35WHELEN bit the dust

[FW Conch]

Thanks Tim ! with your suggestions I now feel very comfortable trying the fire forming in the lands ! 

So Frank ? Used huh ?  I I I  dooknow, that poles beginning to sound like a "tomato stake" !    Jim

[LONGTOM]

Not so fast!!!
I don't dump on things without knowing all the facts.
I don't give up that easy!
It was shooting to good to trade it off before giving it another try with a new scope.



LONGTOM

[FW Conch]

 I heard that buddy, just "bustin" on ya a bit !  I don't understand what's causing this FTF on the 35's but

it seems it could only be bad ammo , way hard primers, or too much headspace. When you get time to

check it out , please fill us in.      Jim

[LONGTOM]

This is what FOGGY had to say on the matter.

the rem ammo and the handi chamber are not a match. the extractor will hold the round in the b/a (remington uses a ring extractor) a mauser would use the claw. see where I'm going? the handi ejector or extractor will not hold the round. . when the round is struck by the firing pin it moves forward. so fire some don't. it's all in the shoulder . there are at least 5 chambers for whelens. rem and Handis have the same chambering. But the ammo is B/a oriented the stuff that fired will reload and work fine
Bob

Make sense to me.

I am going to reload the once fired brass with neck sizing only.
Foggy said that would cure my problem.
I'm going to switch primer brands also.
The ones that did fire and the FTF ones all have the same amount of dimple from the firing pin.
Makes me think the primers are either bad or to hard.
My 35 doesn't make a very hard hit.


LONGTOM

[AtlLaw]

I guess no one just ever misses!

No no Frank!  You misunderstand!  This is a common problem due to the inability to convey emotion in written communication; smileys notwithstanding!  I'm sure what they meant was that it was inconceivable to them that YOU would miss a shot and therefore they just assumed the rifle/scope/ammo was at fault!  The post(s) were actually a testimony to your shooting ability!

[FW Conch]

how bowt that - silver tongue & he rides a motorcycle ! 

[AtlLaw]

Hey Frank, I just had another idea.  How about I send you a few of the handloads I worked up for my M700 using the 180 gr. bullet?  I think I've still got your address.  They turn right at 2800 fps outa my 24 inch barrel and are unbelieveably accurate while being quite a bit under max.  I'm pretty sure I used Federal Primers in these.  I ran out and no one had them so I got CCI's.  I have a K of Rem 9 1/2 's and have had several misfires from them!  Good pin strike, no fire...

[casterbuster]

No a shot at the vitals is not irresponsible, but trying to make a head shot on any animal at the distances you are talking about is irresponsible unless there head is the size of the vitals of deer.  Yes, the running shot was irresponsible as well but I figured you knew that already.  I am not saying that I am perfect when i was younger I took a few headshots myself.  It was the time that I just blowed the bottom jaw off of the doe I was shooting when I decided it wasn't a good idea anymore.  Luckily she came back out a few days later in very bad shape and I put her out of misery.  I was just as invincible then as you are now, but I learned from my mistakes I thought that I could share what I have learned from my experience.  The fact is your shooting at something the size of a potatoe vs. a watermelon it's more likely to go bad when you are shooting at that tater.

[Fred M]

I've never measured it, but I think Fred has said he loads several thousandths into the lands, and it may depend on the bullet too.
Tim

Yes I load all bullets into the lands 10-15Thou.
All my bullets are Moly coated. Loading into the land increases the pressure by 7200psi. So a slight reduction of powder is required. I adjust my loads according to "Quick Load".

Loading into the lands lines up the bullet with the bore and improves concentricity. All BR shooters load the 6ppc into the lands. The Handi should not be loaded to max regardless of caliber.

[LONGTOM]

AtlLaw that would be nice.
Do you still have the load data for them so I could do my own if they work out?
I will pm you my address.
Thanks!


casterbuster
Just two things.
First-you didn't answer the part about coyotejoe.
Second-if a gun will put three shots inside of 3/4" at 100 consistently, as mine will, than why would you not expect it to put one shot inside of 4" at 80?
Assuming an 8" vital most would not think long about a 200 or even a 250yd shot and would be supprised if it didn't hit there with a gun that would print even 1.5" groups at 100.


I am not trying to change anyone minds.
There are those who believe in vital shots, those who take neck shots, and those who take a few head shots.
I have taken far more vitals shots and had to track several.
I make one bad shot which may be due to a scope failure.
Out side of this one deer I have never had not one take a step from a head shot.
Think of me as you wish.
If anyone can say they have never made a bad shot, wherever that may be than they are very very good or have not shot at much game!
Forget the possible scope failure.

Have you ever been varmint hunting?
If so have you ever taken a long shot over 200yds?
If so, did you expect to hit that varmint?
About the same size.

I expect to hit every animal I shoot at, including the one that was running, and I can tell you I don't miss many!
I hunt at least 3 to 4 times a week year round.
I have been doing so for over 40 years and can not even think of the number of animals I have taken.
I can't recall the number I have missed either but I can just about tell you the number I have made bad shots on and those have been 2 deer counting this one and the rest have been groundhogs and a few rats.

In closing I will say one last thing.
If you have never made a bad shot, congrats to you.
Just remember that if it does ever happen think back on your own words-

you may have made that same shot one thousand times before, but how about that one time that it didn't work out.  Food for thought

I am done with this one!!!


LONGTOM

[casterbuster]

First
I did answer about coyotejoe

 "trying to make a head shot on any animal at the distances you are talking about is irresponsible unless there head is the size of the vitals of deer"

As for the second
You know your weapon and your own abilities I don't, as I said earlier I have done the same thing before, until I injured one doing so.  I am just saying that you are taking more of a risk of injuring the animal with a head shot, be it the scope, new ammo, or shooter error.  There is a better chance of a muffed shot when you are shooting at a smaller target.  But, as you said "I am not trying to change anyone's mind" just broaden your view of the situation. 

Good luck to you hope there are no hard feelings, none here anyway.

Casterbuster

[Sourdough]

A shot that is irresponsible for one person, may be a perfectly responsible and reasonable shot for someone else.  Depends on equipment, and ability.

1.  How often do you shot at that range.  Do you know the range (rangefinder or measured yardage) or are you guessing?
2.  What is the size of your grouping at that range.  Are ALL shots in the kill zone, brain for a head shot, spine for a neck shot, vitals for a heart lung shot.
3.  Do you hit the target every time, no misses.  That means every shot in the kill zone, consistently at those ranges.

In the end only you know if you are irresponsible or not.