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Author Topic: underlug weld interesting find  (Read 896 times)

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Offline mtbugle

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underlug weld interesting find
« on: April 10, 2009, 05:20:24 PM »
I was trying to keep a little busy today while home from work with bronchitis.(figured I could lean against the boat as well as the bedpost.) So I was test fitting my new forearm rtv modification to the numerus barrels I have to see if they would all seem solid and sit even in the one forearm.(they look good, so range test to follow of shooting without forearm and with this modification and compare with old groups for ones I have been shooting for a while.) The interesting find though was when I was examining My older H&R with snap on forearm I noticed that those lugs/extractors are not welded on. They appear to be sweated or silversoldered on. Also looking at my '81' 28ga it is brazed on. I can see the bronze color all around the fitting seam. If we havn't had problems with those flat on flat soldered or brazed joining systems with up to 3030 loads, I am sure the double sided welding now should hold stouter loading that the rest of the gun will contain. Just found this interesting thinking back on quicks thoughts of the welds possibly being a failure point before rest of gun fails.
Thanks Don.
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Offline trotterlg

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2009, 07:31:22 PM »
Even some of the screw on forearm barrels have silvered on lugs.  I think topper barrels are silvered.  I don't think it is a big deal at all, I have never seen any report of a H&R lug of any attachment type failing, so I think we are all safe.  Even today the USH barrels have the forearm screw lug silvered on.  Larry
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2009, 04:22:54 AM »
Just for info, I attempted to remove one of the brazed-on lugs about 20 years ago. I turned the lug and nearby metal red with a torch and it still took 12 hits with a 5 lb hammer to dislodge it.
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Offline coyotejoe

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2009, 04:56:12 AM »
A really good braze or silver solder joint with lots of surface contact is probably stronger than an imperfect weld joint down both sides.
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Offline Dean of Id

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2009, 11:45:15 AM »
Quote from: coyotejoe on April 11, 2009, 04:56:12 AM
A really good braze or silver solder joint with lots of surface contact is probably stronger than an imperfect weld joint down both sides.

Actually, probably stronger than a perfect weld.  Depends on what alloy is used. 
I was a welder for many years and have used a lot of different brazing and welding metals.  Alloys rated to 120k psi are not unusual for a non-fused (soldered or sometimes brazed) bond between close fitting pieces. 
The wire used for the barrels with welded lugs may not need to be rated for much more than the 60-80K psi range.  Either way, plenty strong.

Dean
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Offline mtbugle

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2009, 12:17:12 PM »
especially after trotterlg shot his barrel with only a rubber band holding closed. I don't think there is much tension pressure to pull it off. and shear forces have to overcome about 3 linear inches of adhesion. Yea I think it is a solid attachment.
thanks Don.
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Offline NFG

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2009, 05:25:32 PM »
I don't know if I got an early or late or ??? barrel versions...all my NEF forearm screw on mount lugs are SPOT WELDED on...even my USH SB-980, I just checked. 

I sure wish they were soldered or brazed on...it would make the mount a lot stronger...the mount is OK for a OEM forearm but NOT for an after market with added weight. 

The recoil of my origninal 45-70 BC with a Gunstock Inc target forend and an extra pound and a half of lead sheared off...The information is in the stickys...I am about to take my USH  barrel in to have the forend mount TIG'ed on so it will take the recoil of the heavy 12GaFH loads and another Gunstock inc Target forearm with added weight.

Maybe they started silver soldering them on since I bought my SB980 or maybe they solder on the ones for the laminated stocks....I wonder.

Luck on your projects.
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Offline mtbugle

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Re: underlug weld interesting find
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2009, 06:48:47 PM »
refering to the portion that locks into frame, not the forearm holding lug.
thanks Don.
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