Author Topic: Looking for a new side lock .50cal (Read 5884 times)

Huntsman1 · « **on:** December 18, 2008, 06:55:59 AM »

Well I've narrowed down my choices, I just have'nt decided which would be a better front-stuffer to carry around on a hunt. I presently shoot a Pedersoli Frontier percussion and now want something a little shorter and bit more robust. So these are the ones I'm looking at;
1) T/C Hawken
2) Lyman GPR ; and
3) Pedersoli Missouri River Hawken

What would your decision be?

buckskin billy · « **Reply #1 on:** December 18, 2008, 07:39:06 AM »

anyone of them would be a good choice.if you wanted better you'd have to get a custom built gun. i think both the thompson center and lyman are american made, while the pedersoli is made in italy.
the pedersoli in my opinion is more historically correct than the others. but they are all good and you can't go wrong with none of them

Ladobe · « **Reply #2 on:** December 18, 2008, 07:43:36 AM »

Shorter choice would be a TC Renegade in 50 or 54. Love my first year 54 with a 12 GA switch barrel.

I only buy American - makes the choice easier.

Swampman · « **Reply #3 on:** December 18, 2008, 07:57:01 AM »

I'd rather have a replica so the Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken would be my choice. It's a very high quality smokepole.

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #4 on:** December 18, 2008, 09:36:13 AM »

Missouri River Hawken i believe has either a 1:24 twist or 1:28. This means it will not shoot round balls that great with a hunting load powder charge behind the ball. If you are looking for a round ball shooter, i would easily go with the big .54cal great plains rifle.

Semisane · « **Reply #5 on:** December 18, 2008, 09:50:23 AM »

I'm with bigblock on this one. I love my .54 Great Plains.

Swampman · « **Reply #6 on:** December 18, 2008, 09:54:47 AM »

The Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken. It has the 1:65 twist.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 18, 2008, 11:43:51 AM »

Thanks for your input everyone. As much as I like the Pedersoli quality and authenticity I'm afraid my wallet will not allow me to buy one, unless I sell a kidney. And to add, if I were looking for a .54 I'd go with the Rocky Mountain Hawken.
So now I'm down to: TC Hawken or Lyman GPR

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #8 on:** December 18, 2008, 11:46:51 AM »

great plains.

Swampman · « **Reply #9 on:** December 18, 2008, 11:48:29 AM »

At least the Lyman looks a little bit like a Hawken. I'd get it.

buckskin billy · « **Reply #10 on:** December 18, 2008, 01:27:28 PM »

both are real fine guns. i own a t/c and a friend of mine has a lyman. if i had to do it over again i'd go with the lyman. not that there is nothing wrong with the t/c as its a fine gun. i'm a purist and a t/c looks too "modern" for me.

a side note, at one time you could get the lyman in either round ball barrel twist or conical barrel twist

WiSportsman · « **Reply #11 on:** December 18, 2008, 01:38:13 PM »

I own the TC Hawken, Mine is very accurate and I only shoot patched round balls out of it(stock barrel). Even out at 150 yards, 50 cal is plenty.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 18, 2008, 05:12:51 PM »

I saw an ad for a CVA "St Louis Hawken", anyone know if these are good or not?
Is CVA American or is it Spanish like the Traditions Hawken guns.

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #13 on:** December 18, 2008, 05:16:20 PM »

spanish, And that model is excellent with powerbelts,conicals and especially with patched round balls. They are not a fussy rifle at all. Very reliable too.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 18, 2008, 05:21:42 PM »

I heard some "bad" rumours about spanish barrels, like proof testing or lack of?

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #15 on:** December 18, 2008, 05:51:17 PM »

LOL, those rumors do not include the cva sidelocks. That was only on the 1995 and 1996 inlines. The sidelocks were not involved with this issue.

Bigeasy · « **Reply #16 on:** December 18, 2008, 06:01:05 PM »

Huntsman

I have owned and used both. I like the Lyman. Feels better in your hands, looks more authentic. How about the Deerstalker? I have one in .54, 1/48 twist. It shoots ball and conical accurately, and handles great. With a rear peep sight, its a deadly woods gun using the Great Plains bullet.

Larry

kb · « **Reply #17 on:** December 18, 2008, 11:16:22 PM »

If you want to put different caliber barrels on it in the future, then go with the TC ( more after-market accessories) . If you just want to leave it alone and shoot it, then GPR.

My GPR has taken many deer, a hog, and plenty of targets. It is closer to the original hawken's than the TC's, plus the sights are dove tail grooves rather than screws as on the TC's (easier to swap if you want to) .

I have both and prefer the GPR in .54 caliber percussion and flint.

kb

Swampman · « **Reply #18 on:** December 18, 2008, 11:35:36 PM »

Quote from: Huntsman1 on December 18, 2008, 05:21:42 PM

I heard some "bad" rumours about spanish barrels, like proof testing or lack of?

I would avoid the CVAs.

Ladobe · « **Reply #19 on:** December 19, 2008, 02:14:51 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on December 18, 2008, 11:35:36 PM

Quote from: Huntsman1 on December 18, 2008, 05:21:42 PM
I heard some "bad" rumours about spanish barrels, like proof testing or lack of?

I would avoid the CVAs.

Opinons vary. The CVA Mountain Rifles are some of the best shooters ever made for the entry level market... doesn't matter if an early one like my 45 with Douglas barrel, or the later ones with Spanish barrels. They are eagerly sought by those in the know. Same held true for the early CVA Squirrels - I had a 32 I recently sold and still have a 36 - excellent shooters even with Spanish barrels. And my CVA imported Siber 45 pistol doesn't win many of the matches because it's not also an excellent shooter. True, most of my ML's have been TC's going back to 1970/71, but I've had many early CVA's as well that served me as well and as reliably.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #20 on:** December 19, 2008, 04:28:59 AM »

I must say, that I do agree with all your comments on the GPR. It just so happens that there is a small blackpowder store about an hour from here in the next province that I'm going to check out today, I spoke with the lady and she said they even have kits. So what more of a feeling of pride to build your own muzzleloader and to actually harvest an animal with one you built with your own hands. The CVA St Louis looks too shiny (as well as the TC) and I much prefer the more traditional look of the Lyman. The Pedersoli has the same looks as the Lyman but money is in a pinch right now being this close to Christmas.
On hand I have two Lee moulds, 1 RB and 1 Improved Minie, both .50cal. So I just need another gun to shoot them with

"Larry", I did look at the Deerstalker and that would definately be one to consider after I purchase a GPR, Thanks

*on a side note, I also saw a used Safari Arms Hawken style .50cal as well*

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #21 on:** December 19, 2008, 08:32:19 AM »

Go on gunbroker.com and look up a CVA Mountain rifle. These puppies are excellent shooters! I am building a .58cal mountain rifle right now.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #22 on:** December 19, 2008, 06:14:50 PM »

So, I drove out to the muzzleloader shop (about an hour drive in -28 celsius weather) this morning. And found it to be in the basement of a very nice farmhouse. I was kindly greeted at the door and instantly felt welcome

. It's a husband/wife buisness called Hillfolk Musket Supplies. Unfortunatley they sold thier last Lyman GPR kit

but assured me that they'd have more in the new year

But I did buy a replacement ram rod for my Pedersoli and some "pillow ticking". She (Becky) then invited me to stay for lunch where I met her husband (Doug) and we had some good discussions on hunting and different makes and models of Hawken style ml's and that really made my final decision for the GPR...except caliber

I don't know if I want .50 or .54

I plan on using this on moose & elk as well as deer and even some hog's. Is'nt the .50 adequate?

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #23 on:** December 19, 2008, 06:50:42 PM »

when it comes to shooting round ball, always go with the biggest caliber offered. I wouldnt feel comfortable with a .50cal PRB for moose.

I can assure you that the .54cal ball will easily take elk out to 150 yards.

AtlLaw · « **Reply #24 on:** December 20, 2008, 03:44:21 AM »

Quote from: bigblock455 on December 19, 2008, 06:50:42 PM

when it comes to shooting round ball, always go with the biggest caliber offered.

+1 !!

nw_hunter · « **Reply #25 on:** December 23, 2008, 04:17:48 AM »

[quote author=Huntsman1 link=topic=159387.msg1098705550#msg1098705550 d I don't know if I want .50 or .54

I plan on using this on moose & elk as well as deer and even some hog's. Is'nt the .50 adequate?
[/quote]

I wouldn't hesitate to use the 50 0n any big game in the lower 48.
I shoot a 425 grain lyman slug that will do a number on deer or elk, and I'm sure would stop a moose if we had any in my neck of the woods.

My neighbor has taken several Elk with his T/C 50 cal, but he uses those dang plastic things we don't talk about on here.

Huntsman1 · « **Reply #26 on:** December 23, 2008, 05:08:36 AM »

I think if I were to use my ml for moose/elk I'd either get real close and put a round ball in thru his vitals or try a conical. The GPR has a slow twist best for rb & patch..but I heard that the Lee R.E.A.L. boolit works just fine?

Sir Charles deMoutonBlack · « **Reply #27 on:** December 24, 2008, 05:19:10 PM »

I owned a GPR flinter for awhile. Just long enough to learn that I'd rather have someone else struggle with that d****d lock!

I now have a Pedersoli Mortimer in .54 & 12gauge. It has never failed to fire if I loaded it with care.

Those darned Pedersolis never provide any alibi's!

JPShelton · « **Reply #28 on:** December 25, 2008, 09:30:50 PM »

Well, I'm all for "American Made," but I am also into quality coupled with the styling and features I want. T/C offers the quality, but not the aesthetics or features that I want in a traditional caplock rifle.

Pedersoili, with the Rocky Mountain Rifle, offers exactly what I want in my next muzzleloading rifle, and that is what I am saving for. I can't afford to buy one today, but I'll be able to get one sometime next year, I expect. I'd rather have "gratification" than "instant" and I can justify the expense because I know that the bulk of the money that I've spent over the years on my shooting hobby has gone in to consumables like caps, nipples, powder, patches, balls, and "Bore Butter" and not into hardware.

I've had a Great Plains Rifle for about 22 years now. I spend about $400.00 a year on shooting it -more if you factor in transportation costs to and from a shooting or hunting area, license and tag fees, and such-like.

Shortly after I purchased the GPR, I set my sights on a percussion shotgun and determined to buy a Pedersoil 12 gauge. At the time, CVA still marketed a double-barrel percussion gun of Spanish make that sold for considerably less than the Perdersoli did. Had I have settled for the Spanish gun, I surely would have enjoyed shooting it. But there would always be this element of "coulda woulda shoulda" there to taint my joy. By holding out until I could afford to get what I REALLY wanted, there is no regret attached to the purchase. As with my GPR, I easily spend well over $400.00 a year on stuff needed to shoot the Pedersoli percussion gun. Amortized over time, the cost of the hardware is negligible. I only had to buy it once, too, and I expect it to last me for the whole of my life.

I like my GPR but it ain't in the same league as the Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Rifle, IMHO. And yeah, I do think it is $500-$700 dollars nicer than a GPR and that is why I am willing to wait until I can afford it to get one. Having a GPR does make that wait easier...........

As for caliber, none of the elk that I've killed seemed to fret over getting killed with a .50 instead of a .54. I just get within 100 yards and double-lung them, but three elk with three shots does not an expert make, and if I were to get into the habit of elk hunting seriously,I've probably rather that the .54 than the .50, myself.

If the Pedersoli is what you really want, then that is what you should be saving for.

-JP

Buckskins & Black Powder · « **Reply #29 on:** December 27, 2008, 09:01:28 AM »

Im building a CVA Mountain Rifle .58cal right now. I bought a brand new barrel and then found the rest of my parts on either ebay or other forum classifieds. After i top it off with new sights i will have about $280 total invested into the rifle. Not to shabby for such a big'N!!!

You may consider going this way. I also have a .54cal mountain rifle thats my baby.