Author Topic: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..  (Read 10017 times)

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Offline myronman3

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #90 on: March 13, 2009, 05:49:44 AM »
yes, it is good to be prepared.  but dont kid yourself into thinking you cant be caught offguard.  anything can happen at any time to any one.   if a person actually lives their life, instead of hiding out for fear of what could happen, you are at risk. 
   and yes, cabin, you put yourself in danger as well as anyone.   kid yourself if you must, but dont try to b.s. us.   

Offline Tommyt

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #91 on: March 13, 2009, 06:24:04 AM »
Cooper was out a week earlier with a Guide they talked about the Epirb and other safety things so it not that this guy was a fool as you may try to say now that his life was lost
I'm told is was on a List to do for all we know it may have been bought and not taken out that day maybe wanting it Pro installed maybe it wasn't a carry on one
I truly don't no
I'm just wondering if this trip came up on Short notice
But C4
  I think you no you said the ruff things "in Haste"  and now your being thick-headed(not a good way,word too Use but I'm lost for the right one) and not wanting to retract any part of it
why not admit in a haste you typed a few things that could have been said in a better way

Get Your Point across without being so Harsh

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #92 on: March 13, 2009, 08:21:08 AM »
 kid yourself if you must, but dont try to b.s. us.   

Myronman3,

I'd like to see you point out an example of how I'm BSing everyone.

C4
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Offline myronman3

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #93 on: March 13, 2009, 09:49:22 AM »
look at your avatar.   
     the point is, you take unnecesary risks too.  do i think you shouldnt?  no.  i think a person has to live and if you never did anything that involved risk, you would waste your life. 
   i get your point.   you should be able to get our point.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #94 on: March 13, 2009, 09:57:19 AM »
this is becoming pointless ?
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #95 on: March 13, 2009, 10:05:09 AM »
look at your avatar.   
     the point is, you take unnecesary risks too.  do i think you shouldnt?  no.  i think a person has to live and if you never did anything that involved risk, you would waste your life. 
   i get your point.   you should be able to get our point.

You don't know anything about the risks I take or don't take. Take all the risks you want I really don't care.

I never suggested people should not take risks, I only suggested that being educted on the risks can save your life. You keep ignoring that and make it seem like I'm telling everyone how to live their life.

What's your issue with the avatar now Myronnman3??? Your getting your point across just fine but who's really BSing who? ::) ::)

Avery Hayden Wallace
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Offline myronman3

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #96 on: March 13, 2009, 11:01:32 AM »
uh, yeah, whatever.  these winger's really dont like it when they are challenged, do they?   typical right wing b.s., if they dont have rush there to tell them how to argue, they dont get very far.   ::)   
   i have tried to read your posts, but after all, i am only human and can take only so much.  so yeah, i havent read every little word you have typed, but i get the feel for the meaning of your message.  obama is pure evil, bush has never made any mistakes, and you are always right.  blah, blah, blah.   if you dont get off that high horse you are on, it is likely to bite you one of these days.   
   you kids have fun, i am headed out for an internet free weekend.    :-*

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #97 on: March 13, 2009, 11:42:28 AM »
uh, yeah, whatever.  these winger's really dont like it when they are challenged, do they?   typical right wing b.s., if they dont have rush there to tell them how to argue, they dont get very far.   ::)   
   i have tried to read your posts, but after all, i am only human and can take only so much.  so yeah, i havent read every little word you have typed, but i get the feel for the meaning of your message.  obama is pure evil, bush has never made any mistakes, and you are always right.  blah, blah, blah.   if you dont get off that high horse you are on, it is likely to bite you one of these days.   
   you kids have fun, i am headed out for an internet free weekend.    :-*

Myronnman3, see what I mean....

Why don't you literally, throw the kitchen sink at me now? You got Obama, Rush , Bush, Right Wing goin on in there. After all, it really helps support your earlier points about what I wrote. ::) Who's on the high horse now and still shoveling the BS???

You never did answer my question about your claims that I'm telling everyone how to live their life. I don't care how anyone lives their life. Get on a boat after your loaded tonight and do whatever you want out there for all I care. It only takes some ink to right the headlines tommorow.

It's gotten to rediculous. What's next? I fought with the British during the revolution and I'm responsable for all unexplained infant deaths....
Avery Hayden Wallace
Obama Administration: A corrupt criminal enterprise of bold face liars.
The States formed the Union. The Union did not form the States. States Rights!
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Offline briarpatch

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #98 on: March 13, 2009, 11:44:06 AM »
I live on the east coast of florida and work with and know a lot of people that boat and fish in the big water. Many take trips to the Bahamas often. Those that are knowledgeable and take heed to situations they have been in, have the equipment on their boats to at least give them a chance if something happens while out there and watch the weather like a hawk. They will plan a trip for a week and drop it fast if the weather dont cooperate. I dont doubt but what they learned some of it by doing dumb things and survived but they took their mistakes to heart.  
Others you cant teach. They come in with some hair raising tells about just making it back. Using boats that would be to little for a farm pond, almost running out of gas, trying to ride out a storm miles out to sea. ETC. We have two distint types of people here and if I were going out for a day of fishing or boating I do have a preference as to which group I would rather go with. Not saying there would be no unforseen problems but the odds would have to be better with one group over the other.
Cabin4 posted some equipment to put on boats that would sure help in bad situations and when you go out there you cant be to safe.

Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #99 on: March 13, 2009, 02:36:03 PM »
How many guys on here would have survived the same situation as those men lost their lives in.
Good question huh??

Given the same gear, the same skill level, the same conditions, etc.
Well... Who would make it to shore.

That's right... None of us knows if we would have made it or not.


Cabin4...You've been running your mouth the most about these poor men... maybe next time the wind blows and the surf's up... you can go where they went, how they went and try your luck ;)
The rest of us can stand on the shore and say how stupid you are and how it's your own fault if you don't make it back. ;)
Good Luck with the swim old chum ::)



Spanky








looks  like  25%  or there  abouts could survive  the same  exact  ordeal

seeing  as  25%  did  survive

what  made that man  the surviver??
that  is a good aspect  of this  all   too
when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
free choice and equality  can't co-exist
AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

many statements made here are fiction and are for entertainment purposes only and are in no way to be construed as a description of actual events.
no one is encouraged to do anything dangerous or break any laws.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #100 on: March 16, 2009, 03:28:10 AM »
Not knowing what happened how could % be applied ? for all we know the guy who survived shot the other 3 and fliped the boat to cover the crime .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #101 on: March 16, 2009, 03:54:16 AM »
still    25% survived    that exact set of circumstances

to answer  the question
when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
free choice and equality  can't co-exist
AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

many statements made here are fiction and are for entertainment purposes only and are in no way to be construed as a description of actual events.
no one is encouraged to do anything dangerous or break any laws.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #102 on: March 16, 2009, 04:25:10 AM »
if one of the three  had had a handgun maybe only one would have died and the boat not fliped ?
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #103 on: March 16, 2009, 04:32:24 AM »
i have  seen  poeple panic  and need  shooting  in seious  storms

very  good point
when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
free choice and equality  can't co-exist
AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

many statements made here are fiction and are for entertainment purposes only and are in no way to be construed as a description of actual events.
no one is encouraged to do anything dangerous or break any laws.

Offline ShadowMover

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #104 on: March 16, 2009, 09:23:52 AM »
if one of the three  had had a handgun maybe only one would have died and the boat not fliped ?


What did I miss here?

We go from poor thinking and safety, to trying to solve a boating problem with a handgun? The Captain is in charge of the boat. If you are not ready to trust the captain or skipper's judgment, don't get on the boat. Passing out handguns when it comes time to discuss what plan to implement doesn't make much sense, especially when the one with the least knowledge happens to have the gun. Having a gun on your hip doesn't make you any smarter or level headed, or a better sailor. It does give you a veto on everybody else' plan, right or not.

I own a lot of guns so I'm not on an anti gun rant here. I was helping a friend who had some water in his carburetor as we were climbing a steep hill. We had the carb apart and were just about ready to fix it when a Highway Patrol showed up. He asked what was going on, and we explained that one of the gas tanks had picked up some water, and on the hill the water had gotten into the carb.  He offered to shoot the carb, while patting his revolver handle.  He didn't offer to get his fire extinguisher, stand by, keep oncoming traffic safely alerted, or lend a hand.

"When all you have is a hammer, everything begins to look like a nail."
— Abraham Maslow

Or to paraphrase Clint Eastwood in The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly: (aka Blondie) says “There are two kinds of people in the world, those with loaded guns, and those who swim. You swim”

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #105 on: March 16, 2009, 09:30:04 AM »
we were talking about %'s . we assume it was an accident . what if the surviver killed the other 3 fliped the boat to cover the crime ?
My point no one knows what really happened except the one who lived !
So how could someone point out % of people living in the accident when no one knows fer sure it was an accident in the first place ?
just good old what ifs .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #106 on: March 16, 2009, 10:08:09 AM »
 :) :) :)

Too much!
LOL
Avery Hayden Wallace
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Offline Oldshooter

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #107 on: March 16, 2009, 10:56:01 AM »
Quote
"When all you have is a hammer, everything begins to look like a nail."
— Abraham Maslow


Now that is profound neighbor!  ;)

Will have to remember that!
“Owning a handgun doesn’t make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.”

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

Offline Tommyt

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #108 on: March 16, 2009, 11:36:44 AM »
Just a few min's ago the News said the one survivor told them there where Punch's thrown
I'll be back with the Rest of the story

Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #109 on: March 16, 2009, 05:38:46 PM »
we were talking about %'s . we assume it was an accident . what if the surviver killed the other 3 fliped the boat to cover the crime ?
My point no one knows what really happened except the one who lived !
So how could someone point out % of people living in the accident when no one knows fer sure it was an accident in the first place ?
just good old what ifs .



what  actually  happened and  how  it happened is  irrelevent

the facts  are  25% of the people on the boat survived
assuming  the had no prostitutes or stow aways on board

one  in  four  is  25%
what ever  else  is irrelivent
=================================

i got caught in the wost hail storm around daytona  delivering a water taxi farther  north
i  was  the only one  armed......the rest were yankee liberal scum  cousins  of mine from  massof2shits
all   liscenced  captains
we  were slipping  on  the hail covered  deck
lightening strikeing  all  aroud
all  were in a panic
50 foot visability....allmost hit  a power tower,,,anchor wouldn't  hold

and  every  one was  made at  me for laughing  at  them panicing
i  called them the KEYSTONE CAPTAINS after  the keystone cops  silent movies

i  love a nasty storm



when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
free choice and equality  can't co-exist
AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

many statements made here are fiction and are for entertainment purposes only and are in no way to be construed as a description of actual events.
no one is encouraged to do anything dangerous or break any laws.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #110 on: March 17, 2009, 01:48:36 AM »
if the same people were involved maybe so . if other people were involved maybe so - maybe not . things wouldn't be the same with different people .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Tommyt

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #111 on: March 17, 2009, 03:59:47 AM »
Here are the SAD Facts they Fought among-est them selfs(the doctors say it most likely was Hypothermia that caused this)
AND FOR THOSE that Criticized them the Boat flipped as they Tried to free a HUNG anchor
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-missingboaters-nfl&prov=ap&type=lgns
NFL players lost at sea may have shed life vests
TAMPA, Fla. (AP)—Two NFL players might have taken off their life vests after their hopes of being rescued at sea faded as they clung to their capsized boat, according to Coast Guard records on the eventual rescue of a sole survivor.

Nick Schuyler told the Coast Guard that one by one, the other three men aboard the small boat in the Gulf of Mexico took off their life vests and eventually disappeared during the ordeal that began the evening of Feb. 28. The Coast Guard’s account came in a 23-page report provided to The Associated Press Monday under a Freedom of Information Act request.

The report, which redacts the men’s names, says the group went roughly 70 miles—or 62 nautical miles—to fish for amberjack. Besides the 24-year-old Schuyler, also aboard the 21-foot Everglades boat were Oakland Raiders linebacker Marquis Cooper, free-agent NFL defensive lineman Corey Smith, who played for the Detroit Lions last season, and former University of South Florida player William Bleakley. The bodies of Cooper, Smith and Bleakley have not been recovered.

Around 5:30 p.m., the report said the group ran into trouble: Their anchor was stuck. Schuyler told investigators that he believed it was caught in a coral reef and they tried to free it, but water filled the boat and it capsized
Tossed into the frigid water, the men managed to grab their life vests. Schuyler, also a former South Florida player, said they held on to the boat for four hours. But as the night wore on, their will to survive appears to have weakened and the effects of hypothermia were likely setting in.

Schuyler told the Coast Guard that one of the men “freaked out” and took off his life vest and disappeared that night.

Another started getting unruly, throwing punches and later took off his life jacket, dove under the water and was never seen again. The third man thought he saw land nearly two days after the boat capsized and decided to swim for it.

That man said his life jacket was too tight and he took it off, Schuyler told the Coast Guard.

Officials have said they found three life jackets: one on Schuyler, another near the boat and a third underneath.

It’s unclear how accurate the account is. Schuyler, who was found clinging to the overturned boat about 35 miles off Clearwater and nearly 48 hours after the accident, was suffering from hypothermia and he has provided different accounts to the men’s relatives. For example, Bleakley’s family said Schuyler told them that their son held on to the boat with his college teammate until he weakened and died. Schuyler has also said that Bleakley helped him survive by talking to him and encouraging him during their last night together.

Marquis Cooper’s father has questioned Schuyler’s account that his son removed his life jacket. Schuyler has not responded to interview requests.

As time passed, their relatives grew worried because the group was expected home around sunset. One of the men’s relatives contacted the Coast Guard around 1:30 a.m. on March 1 and a search began.

Records document the Coast Guard’s repeated attempts—and frustrations—as rescuers tried to find the small white boat in a stormy sea with heavy cloud cover and whitecaps making it tough to spot.

One person who called the Coast Guard reported that one of the men, presumably Cooper, had one week left before he was expected in California for football practice. The caller, whose name was redacted from the report, said the group “could have possibly tried to go farther out to fish
One of the men’s wives was able to find a handheld GPS device that he had left at home and had apparently used in previous trips to record the coordinates of favorite fishing spots. The Coast Guard used that data to refine their search, placing the likely location of the men about 10 nautical miles south of their expected destination.

The Coast Guard contacted the men’s cell phone companies for help tracking their whereabouts, without success. They also sent them text messages, stating that, “the CG is looking for you request you to contact us immediately.”

“Being that these guys are inexperienced, don’t look just at 50 NM offshore, there might be a possibility that they wisened up and stayed close to shore, at least within visual of land,” a Coast Guard officer wrote in one e-mail.

The same e-mail added that, “It might be worth considering getting the story out to media earlier than later = more people on the lookout both on land and water.”

During the search, the Coast Guard reported 14-foot seas offshore and wind gusts up to 30 mph.

More than 24 hours after starting their search, a sign of hope finally emerged.

The Coast Guard cutter Tornado spotted Schuyler, looking small in the vast ocean and clinging to the boat’s hull.

At Tampa General Hospital, Schuyler’s doctor called it a “miracle” that he survived in the 63-degree Gulf water for nearly two days, and said he probably could have lived only another five to 10 hours.


Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #112 on: March 17, 2009, 05:21:25 AM »
It sounds to me like 3 of them guys lost their minds and will to live, due to hypothermia. I wonder if they pulled so hard on that stuck ancor that they overturned the boat? If so it would have made more sense to cut the rope. Dale
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Offline Tommyt

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #113 on: March 17, 2009, 05:44:15 AM »
Dale that correct CUT the Line
But in when in trouble you try too keep the Anchor its SAFE to have one on Board (but it becomes life threating also, its a Fine Fast Line)
But as I wrote of a friend that had the same thing happen (stuck anchor)  while trying to remove it they Sunk the boat
 With a small Boat ( under ? 50 feet) the anchor is a Life saver and Life Threat (one good One Bad)
a small boat Held down will take waves over the Top or will swing in the Trough if swung and pulled in the wrong Direction the Boat will capsize
I truly feel for them I believe they Tried ? the Hypothermia destroyed them If they could have held each other to warm themselves they would be here today IMHO

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #114 on: March 17, 2009, 05:59:33 AM »
They did not know what they were doing and they were not preparred for a crisis. They paid the price.
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Offline jager

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #115 on: March 17, 2009, 06:59:25 AM »
   I have experienced Hypothermia twice in my life. The first time I did not know what to expect, other than an extreme drop in body temperature. Fortunately I had a partner duck hunting with me that got me out of the water to warmth and safety. The second time I recognized what was happening and took action before the final "euphoric" effects set in. It took hours to get my body temperature back up to normal. I have witnessed in the medical field where trauma patient's were also hypothermic, which shunted the pain and, in some cases, kept them from bleeding out by lowering heart rate.
   If any of the people involved in the accident had Hypothermia, judgment went out the window along with any the requirement to adhere to a checklist or use equipment they had on hand. The ability to perform well under stress with Hypothermia is like being very drunk and asked by a "deputy" to walk a straight line. You might think you are doing well and have all the confidence in the world, but your mind and body are not "one"!
   I'm not trying to make an excuse or justification for what may be poor planning or for disregard of safety considerations (heck, I try to stay out of the water and I have been Navy trained to survive!); but just mentioning a very insidious hazard that needs to be considered whether on water or land.

Offline Tommyt

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #116 on: March 17, 2009, 07:28:22 AM »
They did not know what they were doing and they were not preparred for a crisis. They paid the price.

YOUR Relentless
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I'm done with this POST

Offline Cabin4

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #117 on: March 17, 2009, 07:34:54 AM »
They did not know what they were doing and they were not preparred for a crisis. They paid the price.

YOUR Relentless
I wish you all the Best
I'm done with this POST

You call it relentless. I call it persistant & consistantly on message. But I'm okay with being called relentless.
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Offline mirage1988

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #118 on: March 17, 2009, 12:23:08 PM »
Cabin4-
Let it rest,
 If you had half a life, you would be outside doing something dangerous, not sitting at a computer, beating a dead horse!

Offline gypsyman

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Re: 3 lost at sea off the coast of Florida, 1 survives..
« Reply #119 on: March 17, 2009, 01:42:09 PM »
There were several times on Lake Erie, I was in a similar situation as these men. My heart goes out to their relative's. No matter how prepared, or experienced you might be, sometime's, it's your time. Look at the crew of the Andrea Dorea. Had as much or more experience than anybody.
First time for me, late '70's, walleye fishing was really going strong on Erie. I was still young enough to think I was Superman, and having a few beers while out fishing was the norm. Got caught in real bad storm, tornado's in Southern Mich. and N. Ohio. To this day, I believe that only the grace of God saved us. And I swore right then and there, never drink again until the lines are tied, and then usually not until I was home cleaning fish.
Second time, 8' waves about 10 miles offshore. Took me over 4 hours of about 800-900rpm, quartering waves to get within 2 miles of shore before I could get the boat up to speed and plane out. I distinctly remember my mother asking me when I got back home with my fishing buddies, did you see any other boats out there. I said nope. Well, 2 people in a very small boat,14 or 16 footer, had capsized about 2 miles offshore. A young boy of 12 or 13, and his grandfather. They were found the next day, both dead. Anytime you get around water, ya got to be careful. gypsyman
We keep trying peace, it usually doesn't work!!Remember(12/7/41)(9/11/01) gypsyman