Author Topic: Seacoast and Naval Artillery Photo I.D. Contest (Read 1896 times)

seacoastartillery · « **on:** April 04, 2009, 07:23:56 PM »

In our travels around this great country, we have always been amazed at how many of the actual cannon that were served in battle still exist today. Most of the guns for this contest were found in the Northeast, East Coast, Southeast and Gulf Coast areas of the United States.

See if you can figure out what they are, (Seacoast and Naval Parrott Rifle, 32 pdr. Navy Gun of 57 cwt., etc.), and where they are in the photo and answer a few questions asked about them, then post your results. Nobody takes these contests seriously at all. They are JUST FOR FUN. If you can come up with extra information, you will get cudos from Mike and I. Hints will be given as necessary.

All participants will be vying for the title of "Historic Artillery Archival Photo Indentification Specialist Extraordinaire"

We will declare a winner in about two days. The winner does not get a free cannon from us, only praise, admiration and acclaim!!

Good Luck!!

Mike and Tracy

Seacoast and Naval Artillery Photo I.D. Contest

1. This gun played a significant role in the American Civil War. It was saved from a scrap yard and placed on the monument shown in 1871. What type and caliber is it? What war-time role did it play? Where was it when this photo was taken in1894?

2. The only gun of it’s type to be fired in anger during the American Civil War, it’s heavy projectiles passed over Fort Wool on their way to hostile batteries. What is it. What nickname does it have. Where was it mounted during the Civil War and is still mounted today?

3. Yes, just about everyone knows the name of this historic ship, but who among you can tell us which of these dents in this ironclad’s turret armor is the result of “Friendly Fire”? What Federal Navy ship hit the “Ericsson Devil”? (sorry, Dan). What size shell or shot caused that dent?

4. This earth-work fort was a Confederate Battery guarding Charleston’s outer harbor originally. After what date could photographers accompanying Union Army forces take this photo? What Union fort is this and what are those cannon in the background? What very important part of an iron, upper, seacoast, barbette carriage is partially hidden in this photo?

5. That Artillery Officer on the left is new to this outfit, just arrived. He would wipe that smirk off his face as he watches the men labor if he knew that the powder magazine entrance is on the right and that the Officer’s Quarters entrance is on the left!! Seriously though, can you name the artillery here? What nationality is represented here? What war?

6. Naval Artillery from the War Between the States. This photo gives the viewer a rare look at front and rear sights. What is it? Which side used it? What type and caliber of projectile is that? The mosquito fleet used such guns.

7. This big rifle was in a fort near the northern tip of Morris Island in 1863, less than a mile from Fort Sumter. This is the only photo we have ever found which shows the rear sight mounted. With that much elevation on this gun, what other primary target was it probably sighted on? What is this gun? What card game are these artillerymen playing?

8. The large projectiles displayed on the deck give away the location of this ship in this 1865 photo. What is the location, the ship’s name and name 2 of the 5 projectiles shown.

Max Caliber · « **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:14:38 AM »

Number 5 - British artillerymen with 13 inch Sea Service Mortars at the Siege of Sebastopol, Crimean war. Got to go, I'm doing some cannon part casting.

KABAR2 · « **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:21:50 AM »

Yep, you nailed that one knew it was Crimean war had to go looking for it....

http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3g00000/3g09000/3g09300/3g09300v.jpg

Unfortunalty today I'm in the middle of molding plastic for contract work......2100 pcs....... so I can't play

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #3 on:** April 05, 2009, 06:12:34 AM »

Thanks for participating Max. A perfect answer which contains all elements requested in the question. I have always been fascinated with this conflict and some of the first battlefield photos ever taken were produced here. I found an internet photo taken of the Inkerman battlfield several weeks after the 5 November 1854 battle. The ravines and hills were covered with cannonballs for thousands of yards! Wish I had saved that one.

Kabar2, Allen, Be sure to check in later if possible, I think this might be our most challenging contest yet. Is this 5 or 6 now; just can't recall. You and Max are past masters at these games; maybe some new blood will show up and clean up? Hard to predict.

Thank you both!

Mike and Tracy

DoktorD · « **Reply #4 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:41:51 AM »

Okay...

Number 4 is Fort Putnam (Federal) which was Confederate Battery Greg.. This changed September 7th 1863. The rifles in the background are 30 pdr parrotts. I'm stumped on the hidden barbette though (not too familiar with the seacoast gun variety, sorry Mike and Tracy

)

Skunk · « **Reply #5 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:45:00 AM »

Excellent Pictures!!

lance · « **Reply #6 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:58:42 AM »

Mike and Tracy, great pics, wish i had enough time to play.Well i guess i could throw in a few cents.
#2- that big monster's pic was taken at Fort Monroe
#8- Catskill

DoktorD · « **Reply #7 on:** April 05, 2009, 08:15:20 AM »

Number 7 is a 200 pdr Parrott also in Fort Putnam (Formerly Gregg). If its not pointed at Fort Sumter, then the only other target would be Charleston I imagine. I cant say I know the specifics of the card game in progress, but it looks like the visible hand contains 7 cards? Even if its not seven, its enough to rule out the popular 5 card stud... My knowledge of civil war card games is along the same lines of my knowledge of seacoast barbette carriages

.

DoktorD · « **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2009, 08:22:02 AM »

To add to number 8,

I think that picture was taken in Charleston? Its definitely the Catskill... I can tell the far right is a Blakely shell (based on this being in Charleston) and to its left is a Brooke shell? (Possibly the one to the left of that also) The rest I'm not sure of, but you only asked for two

If that is indeed one behind white post then its gotta be pretty big! If I HAD to guess, I would say maybe another form of the Blakely shell? (Given that this picture was taken in Charleston)

DoktorD · « **Reply #9 on:** April 05, 2009, 09:44:19 AM »

Number 3 --

The monitor took friendly fire from the Minnesota who was firing low, skipping shots at the Virginia. As to what caliber the shell was, you got me there... I found this, but thats not tellin me which one fired the shot

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #10 on:** April 05, 2009, 11:00:38 AM »

Thanks Lance and Skunk, we always appreciate the compliments, with what this job pays, the atta boys are all we have to make these contests worthwhile. Lance you are right on both of those; we respect your schedule as always and I know you don't mind helping someone else out a bit. We saw that monster gun as you call it and it looks like a slender teen person could slither right down that bore and do a tap dance on the hemi end of that big bore!

DoktorD, you have a talent for this research game and the old hands better watch out! Nice going on that no. 3; we thought that one would go unanswered until late Monday night. You answered that one beautifully, and all the experienced players will tell you that the caliber of any cannon featured is not really required for score, but it's nice of you to present that info so they know the most likely is an 8 inch shell, smaller than all those 9 inchers she had on board or, of course, the ten inch pivot. You get full credit on #3. You also picked out the correct dent which is very impressive!

You also own #8. Yes it is the Catskill which was heavily pummeled by the shore batteries on more than a few occasions. Yes it is Charleston where the Blakely shell on the right, 475 lbs, and the two Brooke bolts, correct, and the other BIG Blakely "Bolt", 600 lbs, behind that white post, pipe or something is, the biggest bolt, at that time, 1864-1865, ever prepared to fire against Federal Monitors during the Civil War. As for #7, you answered plenty well enough to get full credit for it and although the primary target was Ft. Sumter and the most bombarded secondary was Ft. Moultrie, you are correct that Charleston, itself was within range of this most forward Union position and could be targeted from Putnam. You own #7. As for # 4, excellent, so far, but that last part is too important to give away. Keep looking for a part which belongs to the upper carriage assy.

Thanks fellows. You guys are doing great!

T&M

Terry C. · « **Reply #11 on:** April 05, 2009, 12:02:41 PM »

Quote from: seacoastartillery on April 05, 2009, 11:00:38 AM

Keep looking for a part which belongs to the upper carriage assy.

Left side of the pic. Eccentric axle behind the stack of bolts?

DoktorD · « **Reply #12 on:** April 05, 2009, 12:27:29 PM »

Number 6 --

This particular photo was taken aboard the confederate gunboat Teaser in 1862 after its capture by the Maratanza... Its of a 100 pdr Parrott, so that would put the shell at 6.4". Still working on the specifics of the shell...

Looks very close to the confederate read bolt..

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #13 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:44:58 PM »

Thank you Terry, you are right on the money. Since that whole photo was included to find out how much people know about seacoast artillery carriages, I guess we are going to split credit on that one. You each get half, because DoktorD answered more parts and the part you answered was much harder. For anyone wondering why the eccentric axle was so important, this is why: they allowed two artillerymen to lift the front of the carriage and the entire tube upwards, in this case, with 100 pounder Parrotts at Ft. Putnam on iron carriages, these two artillerymen are lifting approx. 13,000 lbs.. The mechanical advantage that the eccentric axle provides, lets these men get the upper carriage wheels down on the rails so they can get the gun back into battery quickly after reloading. They just had to remember to disengage the eccentric axle or the whole gun and upper would fly off the chassis rails at 30 MPH upon the next discharge!

DocktorD, if you take a careful look at the cascable/breech area of the gunboat gun, you will see that the wrought-iron reinforce is not thick enough for a Parrott 100 pdr. Seacoast and Navy Rifle, M1861. Also a muzzle swell and a chase ring make it originally a Navy gun, the bore size of which you have correctly stated, 6.4" or a 32 pdr. The shell says it's no longer a smoothbore though. What is it? For that shell type think of the state where the Confederate Army lost five general officers killed, five wounded and one captured in one vicious battle. You're doing great, press on.

T&M

DoktorD · « **Reply #14 on:** April 05, 2009, 02:55:47 PM »

Hmmm interesting... I was wondering about that. The caption under that photo every place I found it gave a description of a 100 pdr, but then under ever record of the Teaser it said she only carried 32 pdrs and 12 pdrs... Shoulda known better

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #15 on:** April 05, 2009, 03:17:01 PM »

#1 just feels like Richmond. Perhaps another deep south city?

DoktorD · « **Reply #16 on:** April 05, 2009, 03:22:27 PM »

From your hint, I'm thinking the Battle of Nashville... five generals killed outright, five wounded (plus one who died later), and one captured... So its Tennesse...

My guess: Tennessee Sabot?

6.4 Cal
Used in the rifled and banded 32 pdr smoothbore

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #17 on:** April 05, 2009, 04:31:05 PM »

Thanks for joining in Tim. That's an interesting theory about probably going to the deep south for No. 1, but (this is the part I really hate, where you have to let them down gently, what with them being high powered Moderators an' all) sorry, think about going North a few hundred miles. Remember that place where General George Washington attacked (with Field Artillery) and blasted the snot out of those pesky Germans as they fell out of their barracks to form up in the street. Damn cold morning it was too. This battle was no draw, HE WON HERE!!

DoktorD, You have been busy I see, and doing well despite continued gibberish from the internet. Rifled 32 pdrs. (conversion guns), YES, 12 pdrs. ? NO. At the time of the altercation on the James River which tore up her wheel house and boiler and blew a portion of the deck into the muddy James, CSS Teaser was sporting the gun we showed here, and, at the other end, a 10 pdr. Parrott Rifle on a slide carriage. Don't fret, Ive seen that 10 pdr. Parrott called a 100 pdr. Parrott, a 100 Blakely and something else so bizarre I can't even remember it.

Nashville, NO. Tennessee, YES. We were thinking of Franklin, TN where General Cleburn and four other generals were killed.
Looks like you found the correct ammo. The shell in our photo and your shells also are sporting a double bourlette, (bore riding bands) which the south really loved, because they saved a bunch of lathe turning time on this type. Only the bands, themselves needed any.
Looks like No. 6 is claimed by the new guy, won't anyone challenge? Doc, seems like your on the way to winning the big prize. Press on, press on.

T&M

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #18 on:** April 05, 2009, 04:45:01 PM »

Quote from: seacoastartillery on April 05, 2009, 04:31:05 PM

Thanks for joining in Tim. That's an interesting theory about probably going to the deep south for No. 1, but (this is the part I really hate, where you have to let them down gently, what with them being high powered Moderators an' all) sorry, think about going North a few hundred miles. Remember that place where General George Washington attacked (with Field Artillery) and blasted the snot out of those pesky Germans as they fell out of their barracks to form up in the street. Damn cold morning it was too. This battle was no draw, HE WON HERE!!
...
T&M

Let down gently? B.S. ! I'm an educator by training (and nature), a technician by certification, and an engineer by profession - let the FACTS speak for themselves! (Sorry, I aprpeciate your politeness, but the reality of life is that facts are facts and how you FEEL about them won't change the situation - don't get me started about the political situation!!!!!!!)

Good hints. My 'feeling' was from the architecture - ok, not atypical for the era, just a BAD guess to the location.

(continue rant: ) High power moderator? More B.S.
I look at your skills in awe. I have now installed 4 (that's FOUR) dowel pins IN MY LIFE! TWO of them correctly!

Your hints require much research. It's after 10:30 pm here, I'm up at 05 to go to Fort Lee in the AM. So next response will be after someone eles has done the research.

GREAT contest!

DD & I have done similar things over the years to generate interest and activity! It is good to see our benefactors being so proactive!

DoktorD · « **Reply #19 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:20:12 PM »

Number 1 --

After that clue I think I have it! Would that be the famous "Swamp Angel"? I think I can even spot that burst breech... I know that it now resides in Trenton, NJ... (Washington sure did surprise those Germans after crossing the Delaware

). I think thats a water fountain in the picture, although I know that the "Swamp Angel" now resides in Cadwallader Park. If it IS swamp angel, it would be a parrott rifle and was near Morris Island. It fired upon Charleston until it burst near the breech.

Did they change the location or am I just wrong on the identification?

DoktorD · « **Reply #20 on:** April 05, 2009, 05:24:52 PM »

I know that the monument it is currently at is in a parck and is completely different, but Trenton, the burst in both pictures, the mention of the memorial being a water fountain, and other things are making me feel compelled to go out on a limb here

EDIT:

Finally found it! That picture is of its original location at the intersection of North Clinton Avenue and Perry Street... It was relocated to the park and dedicated on the 100th anniversary of the beginning of the war due to road construction. The cannon was purchased for scrap iron by the Phoenix Iron Works in Trenton, N.J. Before it could be melted down, it was recognized and saved.

And for the specs:

200 pdr parrott rifle (band was lost after the explosion)
8 in cal.

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #21 on:** April 05, 2009, 06:21:59 PM »

Tim, Anyone who can handle a 4.5" mortar as well as you can, is O.K. in my book. GET thee to bed; 5AM comes early on the East Coast. You know what? As I first looked at that photo, it sure had the "look" of a more southern locale. I think it was the decorative iron-work and gas lights on the monument.

Quote from: Cat Whisperer on April 05, 2009, 04:45:01 PM

(continue rant: ) High power moderator? More B.S.
GREAT contest!
DD & I have done similar things over the years to generate interest and activity! It is good to see our benefactors being so proactive!

Maybe not "high power", but certainly high paid! I bet DD would really love to get one of those hand-formed, aluminum body, bright red Italian sportscars with his moderator loot, but he probably won't do it as he has a retired, former lawman, gentleman rancher image to maintain up there in Montana and anything but a full size pickup truck just won't do it. What about you Tim? How about a fourth story on that three-story beauty? Raise the roof! You will have all the construction projects that you've always dreamed about!

DoktorD, Thank you for all that good info on Quincy Gilmore's favorite terror toy. It was a 200 pounder Parrott, but bore size is a freebe. You found the "OLD" address; that is the hardest part and you know that most famous gun's history. Get on one of those satellite image sites like terraserver and locate Fort Sumter, SC, then go almost due south following that big creek that parallels the east shore of Morris Island. You will find The "Swamp Angel Battery". It looks like it was built last Thursday; the outline is perfect. Wow, modern tools, aren't they great? You have successfully answered #s 1, 3, 1/2 of 4, 6, 7, and 8. That leaves #2 which Lance answered 1/2 of. So, to end this contest, What is that big gun at Ft. Monroe which was the first of a Big Gun Type which used a big, new, form of powder the predesessor of modern cannon powder?

T&M

Double D · « **Reply #22 on:** April 05, 2009, 06:37:24 PM »

Way back in the olden days in my very youthful days, a friend had some sort of english green two seat sports car. He let me borrow it to take a girl on a date...I should have taken my folks Rambler station wagon...would have had room for planned activities. Never have thought much of those type cars since.

Yes, Tim is a High level Moderator, he is taller than me...high, taller, get it...okay, I'm going to go take a pain pill and go to bed

DoktorD · « **Reply #23 on:** April 05, 2009, 07:14:24 PM »

Whoops, forgot to post that one... That monster 15 inch Rodman was nicknamed the "Lincoln Gun".

It was the first 15in to roll out of Fort Pitt foundry. I believe the powder you're referring to is the hexagonal powder with holes through the grains... The idea was the surface area wouldnt decrease like regular black powder so that there would be a slight increase in pressure and maintained pressure in the barrel

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #24 on:** April 05, 2009, 09:03:49 PM »

Bingo! Thank you so much DoktorD. You really made this easy for us here at Seacoast Artillery Company World Headquarters. Instead of researching and double checking everything continuously and running, trying to stay ahead of guys like Victor3 and others who have armed themselves with pitchforks and love to chase me yelling stuff like "Kill the unclean beast; kill Frankenstein's MONSTER!!" Well it's not really that bad, but this was duck-soup by comparison. Heck, we ran a hundred board feet of white oak through the planer today after I colored Easter eggs with my grandson for a couple hours. So, this is the final tally:

1. DoktorD
2. 1/2 Lance and 1/2 DoktorD
3. DoktorD
4. 1/2 DoctorD and 1/2 Terry C.
5. Max Caliber
6. DoktorD
7. DoktorD
8. 1/2 Lance and 1/2 DoktorD

Thank you to all who participated and Congratulations to the WINNER of this latest CONTEST, DoktorD. We hereby bestow upon you the esteemed title of "Historic Artillery Archival Photograph Identification Specialist Extraordinaire"and you are henceforth accorded all the rights and privileges of said title. We also praise your efforts and will note publicly any accolades that you may receive.

Good Night,

Tracy and Mike

Victor3 · « **Reply #25 on:** April 05, 2009, 09:59:57 PM »

Quote from: seacoastartillery on April 05, 2009, 09:03:49 PM

...trying to stay ahead of guys like Victor3 and others who have armed themselves with pitchforks and love to chase me yelling stuff like "Kill the unclean beast; kill Frankenstein's MONSTER!!"

Tracy and Mike

Pitchfork

Naw, you run too fast. I prefer an atlatl...

http://www.atlatl.com/images/thrower1-s.jpg

On the rare occasion I do get one in on you, it often boomerangs on me

Below is a picture of M (or is it T?) getting ready to bean me with a stick for some minor offense...

http://images-partners-tbn.google.com/images?q=tbn:jrU5huaZ2CCIiM:cache.eb.com/eb/image%.jpg

DoktorD · « **Reply #26 on:** April 06, 2009, 01:42:36 AM »

Well thank you Tracy and Mike, I will bear the title with honor...

Fun's over, now its time to get back to that social history paper...

Mat

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #27 on:** April 06, 2009, 06:14:23 PM »

Quote from: seacoastartillery on April 05, 2009, 06:21:59 PM

...
Maybe not "high power", but certainly high paid! I bet DD would really love to get one of those hand-formed, aluminum body, bright red Italian sportscars with his moderator loot,
...
T&M

It must be noted that the BONUSES we get are set according to the following schedule:

2x annual salary for each new member.
10x annual salary for our 'retention' bonuses.
100x annual salary for net increase in # of hits each year.

AND, the annual salary is doubled each year.

Don't let the politicians know - they'd have us testifying before congress, after WALKING to Washington having sold the corporate GBO jet.

Double D · « **Reply #28 on:** April 06, 2009, 06:36:01 PM »

Don't worry Tim, I still have GBO Escalade...I'll pick you up on the way

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #29 on:** April 06, 2009, 07:32:04 PM »

Quote from: Victor3 on April 05, 2009, 09:59:57 PM

Below is a picture of M (or is it T?) getting ready to bean me with a stick for some minor offense...

http://images-partners-tbn.google.com/images?q=tbn:jrU5huaZ2CCIiM:cache.eb.com/eb/image%.jpg

Yea, that would be me, getting ready for our Hawaiian Vacation. I kept telling the kids about posting family pics on the net, but do they listen? NO! The real reason for the outfit was not the indigenous and good natured people of Hawaii, but, since we had a layover at L.A.X., I wanted to be prepared. I've heard that can be a fairly scary place.

Quote from: Cat Whisperer on April 06, 2009, 06:14:23 PM

Quote from: seacoastartillery on April 05, 2009, 06:21:59 PM
...
Maybe not "high power", but certainly high paid! I bet DD would really love to get one of those hand-formed, aluminum body, bright red Italian sportscars with his moderator loot,
...T&M
It must be noted that the BONUSES we get are set according to the following schedule:

2x annual salary for each new member.
10x annual salary for our 'retention' bonuses.
100x annual salary for net increase in # of hits each year.

AND, the annual salary is doubled each year.

The truth FINALLY comes out! I knew it. I knew it! I knew it!![/b]

Quote from: Double D on April 06, 2009, 06:36:01 PM

Don't worry Tim, I still have GBO Escalade...I'll pick you up on the way

After years and years of denials, now, finally the other one admits to accepting a luxury automobile. Well that just chaps my jeans, how the heck do I get one of these EXTREMELY lucrative moderator gigs? NO, I will never get to ride in one of those; I have to be happy with an old, busted up Chevy and a little puddle jumper that hurts my tail bone every time I go over a crack in the pavement!

Congrats DoktorD, you're the man!

M&T