Author Topic: 11-Year-Old Boy Charged In Murder Of Pregnant Woman. UPDATED (Read 1588 times)

DalesCarpentry · « **on:** February 21, 2009, 07:08:04 AM »

This is a real shame. This story is still unfolding so we don't know why a 11 year old boy would shoot and kill this pregnant woman. She was only 2 weeks away from having the baby. I think the person that owns the gun that shot her should also be charged. That boy should not have had access to that gun. Here is the full story.

Dale

http://www.wpxi.com/news/18760897/detail.html

buffermop · « **Reply #1 on:** February 21, 2009, 07:32:12 AM »

How and why was a gun available to the 11 yr old? I think justice has a big surprise for the father!!!

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #2 on:** February 21, 2009, 08:07:05 AM »

Quote from: buffermop on February 21, 2009, 07:32:12 AM

How and why was a gun available to the 11 yr old? I think justice has a big surprise for the father!!!

I agree 100% with you. I think the owner of that gun should be charged as well. Dale

Beers · « **Reply #3 on:** February 21, 2009, 12:21:54 PM »

Quote from: DALESCARPENTRY on February 21, 2009, 08:07:05 AM

Quote from: buffermop on February 21, 2009, 07:32:12 AM
How and why was a gun available to the 11 yr old? I think justice has a big surprise for the father!!!
I agree 100% with you. I think the owner of that gun should be charged as well. Dale

You do? So if you're at a job site and someone grabs your hammer and beats someone's brains in with it, you'd be fine with facing charges? I mean, why not, right? You were clearly negligent in leaving such a deadly weapon laying around....

I keep most of my guns locked up, but there are loaded weapons in more than one room of my house, all handily accessible - My right, granted by the Constitution. If some idiot manages to get to one of them and does something bad with it, you think I should be held criminally liable?

Are you sure you didn't vote democrat?

GameHauler · « **Reply #4 on:** February 21, 2009, 12:37:33 PM »

Quote from: Beers on February 21, 2009, 12:21:54 PM

Quote from: DALESCARPENTRY on February 21, 2009, 08:07:05 AM
Quote from: buffermop on February 21, 2009, 07:32:12 AM
How and why was a gun available to the 11 yr old? I think justice has a big surprise for the father!!!
I agree 100% with you. I think the owner of that gun should be charged as well. Dale

You do? So if you're at a job site and someone grabs your hammer and beats someone's brains in with it, you'd be fine with facing charges? I mean, why not, right? You were clearly negligent in leaving such a deadly weapon laying around....

I keep most of my guns locked up, but there are loaded weapons in more than one room of my house, all handily accessible - My right, granted by the Constitution. If some idiot manages to get to one of them and does something bad with it, you think I should be held criminally liable?

Are you sure you didn't vote democrat?

Thank you for getting this headed in the right direction.
I can not believe people on this site would feel that the owner
should be accountable for the actions of another.
Guns do not kill people, People kill people.
As stated in the above post.
Most of my guns are locked up and unloaded.
But I do have guns at reach if someone would like to walk
into my home and have their way with my property
or the welfare of my family.
Mike

Graybeard · « **Reply #5 on:** February 21, 2009, 12:46:00 PM »

Dale do you EVER put your brain in gear before you go off typing dumb stuff like that? Once again it's right out of the playbook of the antigunners. If you keep up parroting the anti line you're gonna convince us that's what you really are here in disguise.

Biohazard Monk · « **Reply #6 on:** February 21, 2009, 12:56:44 PM »

Couldn't have said it better myself GB!

GameHauler · « **Reply #7 on:** February 21, 2009, 01:03:47 PM »

Quote from: Graybeard on February 21, 2009, 12:46:00 PM

Dale do you EVER put your brain in gear before you go off typing dumb stuff like that? Once again it's right out of the playbook of the antigunners. If you keep up parroting the anti line you're gonna convince us that's what you really are here in disguise.

;)Thank You GB

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #8 on:** February 21, 2009, 01:27:45 PM »

I am pro gun for sure but you really think the owner of that gun has no responsibilty at all that a kid got his gun and killed a woman and child. Give me a break. Do you keep your guns out of reach from your children? If not you are not a responsible person then are you now. Dale

Graybeard · « **Reply #9 on:** February 21, 2009, 01:33:50 PM »

Dale you have absolute no clue how the kid got the gun. You really just don't get it and even tho you might THINK you are not one of them every damn thing you post these days makes me think you are moving to the dark side and joining the antis. I don't think you even realize it yet but every post you make shows it. Put your brain in gear. It ain't the gun it's the person pulling the trigger.

If you think you can lock up your guns well enough that no one can ever get one of them period then you are sadly mistaken. Why don't you wait for the facts to become clear before you start passing judgment against gun owners like the antis do. They can do enough damage without your help.

GameHauler · « **Reply #10 on:** February 21, 2009, 01:47:27 PM »

My children have learned how to handle and respect firearms at a young age.
About the time they could have found them and made a mistake.
(That 11 year old I bet never had any teaching).
A unloaded gun and not readily assessable is nothing more than a piece of steel
locked up in a safe.
I want to be SAFE and have guns at my side if needed.

By the way,
I live in a smaller town and we have not locked our doors since
we moved here from Phoenix about 8 years ago.

Do I need a gun next to my bed?
Probably not but you never know.

Education and training are the key to events like this
NOT A LOCK AND KEY

williamlayton · « **Reply #11 on:** February 21, 2009, 02:11:10 PM »

In my home I keep every weapon loaded. Not all are locked up---I can't figger how to lock up a matress.
I have one in my computer room, cocked and locked.
I have another in the house in a cabinet.
I grew up having access to a gun from every house I knew of.
Folks things happen. you can't build a completely safe world. Laws will not bring the woman back. makeing everybody who knew her liable will not bring her back.
people been dying for a long time now.
Blessings

GameHauler · « **Reply #12 on:** February 21, 2009, 02:36:17 PM »

Quote from: williamlayton on February 21, 2009, 02:11:10 PM

In my home I keep every weapon loaded. Not all are locked up---I can't figger how to lock up a matress.
I have one in my computer room, cocked and locked.
I have another in the house in a cabinet.
I grew up having access to a gun from every house I knew of.
Folks things happen. you can't build a completely safe world. Laws will not bring the woman back. makeing everybody who knew her liable will not bring her back.
people been dying for a long time now.
Blessings

Oh so true and that is how it should be

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2009, 04:08:44 PM »

I grew up in a house with a gun collector, My Uncle Tom, There was always loaded guns around, I was tought not to touch them without permission. So you know what, I didn't touch them. And the reason wasn't because I was such a good little kid. It was because I was tought disapline that there was a payback for doing wrong. As in getting your butt whopped for one thing most peolpe today do not punish they'er kids and things like this happen. Spare the rod and spoil the child is not just a saying in some book.

I was beat as a child and I am a much better person for it.

powderman · « **Reply #14 on:** February 21, 2009, 04:20:22 PM »

A 2 bit punk named michael carneal shot and killed several hs students and wounded several others as they were in a prayer circle at school, here in Ky. The worthless POS broke into a neighbors garage and into a locked gunsafe to steal the gun used in the murders. The gun owner did everything right. A punk is a punk, period. Now he wants out of jail, DENIED. POWDERMAN.

billy_56081 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 21, 2009, 04:23:09 PM »

No one locked up the guns in my fathers house, we were taught what they do and what they are while young. We respected them. I never have locked up my guns in my house, I keep a handgun loaded next to the bed. I had an old girlfriend who questioned the saftey of this with my kids in the house. She questioned the keeping of it loaded, I informed her that my kids not only know guns are nothing to play with and they both knew how to load it if needed anyway.

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #16 on:** February 21, 2009, 04:23:26 PM »

Quote from: Badnews Bob on February 21, 2009, 04:08:44 PM

I grew up in a house with a gun collector, My Uncle Tom, There was always loaded guns around, I was tought not to touch them without permission. So you know what, I didn't touch them. And the reason wasn't because I was such a good little kid. It was because I was tought disapline that there was a payback for doing wrong. As in getting your butt whopped for one thing most peolpe today do not punish they'er kids and things like this happen. Spare the rod and spoil the child is not just a saying in some book.

I was beat as a child and I am a much better person for it.

Trust me when I say I was also beat as a child. I just think if you got guns around the house with kids it is your responsabilty( boy I miss spell check ) to make sure these kids do not have access to your guns. Now if you got them locked up and they still find a way to use your gun in a crime then I don't think the parents should be charged. I am only talking about the people that are not responsible with their firearms. If it turns out the this kids father had his firearms secured and this kid went searching for a way to gain access to use the gun involved the I think the parents did the right thing and should not be charged. Dale

45-70.gov · « **Reply #17 on:** February 21, 2009, 04:25:47 PM »

i keep my gun in my pocket.....the rest are locked up

11 year olds break into houses and cars

at 13 i kept my ithaca double and ammo in my room and hunted at will

why was the victim not aware and alert or doors locked?
who was attending the other young kids??
too many un answered questions?
but to first blame the gun owner is democrat talk.....can you post a voter card for us??

does this boy have a history....should he have already been locked away?

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #18 on:** February 21, 2009, 05:10:42 PM »

Thats my point Dale the responsability is not locking them up, your kids should know not to mess with them, Teaching them that is the right way Not locking them up. Thinking that a person is responsable becasuse thet didn't lock something up is wrong and I believe it is that kind of thinking that is ruining this country.

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #19 on:** February 21, 2009, 05:21:59 PM »

Quote from: Badnews Bob on February 21, 2009, 05:10:42 PM

Thats my point Dale the responsability is not locking them up, your kids should know not to mess with them, Teaching them that is the right way Not locking them up. Thinking that a person is responsable becasuse thet didn't lock something up is wrong and I believe it is that kind of thinking that is ruining this country.

I have a loaded gun in my bedroom. My daughter will be 13 in a couple weeks. She knows better than to ever touch my gun but if for some reason she went crazy in her head and took my gun and killed someone with it. I would expect to be charged along with her. Yea I do know for sure my daughter knows better and I have no reason to believe she is not right in her head so I feel ok knowing I have a loaded gun in the house but like I said I would expect to be charged also. Dale

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #20 on:** February 21, 2009, 05:42:19 PM »

But you should not be, that is the dems teaching that has you believeing that. I am guessing you are younger than me and where tuaght deffrently than I was in school, They are teaching our kids wrong that is how they are getting they'er agenda thru It is a long term plan and GBs right they are out to stop the middle class, If people where allowed to disapline their kids like when I was young alot of thi bull would not be happing. Open your eyes read some history it all there in black and white.

BTW a good christian should know this anyway the good book tells of this comeing and explains it all pretty well.

Graybeard · « **Reply #21 on:** February 21, 2009, 05:54:36 PM »

Like I've said Dale you have bought the old dumocrap socialist agenda hook line and sinker. They are reeling you in so fast you have not even figured out yet you are hooked. What the hell ever happened to personal responsibility? We're each responsible for what we do not for what someone else does. To believe otherwise means you've swallowed the bait and are now being reeled in. Wake up and smell the roses.

beerbelly · « **Reply #22 on:** February 22, 2009, 03:01:52 AM »

When I was a kid we all had guns. By the time we were nine or ten years old we were hunting on our own. No so called adult supervision. But at that time kids were not killing other kids or anyone else.
But kids back them were not doped up by the schools and parents for some make believe hyper condition, that I don't believe is real. Hell all kids are hyper. Put their butts to work doing chores and burn that energy . Quit doping them up and I think they just might return to normal kids.
They now have about as many kids or reddlin and other such drugs as are not on it. Beerbelly

bigjeepman · « **Reply #23 on:** February 22, 2009, 03:37:53 AM »

Quote from: DALESCARPENTRY on February 21, 2009, 04:23:26 PM

Quote from: Badnews Bob on February 21, 2009, 04:08:44 PM
I grew up in a house with a gun collector, My Uncle Tom, There was always loaded guns around, I was tought not to touch them without permission. So you know what, I didn't touch them. And the reason wasn't because I was such a good little kid. It was because I was tought disapline that there was a payback for doing wrong. As in getting your butt whopped for one thing most peolpe today do not punish they'er kids and things like this happen. Spare the rod and spoil the child is not just a saying in some book.

I was beat as a child and I am a much better person for it.
Trust me when I say I was also beat as a child. Dale

Apparently not enough ...

bjm

30-30man · « **Reply #24 on:** February 22, 2009, 03:39:49 AM »

I've taught middle school before and I can tell you there are evil children even at 11 years-old. When are people going to understand even at 11 years-old, some kids are capable of evil by themselves. They should not be held blameless. We don't need to blame others or things that can't or didn't do the act on their own. I can't blame the gun for killing the woman as I can't blame my keyboard for misspelled words. We need to hold our children accountable. I blame nobody but the child and his parents for lack of parenting. I grew up with a gun under every bed but never wanted to kill anybody. The kid should serve two life terms. Yes, I believe an 11 year-old should rot in jail for crimes like these. If people had strict consequences for these types of actions, they wouldn't do them. Instead, our children are taught not to respect any authority from the school to the police. Then when things like this happen, they want to blame others or a gun. That's why are young people are so screwed up. They are not held accountable for anything.

Beers · « **Reply #25 on:** February 22, 2009, 11:40:18 AM »

Quote from: beerbelly on February 22, 2009, 03:01:52 AM

But kids back them were not doped up by the schools and parents for some make believe hyper condition, that I don't believe is real. Hell all kids are hyper. Put their butts to work doing chores and burn that energy . Quit doping them up and I think they just might return to normal kids.
They now have about as many kids or reddlin and other such drugs as are not on it. Beerbelly.

Amen.

I always thought there was something wrong with a kid that could sit still for 45 minutes at a time.

mirage1988 · « **Reply #26 on:** February 22, 2009, 01:51:35 PM »

What about the parents that use video games as babysitters? These kids are so conditioned to violence they don't know the difference between reality and a game.

DalesCarpentry · « **Reply #27 on:** February 22, 2009, 05:35:16 PM »

We are now learning more about this story. Here it is. Dale

WAMPUM, Pa. (Feb. 22) - Fifth-grader Jordan Brown boarded the bus and headed to school like he did most other mornings in this rural western Pennsylvania community.
But before he left home on Friday, authorities say, the 11-year-old boy had shot his father's pregnant fiancee in the back of the head as she lay in bed. He then put his youth model 20-gauge shotgun back in his room before going out to catch his bus, police say.
Brown was charged Saturday as an adult in the death of 26-year-old Kenzie Marie Houk, who was eight months pregnant, Lawrence County District Attorney John Bongivengo said. Houk's fetus died within minutes due to a lack of oxygen, Lawrence County Coroner Russell Noga said.
Houk's family and friends, who gathered at her parents' house Saturday night, told The Associated Press that there had been past problems with the boy.
"He actually told my son that he wanted to do that to her," said Houk's brother-in-law, Jason Kraner. "There was an issue with jealousy."
Pennsylvania State Police found Houk's body in the rented farmhouse after her 4-year-old daughter told tree cutters on the property she thought her mother was dead, Bongivengo said.
The boy told police there was a black truck on the property that morning — possibly the man who feeds the cows — sending investigators to follow a false lead for about five hours, Bongivengo said. Inconsistencies in Brown's description of the truck led police to re-interview Houk's 7-year-old daughter, who implicated the boy in the killing, Bongivengo said. State troopers went to get the boy at school.
"She didn't actually eyewitness the shooting. She saw him with what she believed to be a shotgun and heard a loud bang," Bongivengo said. The gun was found in a "location we believe to be in the defendant's bedroom."
Brown was arraigned and was being held in the Lawrence County Jail, with a preliminary hearing scheduled for Thursday.
"An 11-year-old kid — what would give him the motive to shoot someone?" said Houk's father, Jack Houk. "Maybe he was just jealous of my daughter and the baby and thought he would be overpowered."
http://news.aol.com/article/pregnant-woman-killed/353423?icid=200100397x1218973403x1201314349

DDelle338 · « **Reply #28 on:** February 23, 2009, 01:54:15 AM »

Here in lies the problem!!
"Houk's family and friends, who gathered at her parents' house Saturday night, told The Associated Press that there had been past problems with the boy.
"He actually told my son that he wanted to do that to her," said Houk's brother-in-law, Jason Kraner. "There was an issue with jealousy."
When these people new this Kid had problems, what did they do?

Spanky · « **Reply #29 on:** February 23, 2009, 02:21:20 AM »

Quote from: DDelle338 on February 23, 2009, 01:54:15 AM

Here in lies the problem!!
"Houk's family and friends, who gathered at her parents' house Saturday night, told The Associated Press that there had been past problems with the boy.
"He actually told my son that he wanted to do that to her," said Houk's brother-in-law, Jason Kraner. "There was an issue with jealousy."
When these people new this Kid had problems, what did they do?

Sounds like this kid needed a foot in the ass long before this happened.
If I would have talked like that when I was a kid... I'd still be pullin' my dad's boot out

Spanky