Author Topic: Corrosive ammo-a bad choice (Read 1993 times)

kix · « **on:** March 15, 2009, 02:40:22 PM »

Hello all you Mil-Surp lovers! About a year ago I obtained a 1943 S.A. M1 Garand with about 200 rounds of Korean corrosive ammo. No problem I thought,just clean the barrel,bolt face and gas cylinder and everything's OK. Wrong! Today I decided to grease important parts (according to the CMP handbook) and was shocked to find rust where I wouldn't have expected. Tomorrow I am going to pull all those Korean FMJ'S and assemble some modern loads with IMR 4064. The moral of this story? Don't shoot anything corrosive! Kix

CannonKrazy · « **Reply #1 on:** March 15, 2009, 03:28:25 PM »

Yep. The corrosive stuff is bad news if you shoot it in a decent gun.I used to shoot a lot of 30-40 krag ammo in an old surplus rifle. If you don't clean it good the rust will eat away in places you can't see.

JustaShooter · « **Reply #2 on:** March 15, 2009, 04:16:49 PM »

I've thought about doing something similar with some corrosive ammo I have, but never came up with a good way to remove and then deal with the primers. I could (carefully!) push them out with a decapping die, but then what do you do with them? You could fire them before decapping, but that defeats the purpose of the exercise since it is the primer compound that is corrosive, right? So, I just end up shooting the ammo and carefully cleaning afterward. Other than the cleaning, it seems like more fun that way...

What were your plans for taking care of the primers, kix?

Just a Shooter

trotterlg · « **Reply #3 on:** March 15, 2009, 04:17:25 PM »

Well, it's not the powder that is corrosive it is the primers, so unless you fire them all and punch them out, (guess if you are going to fire them you may as well just shoot the ammo) then you will still have the same problem. Larry

John Traveler · « **Reply #4 on:** March 15, 2009, 07:09:01 PM »

Plus, don't forget the possibility of afterrust from reloading cases that had fired corrosive primers.

Yes, that happens too. Any firing residue from the corrosive primers remains hygroscopic and attracts moisture from the air to cause rust even YEARS after the ammunition was fired. Complete, thorough, repeated washing in hot water and detergent is the only way to get rid of the residue.

Mikey · « **Reply #5 on:** March 16, 2009, 01:35:03 AM »

Forget the Korean mil-surp. About a year ago or less we basically issued a warning against using Korean mil-surp, whether wartime mil-surp or just surplus. Pressures were erratic and damaging some Garands and Garand owners were advised not to use this stuff.

As for components - maybe, but forget the primers as they are the corrosive element and forget the powder becuase you don't know what it is. You can use the slugs if you want to make/take the effort to pull mil-surp bullets that may well be over-runs from WWII, if ya want to.....but I would try to find a large supply of newer slugs.

If you make the mistake of using corrosive ammo, spray all affected parts with Windex with ammonia, let sit for just a bit to neutralize the corrosive salts (if it is Korean stuff they probably made it with Kimchi) and then patch it with a Windex soaked patch and brush it with a bristle brush. Youwill be surprised as to how much gunk the Windex brings up but after you have gotten all the Windex residue out and off, go back at the parts and bbl with Hoppes #9 and that bore will shine..... HTH.

1911crazy · « **Reply #6 on:** March 16, 2009, 03:20:13 AM »

In shooting corrosive ammo, it depends on the climate were you live too. I left a barrel after shooting corrosive ammo for a year and nothing bad happened to it. I forgot to clean it one night and put it away. But there in a safe in a dry room. I think that dampness and moisture is the key things needed to jump start the corrosive working.
I also lube my guns with moly too. It fights corrosion too besides eliminating all wear and reducing friction. That could be why my rifle didn't corrode too.

One more thing don't put the rifle away in the bag when its hot this can make the corrosive start too. Its like closing your fishing tackle box when its wet inside your actually helping the rust get a head start.

I shoot corrosive ammo all the time but i do clean my rifles with the orginal G.I. Rifle Bore Cleaner, (the orginal stuff that would eat the chrome off a trailer hitch) I just run wet patches thru the bore until they come out clean, then i run dry patches thru the bore until there dry and the bore is clean and dry, then i will oil up the bore with the G.I. Light Weapons oil.

Think about it this is why some rifles needed c'boring because of the carelessness of the owner with the cleaning rod actually wore the rifling and crowns away on the muzzle ends. They were constantly cleaning their rifles because of the corrosive ammo too.

The 30-06 Korean and 308 Indian(first batch so they say) are bad ammo to shoot. I have a 50cal box of the 308 indian that goes "BANG and some go "POP" because of the difference in the powder load its that far off weight wise. I'm going to have to disassemble it and reset the charge in every round before it can be shot. I only shoot the south african 308 ball ammo now(surplus stuff) or the new russian manufactured ammo. I shoot my reloads or only new wolf ammo in my handguns. They also say the newer spainish 9mm largo is too hot for the astra 400 too. We have to beaware and careful with everything, even the new firearms too. I also have some surplus 9mm luger ammo thats very hot because its machine pistol ammo. We have to beaware of all the linked and delinked ammo too its machine gun ammo. Most of the time its hotter ammo.

Me & cbxboy got a deal on the new russian manufactured 30-06 a while back for just $1.99 for a 20rd box on clearance. Heck i think me and him bought it all. I haven't shot any of it yet but maybe he will chime in and say how good it is. We also cleaned house on the 8mm turk ammo too. I have some 1937 dated stuff that all goes bang everytime i shoot it.

Even a few years ago when the wolf ammo was a tad dirty it still shot good and the loads seemed to be equally charged too.

Horsefeathers · « **Reply #7 on:** March 16, 2009, 10:22:01 AM »

All US military ammo before 1953 is corrosive. Its S.O.P. to rinse salts out with water.Military bore cleaner used to have a water content in it. You had to dry and oil. I saw a .50 Cal. MG BBL. ruined when I was in the National Guard. We fired it with WW2 ammo. Alot of tracers included. I scrubbed the bore With bore cleaner and wanted to wash dry and oil it back at the barracks but the Capt. Had it stored away on a truck with who knows what or which truck so we could make a hasty return to the Armory in the AM. When we got back to the armory the goods were dumped in a store room not to be seen for a month or so. When I finally located it It looked like a coal mine inside. Horsefeathers.

kix · « **Reply #8 on:** March 16, 2009, 04:40:32 PM »

Hello all and especially JustaShooter. I simply pulled the bullets and threw everything else away. I tried to re-prime the Korean cases but ran into stiff resistance so I gave up.Maybe I was wrong but I had bought some factory brass at a local gunshow so that my was my decision.I figure my M1 needs the best so before I shoot shoot anything harmful I will let it sit in the safe.Plus I read on another forum that Korean can have different pressures levels. Guess what? When I was pulling the FMJ's from the Korean some of the cases had ball powder and others had extruded. In my simple mind that is a red flag for sure! Take care of your mil-surp,whether it be a 91/30,R.C.K98 or anything else. Kix

Spanky · « **Reply #9 on:** March 17, 2009, 07:53:46 AM »

When I shoot corrosive ammo out of my Nagant's I take the barreled action and bolt and put them in the tub with hot water and dish soap. I soak and scrub the parts just like I would do with a muzzleloader. After the cleaning I re-oil and put it back together. I've never had any rust problems.

Spanky

blackpowderbill · « **Reply #10 on:** March 17, 2009, 11:57:57 AM »

I shoot corossive out any of my guns without fear. I just clean them religiously after shooting. I have never had a problem with it.

cbxboy · « **Reply #11 on:** March 18, 2009, 07:28:51 PM »

1911 Crazy, you got a memory I hope to retain at your age...ummm..45 right???

HAHAHAHA, hell I took my Korean and pulled, bullets and dumped powder into once fired brass and shot em.......I tend to agree they are a little ummmmm, iffy. Not corrosive, but iffy.

ALL my Turk, Greek, Yugo, Equadorian 8mm pulls have been relatively decent. Equadorian 8mm was a bit iffy as a touch of corrosion internal on the 55 dated AA.

Bill, that Russian Barnaul 30.06 145gr we bought out of Kieslers for DIRT cheap 4 or 5 years back WAS a bargain...and I know why....sorry, I will pull it all and drop powder 10% and reload. Damn stuff makes Turk feel tame. Cripes first time I fired it in a Semi Auto the dang rifle groaned so hard I thought I was gonna eat the bolt....NEVER fire in a Garand EVER. BArnaul 30.06 in a garand is like Turk in a Hakim WITH the gas valve wide open!! Even in a bolt gun this stuff is STOUT to say the least. My least favorite round...and you know I am not shy.

So back to topic, my Korean has been "ok" but iffy. I shoot it in Brazilian 08/34 primarily. Nevre pulled th trigger yet unless pulled and reloaded. Somewhere I measured 30 rounds and will average reduced 5% to reload. Some of this surplus has incredible variance. In one round of 8mm I found a large curl of Brass...big ol springy brass. Have no idea what would have happened had I fired it....

S.S. · « **Reply #12 on:** March 19, 2009, 02:29:37 PM »

No problem here with corrosive ammo..
Shot basket loads of it and then simply cleaned and oiled my firearms..
not a big deal.

ECV Slick · « **Reply #13 on:** March 19, 2009, 11:41:38 PM »

I LOVE corrosive ammo - because people that don't clean their guns properly (with hot soapy water) scare folks off from buying it - so then it stays cheap for me!

The truth is that some guns I own have never seen anything BUT corrosive ammo... If corrosive is so bad - then how did all those rifles from WWII survive? I'm guessing they were cleaned properly.

Oh yeah - corrosive ammo "keeps" better than non-corrosive. I have a good stash of cordite-charged .303 British that has yeilded some of the closest "extreme spreads" of any ammo I've ever chronographed. It kind of smites me to have ammo that was loaded in the 1940's post tighter spec than my personal handloads. $:-\$ But then a 7 fps ES is not easy to get for anyone.

kix · « **Reply #14 on:** March 20, 2009, 02:40:00 PM »

Say what you will but my M1 (very close to all-correct grade) will never see anything but modern powder. I do have a '43 Savage Enfield that I will shoot corrosive in (until I run out) but my Garand-no way. Long story short, shoot till your's heart's content but just don't get surprised as I was. Kix

cbxboy · « **Reply #15 on:** March 21, 2009, 05:07:10 AM »

This got a touch off the original topic in my opinion as well. Kix brings up a very valid point in Corrosive ammo shooting. Heck I am as ANAL as anyone in cleaning rifles. POint of hte matter is we are not perfect, NOR do we have a company of soldiers to inspect and repair our crappy rifles.

I purposely avoid corrosive in my FN-49 and SVT-40 as I feel no matter how far I strip down I am scared I will mis somethign somewhere and corrosion will start in an unseen area. So if I am afraid of this.....an avid collector......why is it wrong to be concerned and offer a nice reminder?? Its not, thanks Kix.

that being said if anyone wants to shoot corrosive in a Mauser or Mosin, go nuts, it is so very simple to do a thorough cleaning.....I have thousands (not exageratted) of rounds down pipe with only one "mess up" on my part and the damage was very minor and inconsequential. Heck I got one Moisin that I should LET corrode, it might get BETTER

Tim

Spanky · « **Reply #16 on:** March 21, 2009, 05:22:47 AM »

Quote from: cbxboy on March 21, 2009, 05:07:10 AM

Heck I got one Moisin that I should LET corrode, it might get BETTER
Tim

Ain't that the truth... I've seen some Mosin's with crappy bores that shot great

You can't never tell with these things until you shoot 'em.

Spanky

Steve P · « **Reply #17 on:** March 27, 2009, 05:30:06 AM »

Quote from: Spanky on March 17, 2009, 07:53:46 AM

When I shoot corrosive ammo out of my Nagant's I take the barreled action and bolt and put them in the tub with hot water and dish soap. I soak and scrub the parts just like I would do with a muzzleloader. After the cleaning I re-oil and put it back together. I've never had any rust problems.

Spanky

I second (or third, or forth) Spanky's reply. Only thing I do additional is rinse with HOT water when done, towel dry, and then run my heat gun into the areas where water could collect to make sure everything is dry before oiling. Wipe down the stock good and reassemble. Never had a problem (except with the wife when doing this in the kitchen!)

Steve

kiddekop · « **Reply #18 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:10:55 AM »

Quote from: kix on March 15, 2009, 02:40:22 PM

Hello all you Mil-Surp lovers! About a year ago I obtained a 1943 S.A. M1 Garand with about 200 rounds of Korean corrosive ammo. No problem I thought,just clean the barrel,bolt face and gas cylinder and everything's OK. Wrong! Today I decided to grease important parts (according to the CMP handbook) and was shocked to find rust where I wouldn't have expected. Tomorrow I am going to pull all those Korean FMJ'S and assemble some modern loads with IMR 4064. The moral of this story? Don't shoot anything corrosive! Kix

All of the garands had 'corrosive'ammo fired thru them long before they were sold and none of them were 'rusted' out,I've shot over 600 rounds of denver 1942 & 1943 ammo with primers containing potassium chlorate which is a salt thru my garand w/o any problems but I rec'd training in the military on proper weapons care. There is nothing wrong with 'corrosive primed' ammo that plenty of soap & hot water won't cure "someone needs to read about how to clean a garand "

jlwilliams · « **Reply #19 on:** April 21, 2009, 08:46:42 AM »

Pulling them and re-filling with new powder won't help with the corrosive primers. If you have ammo that you don't want to feed your Garand, feed it to an '03 or maybe a mauser in 30-06.