.357 stainless 10 inch- self ream to .357 max?

[tallpaul]

 Or another pro?

I just sent out the P.O M.O this mornin and have been wanting one for a while now. I am pretty sold on the max round and wanted to know of self reaming will be accurate enough or will it pay to get the rechamber done by a "pro" . I would have liked a 14 inch but this is 10 inch and should be fine from what I have seen and read. I could not pass up the deal on the barrel.

I have read the statements of correct rechambering etc but am not sure how much different it is than reaming the .357 mag chamber to the additional length? I am guessing that even a self reaming of the mag to max will be theoretically more accurate that the factory max barrel? Is that a safe assumtion?

besides if I get the reamer I can do a handi rifle I already have too for the same money?

I really do want the best for a Contender deer cartridge for Ohio which is a straight walled case state. My close friend has been using a max for several years on deer and hog and its a lazer hammer...

[Grumulkin]

I'm not sure why you assume that self reaming will be more accurate than a factory max barrel.  I've gotten great results with a variety of factory barrels.

All it would take is a simple reaming job to go from 357 Mag. to 357 Max.  If you're a proficient machinist, you should be able to handle the job; just don't try to sell me your barrel since I look with jaundiced eye at any barrel that has been modified by any other than an accomplished gunsmith.  Your modification would, of course, void T/C's lifetime warranty.

[tallpaul]

The reamer for the max does not chang any dimension other than the depth- it should in theory help correct a throating issue some claim to lead to bad accuraccy- or at least accuracy not up to what the cartridge can do. I did not assume it would be more accurate but I have heard such statements made. You may or may not be familiar with the theory- from your response you are not...

also some folks believe custom is better and if you are happy with factory spec that is fine - some of us don't mind experimenting or using info from those who have gone before us.

As far as resale value- guys who understand the max have few issues with it as far as lifetime warranty if ya don't mark the barrel it will be aweful hard to tell and should not be an issue anyhow. I don't sell much of anything gun wise although I should

BTW it really does not take great machining skills to use the max reamer... it will self aline and the depth of the chamber will be extended slightly. Nothing to be afraid of really and any botching should be readily apparent.


BTW since you have neither had a chamber reamed for the max nor done it yourself- what question of mine did you answer? You just knocked the idea in which you have no first hand nor second hand experience with?  Do you even have a max barrell?

if not what exactly was your point?

I mean I did not even offer to sell you the barrel after I was done with it?

[Keith L]

Understand that you will not get to many responses when you bash the ones that do respond.  You just dissed one of the folks that has more experience than most with Contenders and Encores.  While I don't always agree with him, he has lots of experience and is normally willing to share it.  He may not be all that helpful with you in the future.

Also, become familiar with the rules for posting before you post again.  They are in the stickies section of this forum.  We avoid flame wars here, and your post is near the edge.

[tallpaul]

My response was not a flame- just questioning his comments -motives. I asked about experience with the work mentioned and he talks of factory barrels- judges my machining skills and labels the barrel as junk for resale... How is that less of a "flame" than my questioning him on responding the way he did?

I guess the bigger problem I have is the fued between a gunsmith and the owner here and those that would understand the question are reluctant to answer.

I have a few factory contender barrels and most are ok. I want a max and usually miss the used ones for one thing and there is a theory of better acccuracy comming from extending a mag chamber to the max because of the throating dimensions.

I don't see how reaming will be any less accurate so I was asking for experienced responses. I already have the guess and salesmanship points of view.

I feel it to be legitamate...

The response I got was and is from a pro factory barrel kind of guy that does not say yes I tried that and went back to factory barrells with factory chambering...

his response is kinda like me asking about a colt python and a guy coming out and saying his smith 586 is as good or better- apples to oranges.

If its a diss to ask why on earth would ya respond to the question with an answer that does not apply then yes I did diss him... I don't see it...

If he does have all the experience in the world with a contender the info he gave is fine but not what I asked about is it?  I don't consider it a bash and would hope he doesn't- if he did I publically appologise.

[Reed1911]

Let me step in here:

Yes, you can self ream your barrel, however it is not really a job that you just do for the heck of it. You can ruin a good barrel very quickly if you are fully aware of what you are doing. Now, if you understand how chambers are made and how you need to ream the chamber, go for it. MY personal opinion is that any barrel reamed to my specs for my loads will be yards away from anything that is set up to handle any old load out there. Just like handloading for a specific gun will always produce better accuracy than factory fodder made to shoot in all firearms so chambered.

Now, this all brings up the question of value.
Do you have a certain load that you want this barrel to shoot or will you be shooting a wide array of loads?
Are you handloading or shooting factory fodder?
Do you have the know how and equipment to do the job?
Renting or buying the reamer?
Reaming the throat with the chamber or separate?

IF you do not have prior experience reamer a chamber, but you do have the necessary skill to do the work, this is one of those perfect jobs to learn on. There is relatively little problem areas, and since head space is on the rim as long a you don't try to re-cut the rim there is little danger of you having a head space problem and case separation. Also on that note, if this is your first reaming job I HIGHLY suggest buying the reamer. The reason why is that the deposit and rental fee will cost more than an new reamer and you are about 75% sure to damage the rental to where the rental company will reject the returned reamer.

On top of all of this, if you need help, tips and tricks feel free to shoot me a call or e-mail and I will walk you through it. If you just read all of this and though "I have no idea what I am doing" then you should seriously consider having a pro do it. AND if you do, try to find a local smith that will let you watch while it is done, it will make a lot of questions come clear as to why there is so much cost and time involved to have it done right.

[tallpaul]

Thank you Mr. Reed... this is the kind of info I was looking for!

I will be reloading for the max... lead and jacketed likely.

I was going to buy a reamer IF I decided to try it.

I was assuming that the reamer will likely slide in the cut already there for the mag and only need to be deepened for the most part?

I have some experience in metal but am learning. I don't have the time in on the lathe and lill that I would like but have done several smaller jobs and assembled several kits and do some fab work.

As I said I would also extend the chamber on a handi rifle if I buy the reamer for myself.

I did not realize I get to set the headspace... I thought it to be preset...

[Reed1911]

Well, The headspace for the Max is the same as for the mag (and .38 Special) since it is on the rim. But the reamer if ordered in standard configuration will have the rim cutter there as well. If you cut the rim deeper you will have created excess headspace, and while it can be corrected it is not an easy task.

You are correct in that the remer will slide into the existing chamber, but, you will still have to deal with any offset if the current chamber is misalligned with the bore, or if the existing chamber is larger than the spec on the new reamer. You also need to decide on how much freebore you want and what lead angle you want. Most standard cutters for the Max are for revolvers and are not suitable for cutting a SS (SS here = single shot, not stainless steel) chamber. With a revolver cutter you have 0 FB and 0 lead angle, in a SS barrel you will need at least some lead and FB will be determinded by the loads you plan to shoot.

If you are going to shoot both lead and jacketed you honestly would be money ahead to just buy an off the shelf barrel with a standard chamber. When you custom cut one you need to stick to a general load/bullet to make the most of the cut. Lead for a lead bullet is much different than for a jacketed, and for say the 125g jacketed 0FB is great, but for the 180g XTP you'll want quite a bit of FB so you can make the most of the powder space and seat the bullet at the last cannulure. If you have it cut with 0FB you'll have to seat the heavier bullets so deep that you will cancel out a lot of the extra power provided by the max cartridge.

As I said, reaming a chamber is not just a simple little operation of drilling the chamber deeper, it takes a lot of thought before hand to figure out what you want, and then a lot of small checks before you make the first cut.

In the perfect world, what you will want is a chamber centered exactly with the bore center and cut to match exactly the load you will shoot with about +.002" from the mouth forward in all 360 degrees.

[tallpaul]

I knew there was a SS reamer...

If the chamber is already a factory cut I don't believe I will make it "worse" or less concentric. If it was custom I know you could cut it as accurate as ya like if experienced.

I will likely be wanting the heavier 180 and up loads in all reality- I want it for deer n pig. So a deeper throat is not bad...

Thanks!

BTW what do you get to stretch a mag chamber to the max?

[Reed1911]

If the chamber is already a factory cut I don't believe I will make it "worse" or less concentric. If it was custom I know you could cut it as accurate as ya like if experienced

Actually, while at first thought that makes sense it is the exact opposite. Think of it this way. If the rim is the start point and we call the center line of the chamber the base line, a 1/4 degree offset is nothing to a .38 special, a little longer and we start to see a larger difference, and out the the max the difference is great. If you will draw this like a triangle it makes more sense than I can type it. Needless to say, on an angle the further you get from the apex (start point) the greater the distance from the centerline, if the angle is consistant. Make sense?

I cannot tell you how many factory chambers I have seen cut so offset its funny. Not just T/C or NEF, but all makes. In a mass factory setting it is easy to do and most will not ever notice it, but when a custom guy looks at it we just laugh.

[tallpaul]

well then if the factory chambering is off then there is no way to fix it- pro or ameteur would that be correct?

What do you use to chech out the quality of the coencentricity before ya ream? or after for that matter?

[Reed1911]

It just depends on how far off the chamber is, if it is too much then we cannot fix it, if it is just a small amount we ream the chamber concentric to the bore line not the existing chamber. Sometimes there is a question and we'll ream it and then check it, if it is too far off a different caliber will need to be made, usually we go to a .35 Rem or one of the JDJ 35's.

What do you use to chech out the quality of the coencentricity before ya ream? or after for that matter?

To simplify it, You allign a dial indicator to be true to the center line of the bore axis and measure the difference from that datum line to the edge of the chamber walls in eight points, for simpilicity sake call it N, S, E, and W at the base and at the mouth. All of them should have the same measurement at the mouth and at the base and the difference between the two should match the selected chamber print.