Author Topic: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.  (Read 528 times)

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Offline WylieKy

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Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« on: March 18, 2009, 05:35:54 AM »
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090318/ap_on_re_eu/eu_austria_fritzl_trial

ST. POELTEN, Austria – In a stunning turn of events, an Austrian on trial for imprisoning his daughter for 24 years and fathering her seven children pleaded guilty Wednesday to all charges against him — including homicide. The move came after his daughter appeared unexpectedly in the courtroom.

Surprising even his lawyer, Josef Fritzl calmly acknowledged his guilt on the third day of a trial that has drawn worldwide media attention for its shocking allegations.

"I declare myself guilty to the charges in the indictment," Fritzl, 73, told a panel of judges, referring to what he called "my sick behavior."

Fritzl had been charged with negligent homicide, enslavement, rape, incest, forced imprisonment and coercion. Initially he had only pleaded guilty to incest and forced imprisonment. The change of plea means he could face up to life in prison for the negligent homicide charge — literally "murder by neglect" in German.

Elisabeth was the prosecution's key witness against Fritzl. Now 42, she was 18 when he imprisoned her in the cramped, windowless cell he built beneath the family's home in the town of Amstetten. He then raped her for years.

Asked by the presiding judge what had led him to change his mind, Fritzl said it was the testimony from Elisabeth — the court had viewed 11 hours of her videotaped statement during closed-door sessions Monday and Tuesday.

Fritzl's lawyer, Rudolf Mayer, said Fritzl had asked to see a psychiatrist after Tuesday's session.

"It must really have shaken him up," he said, referring to Elisabeth's testimony.

However, a person familiar with the trial told The Associated Press that Elisabeth herself was in the courtroom on both days — suggesting her presence alone might have unnerved Fritzl and prompted him to change his pleas.

The person spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the closed-door proceedings.

Other officials would not confirm that Elisabeth was there. Before the trial, prosecutors had said she would not be present and would testify only through her prerecorded remarks.

The homicide charge came for the death of an infant twin boy — Michael — born to Elisabeth in April 1996 who prosecutors say might have survived with proper medical care had he and his mother not been locked in the basement.

Elisabeth and her six surviving children, who range in age from 6 to 20, have spent months recovering from their ordeal in a psychiatric clinic and at a secret location. Prosecutors have described her as a "broken" woman.

Psychiatrist Adelheid Kastner told the court Wednesday that Fritzl had a very serious personality disorder and would pose a threat to others even at his advanced age if freed. She recommended that Fritzl serve out his sentence in a special prison facility for psychologically deranged criminals.

Fritzl expressed regret that he didn't bring the ailing infant out of the dungeon and get medical help.

"I don't know why I didn't help," Fritzl said. "I just overlooked it. I thought the little one would survive."

"I should have recognized that the baby was doing poorly," he added.

Mayer, his lawyer, had previously said Fritzl only saw the newborn once it was already dead.

Wearing a mismatched suit and a blue shirt, Fritzl did not hide his face behind a binder Wednesday as he had done for the last two days when led into the courtroom in St. Poelten, west of Vienna.

After the plea change, the psychiatrist's testimony and brief consideration of reports about the cellar, officials adjourned the trial until Thursday morning.

Legal experts say the jury will still have to deliver a verdict despite Fritzl's guilty pleas, although his confessions are grounds for a lesser sentence. The verdict and sentence for Fritzl are expected Thursday after closing statements from both sides.

Police say DNA tests prove Fritzl is the biological father of all six of Elisabeth's surviving children, three of whom never saw daylight until the crime came to light 11 months ago.

Three of the children grew up underground in Amstetten and the other three were brought upstairs to be raised by Fritzl and his wife, Rosemarie, who apparently believed they had been abandoned.

Prosecutors have alleged that Fritzl refused to speak to his daughter during the first few years of her ordeal, coming downstairs only to rape her. They said the rapes sometimes occurred in front of the children.

Mayer had not been aware of Fritzl's change of heart before Wednesday's session. "He didn't discuss it with me," he said.

Kastner, the psychiatrist who met with Fritzl several times and put together a psychological profile for the court, said the Austrian had a deep need to control people. She said Fritzl had an ability to block out his crimes but knew what he was doing was wrong, acknowledging he had a guilty conscience when he went to bed at night and when he woke up in the morning.

"Fritzl is guilty for what he did," she said, adding he also believed "he was born to rape."

She said the large number of children Fritzl fathered only strengthened the control he had over his victim. "The more children, the more power," Kastner said. "This is about possession ... power ... control."

Fritzl had testified earlier this week that he had a difficult childhood and a bad relationship with his mother.

"The climate in his parent's house was marked by fear," Kastner said.

The Associated Press normally withholds the names of victims of sexual assault. In this case, the withholding of Elisabeth's name by the AP became impractical when her name and her father's were announced publicly by police and details about them became the subject of publicity both in their home country and around the world.

___

Associated Press Writer William J. Kole in Vienna contributed to this report.
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Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2009, 05:56:12 AM »
Yea I remember when he got caught. That is one sick person. That womans children, she is the mother and sister to them. How screwed up is that. Talk about a family tree with no branches. This man will fry in hell. I don't see how anyone could do this anyone. Especially your own daughter. What about this mans wife. They claim she knew nothing about it and she was told by her husband that their daughter had dropped another baby on the door step. I just don't buy it. You mean to tell me that his wife never went down stairs in 20 years. Yea right. She is involved also. Dale
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Offline Skunk

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2009, 05:58:46 AM »
Wylie, don't get me wrong because I'm for the death penalty in certain cases. However, in this example, what makes you think he would get the death penalty for ruining the lives of eight people, his cruelty, his extremely distributing behavior, and his blatant disregard for any laws? I'd sure like to see Duck Killer's or AtlLaw's opinion about this case in terms of the nut being given the death penalty, because given this guy's behavior, I'm thinking that in our court system, this guy (with a good attorney) would have an excellent shot at spending the rest of his life in the nut house rather than getting the gas or the syringe.
Mike

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Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2009, 06:02:11 AM »
Wylie, don't get me wrong because I'm for the death penalty in certain cases. However, in this example, what makes you think he would get the death penalty for ruining the lives of eight people, his cruelty, his extremely distributing behavior, and his blatant disregard for any laws? I'd sure like to see Duck Killer's or AtlLaw's opinion about this case in terms of the nut being given the death penalty, because given this guy's behavior, I'm thinking that in our court system, this guy (with a good attorney) would have an excellent shot at spending the rest of his life in the nut house rather than getting the gas or the syringe.
He alowed one of the babies he fathed to die. Dale
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Offline Oldshooter

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2009, 06:12:44 AM »
I'm not so sure the death penalty is warranted in this case.......................A dark cell where he could be raped for the rest of his life would be justice!

Yea the death penalty would be too easy!
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Offline dukkillr

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2009, 06:18:43 AM »
The man would not face the death penalty in America.  

See:
Kennedy v. Louisiana
http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-343.ZO.html

And Coker v. Georgia
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=433&invol=584

Offline Skunk

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2009, 07:06:48 AM »
Wylie, don't get me wrong because I'm for the death penalty in certain cases. However, in this example, what makes you think he would get the death penalty for ruining the lives of eight people, his cruelty, his extremely distributing behavior, and his blatant disregard for any laws? I'd sure like to see Duck Killer's or AtlLaw's opinion about this case in terms of the nut being given the death penalty, because given this guy's behavior, I'm thinking that in our court system, this guy (with a good attorney) would have an excellent shot at spending the rest of his life in the nut house rather than getting the gas or the syringe.
He alowed one of the babies he fathed to die. Dale

I hear you Dale and believe me, I can't say I have much compassion for the guy. It just seems that this case has "insanity" written all over it. And as much as we don't like it, as long as our judicial system allows the insanity defense, perpetrators like this fellow will use it to the best of their attorney's ability. And try not to blame the attorney for using the insanity defense; he's just using all the legal tools available to him.

The man would not face the death penalty in America.  

See:
Kennedy v. Louisiana
http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-343.ZO.html

And Coker v. Georgia
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=433&invol=584

Thanks for the input Dukkillr. I bookmarked those cases and will try to give them a thorough reading. At first glance they are indeed very horrendous.
Mike

"Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition" - Frank Loesser

Offline CannonKrazy

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2009, 08:56:20 AM »
While there isn't a perfect answer to a problem like this case I think ole fashion justice would serve well as punishment. This man deserves nothing less than being soaked with gas and lite on fire. Let this peice of trash burn. We have to many in prison now that committed crimes as bad or worse than this man. These people will never see the death penalty carried out because of our court system. We keep people locked away for years at tax payers exspence.

Offline hunt-m-up

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2009, 12:45:41 PM »
No he definitely would not be put to death here,of course that doesn't seem right to most of us, but that's our system. The rampant use of the insanity plea is way out of hand IMHO. It falls right in line with the general lack of personal responsibility the growing liberal mentality has fostered in this country.
I'm in favor of a combination of all the punishments that have been previously suggested for this scum.
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Offline BBF

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Re: Why I'm glad the US has the death penalty.
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2009, 09:00:53 AM »
The Austrian got Life.
I used to be 100 % for the death penalty however since a number of cases have been found of wrongful convictions with DNA samples etc. I am not so sure.
There is no way of repaying a man or woman the years spent behind bars when they were inocent and ZERO  so when they were wrongfully executed.
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