Author Topic: Help, dry fired on fired brass and action won't open (Read 1314 times)

clearwater · « **on:** January 09, 2009, 09:20:48 AM »

Already fired brass in gun when I pulled the trigger. Action will only open a fraction, say the width of a knife blade.

I assume I will need to dis-assemble the action some. Can someone point me to the link for instructions? Did a search
but haven't found exactly my problem.

trotterlg · « **Reply #1 on:** January 09, 2009, 09:32:19 AM »

My first guess is that the fireing pin is stuck in the primer keeping it from opening. Look to see if the fireing pin is retracted, it can be seen in front of the hammer, if it is not sticking out the back about 1/8 inch then it is stuck. I would try frieing it a couple more times and see if it can be shaken loose. Larry

clearwater · « **Reply #2 on:** January 09, 2009, 09:47:37 AM »

Well, your were right. After a couple more dry fires the button for the firing pin has returned to its
place infront of the transfer bar. However the brass itself still seems to be hanging up in the action.

Any more ideas.

jdwolf · « **Reply #3 on:** January 09, 2009, 10:07:45 AM »

Push the stuck case out with a cleaning rod.

shaner · « **Reply #4 on:** January 09, 2009, 10:09:40 AM »

use a rod or take the forearm off and lift the barrel off the reciever,then pop it out of the chamber?

cwlongshot · « **Reply #5 on:** January 09, 2009, 10:44:56 AM »

Then go to the FAQ's Tim linked a thread on how to make home made dry fire SAFE shell!!

CW

clearwater · « **Reply #6 on:** January 09, 2009, 01:59:34 PM »

Quote from: jdwolf on January 09, 2009, 10:07:45 AM

Push the stuck case out with a cleaning rod.

I need to get the action open first.
Is there something that would pull the brass farther into the chamber with a cleaning rod?

clearwater · « **Reply #7 on:** January 09, 2009, 02:08:18 PM »

Quote from: cwlongshot on January 09, 2009, 10:44:56 AM

Then go to the FAQ's Tim linked a thread on how to make home made dry fire SAFE shell!!

CW

Maybe this will be funny when I get it fixed. Right now I don't need a smart @ss.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** January 09, 2009, 02:12:44 PM »

Make sure the action is closed and locked up, use a knife tip or screwdriver to see if you can force the firing pin towards the rear, you need to release the tension on the firing pin as much as you can, with the barrel released the firing pin is jammed and the spring can't pull it back into the standing breech. If it's scoped you may have to remove it to get at the firing pin which is just ahead of the transfer bar, you'll see it after you cock the hammer. If that doesn't work, download Perklo's trigger info so you know how to remove the firing pin.

Tim

Spanky · « **Reply #9 on:** January 09, 2009, 02:40:48 PM »

Quote from: clearwater on January 09, 2009, 02:08:18 PM

Quote from: cwlongshot on January 09, 2009, 10:44:56 AM
Then go to the FAQ's Tim linked a thread on how to make home made dry fire SAFE shell!!

CW

Maybe this will be funny when I get it fixed. Right now I don't need a smart @ss.

That ain't no way to make friends or get any help around here.
CW is one of the good guys.

Spanky

clearwater · « **Reply #10 on:** January 09, 2009, 02:52:03 PM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on January 09, 2009, 02:12:44 PM

Make sure the action is closed and locked up, use a knife tip or screwdriver to see if you can force the firing pin towards the rear, you need to release the tension on the firing pin as much as you can, with the barrel released the firing pin is jammed and the spring can't pull it back into the standing breech. If it's scoped you may have to remove it to get at the firing pin which is just ahead of the transfer bar, you'll see it after you cock the hammer. If that doesn't work, download Perklo's trigger info so you know how to remove the firing pin.

Tim

I think you are on to it. I can see the round button behind the transfer bar and I can move it in and out but I think
maybe not out enough. The spring seems to be working some. I do think maybe the firing pin was damaged
just a bit and is sticking out in the brass just a bit. I don't seem to have a tool to pull out on the
firing pin button.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #11 on:** January 09, 2009, 02:59:18 PM »

Get it out as far as you can, then hit the release and use a little force to get the action open, if the firing pin is damaged already, you don't have to be too concerned about it, you can order a new one from Brownell's.

The fining pin is angle down, the action opening may help force it the rest of the way out if you have it so it's not stuck so much in the primer.

Tim

cwlongshot · « **Reply #12 on:** January 09, 2009, 05:05:38 PM »

Quote from: clearwater on January 09, 2009, 09:47:37 AM

Well, your were right. After a couple more dry fires the button for the firing pin has returned to its
place in-front of the transfer bar. However the brass itself still seems to be hanging up in the action.

Any more ideas.

Quote from: CW

Then go to the FAQ's Tim linked a thread on how to make home made dry fire SAFE shell!!
CW

Quote from: clearwater

Maybe this will be funny when I get it fixed. Right now I don't need a smart @ss.

Quote from: Spanky

That ain't no way to make friends or get any help around here.
CW is one of the good guys.
Spanky

Thank you Spanky.
Your correct, I wasn't intending to be smart arse...

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,100346.0.html 12th post down.

I hope you figure the stuck brass problem out..

CW

Fred M · « **Reply #13 on:** January 09, 2009, 05:34:12 PM »

I would drift out the firing pin retaining pin to start with. Grab a hold of the firing pin and pry it out and back with a needle nose plyer as far as it will come and turn it 180 deg. If it is bent the barrel will slide over it better with an inverse bent?

Hold down the barrel release and give the barrel a good whack with a piece of 2x4 or a rubber hammer. Make sure the firing pin
is as far back as it will go. If you must dry fire stick some rags in the hammer slot so the hammer wont hit the tranfer bar.

shaner · « **Reply #14 on:** January 10, 2009, 02:14:08 AM »

Quote from: clearwater on January 09, 2009, 09:47:37 AM

Well, your were right. After a couple more dry fires the button for the firing pin has returned to its
place infront of the transfer bar. However the brass itself still seems to be hanging up in the action.

Any more ideas.

so is the pin still holding it? i still think if yu loosen yur forarm, and that will give yu a little room to wiggle it around on the frame?

JerryKo · « **Reply #15 on:** January 10, 2009, 02:33:52 AM »

CWLONGSHOT,

I have been thinking of something like that, but that idea is great. I'll start that project next trip to hardware. Thanks!

Jerry

CLEARWATER,
Sounds to me firing "pin" has broken. If you are saying it returned to position at transfer bar a piece may still be lodged in primer and protruding into firing pin hole still. I had similar problem with empty chamber, action wouldn't open past a point. If you can't open it with some force as Fred mentioned, I think taking the trigger assem out will help. It is tricky the first time putting it back together. Make use of a "slave" pin to hold the trigger inplace. Read the facts its in there with trigger jobs. Mind you I wouldn't use too much force popping open the action. It could damage the firing pin hole. Cosemetically anyway. Good luck hope you get it figured out. I had to take mine to a smith. It was before I new a little something here.

Jerry

clearwater · « **Reply #16 on:** January 10, 2009, 07:18:55 AM »

Quote from: Spanky on January 09, 2009, 02:40:48 PM

Quote from: clearwater on January 09, 2009, 02:08:18 PM
Quote from: cwlongshot on January 09, 2009, 10:44:56 AM
Then go to the FAQ's Tim linked a thread on how to make home made dry fire SAFE shell!!

CW

Maybe this will be funny when I get it fixed. Right now I don't need a smart @ss.

That ain't no way to make friends or get any help around here.
CW is one of the good guys.

Spanky

sorry, written word is sometimes had to determine motive.

clearwater · « **Reply #17 on:** January 10, 2009, 07:35:10 AM »

Quote from: Fred M on January 09, 2009, 05:34:12 PM

I would drift out the firing pin retaining pin to start with. Grab a hold of the firing pin and pry it out and back with a needle nose plyer as far as it will come and turn it 180 deg. If it is bent the barrel will slide over it better with an inverse bent?

Hold down the barrel release and give the barrel a good whack with a piece of 2x4 or a rubber hammer. Make sure the firing pin
is as far back as it will go. If you must dry fire stick some rags in the hammer slot so the hammer wont hit the tranfer bar.

The retaining pin, does it come out right to left with the knurled end (left side) coming out?

jenkst · « **Reply #18 on:** January 10, 2009, 08:04:00 AM »

Clearwater; You won't find better advice anywhere than here. They know the Handi like the back of there hand. Just one more thing. Are you near Piedmont?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #19 on:** January 10, 2009, 08:32:36 AM »

Complete R&R of the trigger group can be found in Perklo's trigger hone download link in the FAQs and Help sticky, yes, all of the pins are removed by knocking them out to the left. I think the lifter & striker(transfer bar) will need to be removed to remove the firing pin.

Tim

JerryKo · « **Reply #20 on:** January 10, 2009, 08:53:13 AM »

Quote

I think the lifter & striker(transfer bar) will need to be removed to remove the firing pin.

Ya forgot about that. I remember now, I took it apart from the top down the first time. Pulled the pin that held the firing pin. But then relized I needed to take the rest out to get everything out and put back. Like I said took me 3 or 4 hours to get it back together the first time. Slave pin would have saved at least 2.5 hours.

While the smith had mine, I wanted to learn to do it myself.

Foggy memory, but now I remember it wasn't the firing pin but the spring that broke in mine. It would open only if you held the gun muzzle up and the pin would fall back into the receiver. Jeez. What am I going to do when I get as old as yous guys.

I'm done here. Hope you get it worked out alright. These guys ARE good!

Jerry

quickdtoo · « **Reply #21 on:** January 10, 2009, 08:54:46 AM »

clearwater · « **Reply #22 on:** March 16, 2009, 02:34:17 PM »

Well, I thought up how to get the action open this morning. Worked first time. I took a 25 caliber Lee
case length trimmer gauge and slid it down the barrel so the pin would fit through the flash hole.

Then I tapped it gently with a cleaning rod.

It popped right open.

It appears the pin is either broken or a spring is broken as the pin will stay forward.

Now I have to decide if I want to try to fix the pin.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #23 on:** March 16, 2009, 02:54:30 PM »

You can order the firing pin and spring from Brownell's, download Perklo's trigger info from the link in the FAQs, you can do a trigger job on it while you're at it!

Tim

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/schematics/schemmfg.aspx?schemid=676&m=6&mn=H&model=SB2+Handi-Rifle%2fH%26R+Ultra+

Chas. · « **Reply #24 on:** March 16, 2009, 03:20:58 PM »

Quote from: clearwater on March 16, 2009, 02:34:17 PM

Well, I thought up how to get the action open this morning. Worked first time. I took a 25 caliber Lee
case length trimmer gauge and slid it down the barrel so the pin would fit through the flash hole.

Then I tapped it gently with a cleaning rod.

It popped right open.

Wow! That's good. And you did it all without one of those heart cath fiber optic gadgets?

44 Man · « **Reply #25 on:** March 17, 2009, 02:23:00 AM »

On my old 30-30, the firing pin was bent when I bought the gun and would stick forward because it would bind in the firing pin hole. I took it apart and since I had nothing to lose, I straightened it. It has worked fine and I have had no more trouble.
I was very intimidated at takeing it apart but it was just fine. Used an old piece of plastic rod as a slave pin. You need something to keep things aligned as you start the pins back in place. Not a big deal.
44 Man

JerryKo · « **Reply #26 on:** March 17, 2009, 05:04:36 AM »

Ok I lied, I'm back only because you said the pin will stay forward. Thats what mine did and it was the firing pin spring. I'd order both if your going to order. I'd also include a new hammer and trigger, might as well try a trigger job, and if you mess up put the new ones in. Good luck!

Jerry

Ps: You can do it. Don't take it to a smithy without first trying. I wished I would have. Mine came back marked up from his punches, and he refused a trigger job stating it was too much time to keep taking the trigger assembly in and out ,...he needs to read the FAQS! I should download and send to him.

LOL

epanzella · « **Reply #27 on:** March 17, 2009, 06:43:27 AM »

Quote from: clearwater on January 09, 2009, 09:47:37 AM

Well, your were right. After a couple more dry fires the button for the firing pin has returned to its
place infront of the transfer bar. However the brass itself still seems to be hanging up in the action.

Any more ideas.

The firing pin dragged some of the primer surface metal into the firing pin hole. If you're sure the firing pin is retracted just reef harder on the action to shear off the protruding metal. If you're not sure about the firing pin being retracted, put a patch jag on a cleaning rod (one with the point in front to grab the patch) and push it down the bore till you can work it into the fash hole. This will push the pin back some more.