Obama signs Executive order on embryo stem cell research

[Cabin4]

Obama signed an executive order allowing federal funding for stem cell research on embryos. This over turns an executive order order by the Bush administration that prevented federal funding on stem cells from new embryos.

What are your thoughts on federal tax dollars going to support this activity?

[mirage1988]

I have no thoughts on this subject because you are going to flame every opinion that doesn't match yours.

[Graybeard]

They will likely be approving human cloning before long with this ass as prez. It is only gonna get worse.

[mirage1988]

Cabin- You started this thread- why don't you put your opinion out there? or are you just going to wait until there are two pages of opinions out there so you can decide what side of the fence you are going to sit on? Another californicrat askin a rhetorical question without nancy p's permission!

[Cabin4]

Mirage,

Antagonizing me like that will likely get you a response if you do it much more and stoop your language to a much lower level. Untill then I'm going to just have to ignore you.

Cabin4

[mirage1988]

Mirage,

Antagonizing me like that will likely get you a response if you do it much more and stoop your language to a much lower level. Untill then I'm going to just have to ignore you.

Cabin4

SAY WHAT?

[rparsons934]

They will likely be approving human cloning before long with this ass as prez. It is only gonna get worse.

I agree GB. I am ok with stem cell in the fact that we could create organs. but against it in the fact that it will lead to cloning. And i am very much against cloning so i would say no tax dollars should go to this. Put them in more needed places(and try to keep the $ out of poloticians pockets.)

[Cabin4]

NO tax dollars should be used for this research. The government should have no role to play in this aspect.

It is a dangerous path that WILL lead to human cloning and genetic alterations for non-medical reasons, no question. If private science enterprise wants to do this with their own $$ and there are women out there willing to give up their own embryos, have at it. But I do believe they need to draw a line on cloning and genetic alteration for non-medical purposes.

[jimster]

It's all about tax money, our money.  All his signing did was open the door to untold millions of our dollars,  and we have universities gearing up here in Michigan as we speak already waiting for our dollars to flow in.  Nothing you can do about it now...same as sending multi millions into other countries so they can have abortions on us.  Our money seems to be the root of everything.  Almost makes me want to not have any money just to shut it all down.  This is nothing compared to what we are in for....much more to come, all using our money and the money they print to make our dollars worth much less.  If there was a way to shut our money off it would sure help.   Now I'm searching for freedoms that are left to give the government a harder time.  We have pulled all our money out of a bank that took fed funds and moving into a bank that would not take anything, and we told them why on the way out.  I sure would like to see millions of people do things like this to send a good message.  Would be neat to see so many people do this that a bank failed anyways, even with fed bailout money, now that would be neat, but I guess it won't happen.  I figure all we can do now is try our hardest to give them a hard time if we can.  Got to keep fighting somehow.  

[jimster]

Hey TM....if the research was worth it's salt...it would already have been funded....and not with our tax dollars. 

On the other hand....if nothing comes of it except more tax dollars spent for nothing....please donate money to us TM....to make up for what you thought was right that didn't work out...fair enough?   Works both ways I reckon. 

[Cabin4]

Yeah,,,just remember do not ever and forever receive, including loved ones, any treatment originating from this kind of research; and do not receive profits from any concern profiting on this research.

That way you will have a clean conscience...

..Tm7

Why? All I said was no tax dollars should be used. I don't need to have a clean conscience about anything. There's a lot of things I don't think the government should be involved in. That does not mean it rules me out as well. I'm not connected to the government.

[jimster]

Agreed Cabin4....private funding....!!   There is such a thing!  If something is worth it's salt. 

[Cabin4]

So in your case there is a caveat;  if you and love ones are receiving medical benefits from stem cell research modalities they must be refused if publicly funded; but are accdeptable if privately funded....!

..TM7
 

So I would agree with this if the government funding was not replacement for private funding that may have been available at the time the research took place.

[highwayman]

i have a question. people have been doing research on stem cells for years,but have they found any real use for them yet or found they cure anything???

[crustaceous]

This is the future of medicine. You can't stop scientific progress and we should be leaders in research. We have time to resolve the ethical issues. 
Look at the bright side. Maybe we could clone a new Ronald Regan 

[billy_56081]

They will likely be approving human cloning before long with this ass as prez. It is only gonna get worse.

I sure hope they don't clone BHO, these baby killing liberal scum will stop at nothing to put off death. Alot of the liberal scum claims that they are much too intelligent to believe in God, I have to wonder, are they really afraid death is the end, or are they afraid of what awaits them on the other side?

[Cabin4]

This is the future of medicine. You can't stop scientific progress and we should be leaders in research. We have time to resolve the ethical issues. 
Look at the bright side. Maybe we could clone a new Ronald Regan 

I would be afraid that might not work. Have you seen Ronald jr? One slip of the test tube and we might get another one of them instead of a the real Ronald. Way to risky.

[45-70.gov]

i  don't really care how many embrios  get  killed  especially ones  that are going to die any way
IF  THEY CAN CURE MY DIABETES

and if they need to clone  me then harvest the organs .... GOOD

but  i   don't  expect  you to pay for it  or  need  your permission

that  is the problem  with freedom  ''WE''  don't  have  to agree
the problem  with liberalism is  ''WE''  will take  your money  and kill babies  with  it
to  make  me some   insulin   [take notice when people speak  1st person plural....usually a liberal]

and  if  it was  a good plan  some one would already be trying to  do  it

this  whole  thing  is just about government expantion

My 2 cents....I have a son who may benefit from this line of research,,,I'm for it with a few caveats. In the future we may see some cures and treatments 'stemming' from this research. If you are ethically opposed to this kind of research...then you are obligated to research any treatments you may be receiving in the future and NOT take them...for ethical reasons, of course.  You also should divest from any companies researching or involved with these industries immediately.

...TM7

you  seem  to be under  the assumtion  that  if  government  doesn't do it
it  just  can't or  won't get done

i  think  the labs  are now  set up  to  get government  funding
not  to  find  cures

i  think  that  if  i felt  as strong  about abortion  as  some of  you do  here
that   i would  not be able  to pay taxes  and  fund  the murder  of the unborn
just  how strong  is your beleif  that  it  is murder  and your funding  it

[jimster]

All morality aside....government is not the answer, nor can they be trusted with any money at all.  The main point to all this is, it's all about money, our money, and we all know billions of our dollars get funneled off a a hundered different directions, there has never been any guarentee that money gets where it's supposed to, it never does, government has wrecked way more things they they fixed with our money....how in the world could anyone have an attitude that "public funding enables the sharing and passing around of notable discoveries"...this is laughable....we KNOW BETTER.  We just had a guy sign into law more spending of our tax money than ever before in history...there will have to be more buildings built just for government employees to work in offices passing it around and "funneling it" places...!!!!    It's all about money, OUR money and everyone knows it.   My God, it's as plain as the nose on our faces that they were already rolling in so much tax money we actually had congressman saying, "what's a few million here and there, let's pass this bill"....does not that tell you something?  We have the speaker of the house riding around on military jets for fun, where does she think that money comes from...and during hard times to boot.  I'm just saying that any bill they pass that takes tax payer money is a scam, most of it won't ever get to the right places anyway.  We know these things as facts.  They have a bail out bill for the car companies that some of us knew would not last two months...they did it anyway, even knowing it could not possibly do anything...CAUSE NOBODY WAS GOING TO BUY CARS for at least two months.  It's like burning it.  When these these happen what's the next thing they do...probably hire a bunch of people to watch it go down a hole next time and make reports on it. (we'll form a task force next time, to watch it go away!)   With our tax money. 

Our tax money going anywhere right now going to congress is like giving someone 100 bucks a day for a crack habbit...you'll run out of money before they OD.  The only way to cut the stupid spending is to stop giving them money.  The won't ever tell us..."OK...we are where we want to be...here is most all your money back".........I don't think that will happen!  We need to stop them. 

Anyone who goes along with this spending is either really ignorant (could also be well read enough to be DANGEROUS)....or is a true progressive socialist....either way,  I don't have anything in common with those people.

[billy_56081]

I bet Dr. Mengele, would have suppoorted stem cell research.

[Cabin4]

The USA's medical and pharmaceutical industry have been nearly the only beacon for cures and treatments in the world. And this has happened without socialized medicine. Those countries that have employed socialized medicine, wait for the US to develop the drugs and treatments then they take them from us.

So to equate socialized medicine as a cure to improve medicine & treatments, is ridiculous and foolish. This is one of the tactics of the socialists. Let us take care of it and it will get better. Nothing has so far. Their solutions are worse than the problems.

[jimster]

 "You need to research how the grants and aid system works, especially thru various land grant and other university research programs."

OK..I did..

The Federal grants-in-aid system has developed because of the importance, in a country as large as ours, of dealing decisively with national problems in a way that preserves and encourages innovative participation by State and local governments. In theory, the system is the basis of a balanced national partnership, an example of federalism at its best.  Unfortunately,  it has grown increasingly irrational, inefficient, and insensitive to the various local needs and idiosyncrasies it was originally designed to accommodate.


2. Waste
Any grant scheme requires administrative overheads to assess applications. In addition, applicants may spend a large amount of time preparing applications. Even in an efficiently run operation, the cost associated with running the scheme and preparing applications can be a significant proportion of the money awarded in grants, especially if the grants are small and the success rate is low. In addition, not all grant schemes are run efficiently, aggravating the problem of waste.

Government Grant Scams

Prof Gets $100,000 Grant to Study World of Warcraft

“Millions of dollars worth of aid money is being wasted”

Wasted money, wasted lives

Stop wasting tax dollars

Millions in earmark money going to preserve Kennedy legacy  (Whoops...how did that come up in a search?)



OK...I need help researching here....as you can see from above...having a hard time finding all the cool reasons to strip us all of most of our hard earned money....but I'm sure you could help me search....OK....I'm going to go tune into MSNBC now to try and be more open minded...hope I have better luck there.  They might be able to convince me that giving thousands of dollars of my money to my government is in my very best interest, and that my government is really my only hope...I must feed the beast...or I will perish.   

[Cabin4]

The scientist say they eventually doctors will be able to fix spinal injuries with stem cells. Maybe thats why liberals are pushing so hard to get this funded with tax dollars. They think science in on the verge of a break through and their doctor can put a spine in their back soon.

[Heather]

I am of the opinion that the government should play NO role in this at all.  I believe that if private industry wants to research this then they have EVERY right to do so.  I don't think the government should have a say in what private industry researches and has no obligation to federally fund ANY research.  Of coarse I also think that the government funds A LOT that it shouldn't and has a say so in a WHOLE LOT more than it should.  I think that if the government kept its hands out of healthcare and medicine in general that medical technology would be advanced to the point that we would no longer need research in many areas.  Just my opinion though!

Heather

[zombiewolf]

The USA's medical and pharmaceutical industry have been nearly the only beacon for cures and treatments in the world. And this has happened without socialized medicine. Those countries that have employed socialized medicine, wait for the US to develop the drugs and treatments then they take them from us.

So to equate socialized medicine as a cure to improve medicine & treatments, is ridiculous and foolish. This is one of the tactics of the socialists. Let us take care of it and it will get better. Nothing has so far. Their solutions are worse than the problems.

 Oh, Really...   

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3284995.stm

Cuba's struggling economy has been boosted by the successful export of its medical technology abroad, and by health tourism within the country.

Cuba's position in the developing world has always been something of a paradox.

A US delegation explores Havana to look for tourist destinations
Not all tourists to Cuba want sun and sand
Its low material living standards and crisis-ridden economy leads to a low per capita income, but President Fidel Castro's Caribbean blend of socialism has developed a public health system that places Cuba in another league altogether on human development indexes.

Basic health indicators are comparable to the achievements of welfare systems in western Europe.

Education, science and health, the cornerstone of the 1959 revolution, are closely linked together in Cuba's development of an advanced medical sector.

The export of pharmaceutical products, vaccines and biotechnology helps to pay for the growing costs of funding medical research and a free health system with comprehensive coverage.




Vaccines

In the 1980s millions of dollars were invested by the Cuban government in developing modern vaccines laboratories and a massive centre for biotechnology.


Cuba has invested millions in developing vaccines
Since the end of Soviet aid in 1989, and the acute economic crisis of the 1990s, Cuba has seen the excellence of its medico-scientific institutions as a strategic resource for developing new medical products for export.

The country's first breakthrough in medical research was its discovery and patenting of meningitis-B vaccine in late 1980s.

It has been successfully exported to cope with epidemics in South American countries including Brazil and Argentina.

The vaccine has now been licensed to GlaxoSmithKline who will now market it in Europe and it is hoped eventually in the USA.

The Cuban vaccine is widely regarded as the more effective than Belgian and US-produced vaccines.

Cuba's cutting-edge products for neck and breast cancer have caused the biggest stir in the world of biotechnology.

They have just been licensed to a German pharmaceutical company, with rights to develop the drug TheraCIM h-R3 for the European market.

Also, the unique Cuban treatment for retinitis pigmentosa, often known as night blindness, has attracted many patients from Europe and North America,

Health tourism generates revenues of around $40m a year. Cuba maybe judged poor by material living standards, but its medical sector is a strong demonstration of its wealth in human resources.


ZW

[Dixie Dude]

NASA is the ONLY Federal agency that paid for itself 100 fold in the 1960's.  For every dollar NASA spent to get to the moon, it yeilded $100 in new products alone.  Lighter materials, more efficient use of materials, smaller microchips for electronic equipment, synthetic materials, even licra used in girdles was paid for with NASA development dollars.  This led to synthetic clothing, eventually to personal computers and calculators, smaller TV cameras, new medical technology for monitoring patients, robotics, ect.  Research money if used with a worthy goal in mind can pay big dividends in the future.  NASA is now researching ways to make fuel out of Martian atmosphere and soil, like natural gas (methane) for rocket engines.  They would use Martian ice, get the hydrogen out, use Martian carbon dioxide atmosphere to for carbon to make the gas.  They would get oxygen out of the soil (sand is oxygen and silicone).  Idea is they wouldn't have to transport fuel all the way to Mars and back when people finally get there.  A colony could thus be self sufficient.  Mars has a 24 hour day, but takes 2 years to orbit the sun.  The moon as far as we know, has no water, therefore would be harder to colonise.  However the moon is loaded with platinum, aluminum, silicone, and oxygen.  Hydrogen would have to be imported to the moon to make water and/or fuel.

The Navy along with NASA is close to making a breakthrough in nuclear fusion using hydrogen.  They came close in 2007 before the lead scientist died (old age in is late 70's or early 80's).  They are still working on what he started.  I had a book somewhere that listed all the products developed, can't find it right now. 

Research is good if it has a goal in mind like NASA, but research for research sake is sometimes a waste of money.  Must be goal oriented.

Maybe a part government and part private health care system would work.  Like the government cover preventative medicine like vaccines and such, while insurance covers major medical or specialised care.   

[Cabin4]

TM7,

That’s irrelevant to my issue. Keep the government out of healthcare. There's nothing in the constitution that says the government is here to provide healthcare.

The government does not provide solutions in these social areas they just fornicate all over it, us and politicize it.

In any case, there are several sectors of healthcare. Key high level ones are:

1. Research on treatments
2. Research on drugs
3. Delivery of treatments & cost
4. Delivery/availability of drugs & cost

Items 1 & 2 the USA leads the world. You end up paying for 1&2 in 3&4.  I think your focus is on 3 & 4. I agree these costs are high especially if someone does not have insurance but in principal I believe Uncle Sam should keep out. This is private business and it should not be controlled by the government. They will not fix anything, they will screw it up, they will give free health care to illegal’s at tax payers expense, the list goes on.

C4

[Cabin4]

Now, can you name one organization, one country, one demonstration, one world leader, one riot, one movement, ...out on the street demanding a healthcare system like ours.?

..TM7
.

I don't want to take the time to find that out because it's 100% meaningless to me. I could care less what people in other countries want or don't want. People marching in the streets for the government to provide healthcare are people looking for a free hand out at tax payers exspence. So marching on this subject is easy and self serving.

Your not getting my point TM. I want to keep the government out of it all. They will hose it up for everyone.

[Dixie Dude]

You know, here is what it boils down to.  We can give NASA money and they can go to the moon, Mars, build space stations, etc.  We can build roads, bridges, ships, planes, big buildings, etc.  However, when it comes to human nature, the government can't spend enough money to actually do any good.  Human greed caused the stock market to crash with subsequent stress.  Human laziness causes people to get and stay on welfare or not get enough exercise.  Human unbridled lusts causes sexually transmitted diseases.  Human desire for pleasure causes drunkeness, illegal drug use, smoking, gluttony, etc.  All of these cause about 85% of all disease and hospitalizations.  Now drunk driving causes about 50% of traffic fatalities among other injuries and fatalities also.  Now if people would clean themselves up, MOST of the medical care and expense would be unnecessary.  Stress can cause heart attacks, nervous breakdown, high blood pressure, etc.  Gluttony can cause diabetes, as well as heart problems.  Quarenteen those who have sexually transmitted diseases or any other disease which has no cure.  This would eliminate the spread of these and the disease would die off.  STD's were almost eliminated in the 1950's.  The only one who can actually change peoples natures is Jesus.  Billy Graham did a study back in the 1970's and found out that Christians lived 8 years longer than other people and had 85% fewer diseases.  Christians were counted as those who attended church at least 2 times a week regularly reguardless of denomination.  Divorce causes children to get into about 50% more trouble than parents who work things out and stay together.  Human sin causes all the problems.  Keeping sin in check, no telling what we can accomplish as a nation.  Abortion may have killed the person God sent to cure cancer or other major accomplishments. 

[JonnyC]

I watched my dad die from Parkinson's disease.  I have mixed thoughts. If the embryo is going to be destroyed, then they should be put to a better use than just being discarded.