a comprehension of the English language, then the first post contains the information that the 20 millimeter cannon had already been manufactured.

 Maybe so, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. Especially a new poster.

[Terry C.]

.. that line brought up visions of a cannon made to launch small clams.

"Shelling" the enemy?

[Double D]

"Shelling" the enemy?

Terry, Terry, Terry....groan