2 Meter Band or Dual Band

[FourBee]

Getting ready to take my very first Amateur Radio Exam.  

The 2 Meter Band Arena is tooted to be where the action is for the Technician Class Operators.

But the "Dual Band"  (2Meter + 430~450MHz) is loaded with lots of stuff that is the talk of  some of the old hand amateur operators.

So, here I stand in the middle of the cross roads of  confusion.    Which route would the wise take?  

4B  

[stan_hurst]

A hard question to give a simple answer to.

Is there much activity on 440 in your area ?

Are any of the 2 meter repeaters linked to 440.

In our area 440 repraters are mainly used for echo link in order
to get users on them.

In either case a good antenna is your best investment.

Good luck on your test, and welcome to a great hobby.

KG4NAE stan

[FourBee]

KG4NAE
            Thank you stan.    I'll check into those questions you presented.   That should be enough to swing in the right direction concerning the radio.

In either case a good antenna is your best investment.

Since this set-up will be a 'BASE STATION' I've been reading about a "LONG WIRE" antenna as I have plenty of room for one.    But I have my reservations about that too....   Would actually like something more compact.  Decisions, decisions.- - - -

4B

[ozarkhillbilly49]

hi 4b. a long wire is usually used on the low bands(80-10 mtrs). for fm work a vertical is the norm.(50 mcs. and up) there are many nice factory antennas that can be bought. to start out with the cheapest way to go is a yaseu 2800m a power supply and a cushcraft ringo ranger. you can also make a very good 2 mtr. antenna called a jpole. making your stuff is a lot of fun! i have a 7 element vertical coliner ready to hang. it is fed with 450 ohm ladder line. personally i would start out with the cheapest possible setup. ham radio is a lot of fun but may not turn out to be your cup of tea. as you can proably tell i am an old fart!! i build a lot of my stuff. i will have 3 or 4 antenna projects going this spring plus rebuliding a heath sb-200 amp. later on in the year i may start to build a big amp. there are many aspects to ham radio.like i say i would start cheap and simple! if you like ham radio it can get expensive and complex in a hurry!! a couple of manufactures have 10.000 dollar plus hf radio's!!!!!! you take care 4b. 73's. aa5ez-travis

[FourBee]

Hey again ozarkhillbilly49 :
Okay the long wire is out ~ Did a long search on the Cushcraft Ringo Ranger 2 Meter Antennas, and almost stopped at one point because someone said they were discontinued.   Not so.   Found them at Radio City.   Thanks for the heads-up on them.    2 Meter antennas must be easily built from what I've seen, but I'm not in the mood for anything like that at this point.   I just want to get up and running ASAP.

 I've always wanted a Kenwood Radio.   Don't know why now, ( our radio-room in Vietnam may have been using them [we were a  direct air-support operation], I'll post a pic of it. ),  but started looking at them first, then the Yaesu.   Really a battle going on between them for a couple of days.   Somewhere along the line the ICOM V8000 popped up, and I think it is about to win out, but I'll have to go over all their features and spec.'s again.

Looks like you've got your summer already cut out for you with all those antenna on the agenda.   By the way, will I need an SWR meter to add in the line up?  I don't want to blow anything up.

4B
 

[ihuntbucks]

Good luck on your test......73 de NS4M    Rick

[FourBee]

Thanks NS4M    Rick:
  Here is a pic calling in an air-strike north of DaNang City,VN.. in '68'.    Our guys stayed busy 24/7/365.  Ground Troops called us for air support requesting specific ordnance.   Our Operations crew in turn called the air base on the red phone (hot line).   Once airborne, the fighters would request grids and radio frequencies.   Then we'd monitor the events between ground and air as they developed.   All ammo dispensed via fighterbombers, destructions, casualties, both livestock and human were collected and radio'd to us for compilation.  I then  secret coded it and sent it to higher echelons.   Even in heavy downpours, we'd call in the Navy A6's {I think that was what they were} with their super nose cone radar equipment to do what was necessary.  I got some real fast OJT on one of these radio's once {which was highly out of the norm} when an airborne FAC Pilot requested to talk to me. 

We had some world-wide radios over to the right out of the picture.    Our Commander liked to catch up with things in the Philippines from time to time.

4B 

[ozarkhillbilly49]

4b, that nam shack is all collins s-line gear. worth a pretty penny then and a prettier penny now. that gear was for a guy that knew how to  tune a transmitter.( not much to it if you think a little!!).the old rigs are almost a hobby unto them selves now. drake gear has a following.collins. heathkit of course. a lot of guys like the even older stuff like johnson, hallicraters, hammarlund, national etc. just about any of the modern off the shelf radios will give outstanding service. for me it comes down to custormer service.yaesu has always went just alittle extra for me. that is why i lean towards them for off the shelf stuff. if i ever get rich, famous , and goodlookin i would consider one of the new elecraft k3 hf kit radios. supposed to have a better reciever than the ten tec orion2.but for now i will just have to stick with a yaesu ft-one on hf and the 2800m for 2mtrs.ahhh to  have your problem, money and wants for a new radio!!!!like i said 4b you ain't gonna notice a whole lot of difference in any modern jap radio. good luck with the test. if i can help you out any give me a shout.take care. lokking forward to hearing you on the air.73's aa5ez qrt sk.

[Catfish]

2 meter is all over the country but 440 is hard to find in the more rural areas, form what I found driveing a truck. I would recomand you get a good 2 meter and if you can still aford more go for the 440. If you live near the repeters you will be working a hand held is nice, but if your going want to work repeters farther out get a moble first.

[FourBee]

ozarkhillbilly49 : for now i will just have to stick with a yaesu ft

Hey; ozarkhillbilly49 :
          One Yaesu FT-2800M on order.   After many reviews and looking over the features, I went with the 2800.   Also ordered the Ringo Ranger II antenna, but just got an e-mail stating they were 3 weeks back order.   So tomorrow I'll contact them and see if they have the 9' Ringo in stock.  
They also list a 4' verticle I believe, but I'm wondering if it would be good enough ~  cause I'm way out west of Ft Smith, under a hill.

but 440 is hard to find in the more rural areas

Catfish ;    Kinda got that impression when at the ' Ft Smith Club Meeting Monday night'.   With that thought in mind, I began looking at just the 2 Meter Banders.   About the only complaint most reviews have with the 2800M is wobbly knobs, which is no big deal to me.   Besides, one operator said all you need is an '0'-Ring to slip between the knob and case to give it support and makes the knob turning more robust.

4B

[Foggy]

4B
Did you pass your test??  I been researching too/ and a 2m to start is how I'am going

[ozarkhillbilly49]

4b and foggy if i can help you guys out with anything just drop a line to me. i will be glad to help you any way i can. i am a lousy writer and teacher but if  i can help i will. wish both of you fellars a 100% on your test scores!!!! if i can answer any questions about how some things work i sure will. wish you both close enuff where i could help more. 73's aa5ez qrt sk.

[Foggy]

ozarkhillbilly49 Thanks I will be taking you up on that
 Foggy

[FourBee]

    

Foggy:   ~  4B
       Did you pass your test??   I been researching too/ and a 2m to start is how I'am going

Hey Foggy:
                 I'm studying right now.  The exam isn't until June 13th.  Just finished with the "Element 2 Amateur Radio Technician Class License Study Guide", a download PDF file.    Now I'm taking notes from the text Book "ARRL Ham Radio License Manual"  Level 1 Technician .  

Once I finish this book  I'm going on-line to take one of those free sample exams to see how I'm doing.   I will take it as many times as necessary to sink it into this thick head of mine.

So; I've got to pass that exam !    I'm gathering my equipment now so I can have it set up for when I pass the exam.    

Hope to see you on the air waves Foggy, good luck with your exam too.  All we need is 74% (26 out of 35 questions).  It won't take over 45 minutes for the exam.  
At that time (assuming we pass) we'll receive our CSCE Certificate from the VE, and about 10 days for the FCC to record us in their On-Line Listing database of Licensees.  Once we see our names appear on it we can start transmitting.  73's

4B

[FourBee]

This studying is wearing me down.   I've gone thru the Element 2 Amateur Radio Technician Class License Study Guide, the ARRL Ham Radio License Manual (Technician Level 1), and just finished the Technician Class Element 2 by Gordon West .  His is more in depth.   We're looking at a 35 multiple choice exam from a pool of 391 questions.   Some of the hard ones are really tricky. Hope I don't get too many of those.   Test time is bearing down on me, and I don't feel I'm ready.

Been rigging up my radio gear.  Needed a Pigtail for my SWR Meter.  So I made one.  That was something I really didn't want to jump into .  And when I got started, I shook like a leaf all the way thru the job.   A little sloppy soldering of the PL-259 connectors, but it shows good continuity.  Hope I don't blow this sucker up.  I blew out a bicycle generator one time when I wired it up backwards.  

 I'd like to put up my antenna, but it keeps raining.   Had over 10" in the past few days.  

[Lead pot]

If I was in the market for a rig on the tech class I would go with a tri bander.
I still have my Yaesu FT 726 R and it is set up for 6, 2 and 432.
Receiver is very good and you have all mods of operation and you can work all sorts of cross band splits and when the bands are open you can work a long way with it.

LP.

[FourBee]

Hey Lead pot;  thanks for the steer.   I've been browsing around at the options at hand.   Looked at the Yaesu FT-726R and its reviews.   Very nice radio, that one, and its sister the 736.   Once I get used to working the 2 Meter I'll be wanting to expand and maybe dabble a little bit in CW.   I've always wanted to do that.

But for now, just getting this little 2 meter rig going is enough.   Am wondering how long a coax need be for a dummy load to test this radio.
4B

[ozarkhillbilly49]

whatever length of coax you got handy will work for that  4b. oh would i love to have a 726 or 736 rig!!! the 726 would match my ft one. the 736 got computer assisted control( whatever that is). see there 4b. some of old farts are behind the times a tad to.glad to see you been hitting the books. have you tried any practice test yet? if not whip over to qrz.com and give one a try. i bet you can ace it!!!hope we all get to dry out some.they might open the floodgates on beaver dam. if they do i would like to drive up and see that. all that water coming out is a heck of a sight!!! terribly powerful!!!!! take care 4b and let me know how you do on your practice test. a hello to leadpot also. has foggy been around  lately?he was talking of taking his test pretty shortly to. 73's to all. aa5ez

[Lead pot]

Keep your leads odd 1/4 wave lengths.
1/4-3/4 and so on plus figure in the velocity factor of the coax when you cut your line.

LP.

[Lead pot]

Ozark
TW, congrads on your extra upgrade.

After talking about the 726 I had to get it out this morning and hook it up

Well after having it boxed up for several years it died on the 2 mtr band.

I guess that happens when you lay around.
Have to pull the module out and check and see where it circuit stops.

F-B

Work on CW it gets to be a language once you get past counting dots and dashes. The more you work with it the easier it gets.
It's my favorite way of communicating when working QRP DX.

[ozarkhillbilly49]

hey leadpot, no upgrade. been an extra for some years now. just got tired of being hasseled about a novice( that is the class i got my first ticket under) on the extra class subbands. you run into horses butts everwhere. now i just get hasseled about being an extralite!!! both of course are false assumptions. i listened to one "oldtimer"( a 20wpm man!!) complain about tube life in his amp. when he got to talking about tuneup procedures it became obvious why the short tube life!!!! he could copy code but could"nt read a handbook and get an glimmer of an idea on how to tune a tetrode amp!!!sorry to hear about that 726 throwing a fit. if it gets to bugging you to much leadpot i would take it offen your hands and save you some aggervation!!!!!! i got some trade stock that i could let go of. would you like to have a nice transformer for a solid state amp?? i got one that will do 55 volts at 36 amps continuous duty! 2kva core.if you got any parts to trade let me know what you got. maybe we can help each other out!! i shore hate to see a nice fellar bothered with a down rig!! maybe one of them ft-847 earth stations is in order there leadpot!! igot a sb-200 carcass that would make a nice 144 or 440 amp with a gi7b tube!!anything tickle your fancy yet?? as you can tell leadpot  i sure would like to have a 726!! i agree on cw being one of the most effective forms of radio communications possible. i just have so much hearing loss and tinnitus that cw is very difficult for me now.if i were feeding an antenna i sure would look at 1/4 wave increments. i am just casual about some things tho lead pot!!! it is just a darned ol' radio antenna!( bit different thinking from eme work). on hf you can think like me and get away with it!!oh well this is long enuff!! i hope 4b has taken a practice test or 2. bet he can pass with flying colors!!!!! i sure enjoy coming here. this is a GOOD FORUM!!!!! take care all.73's aa5ez ( i am ez, just ask any of the girls!!!)

[FourBee]

Hey LP & ozark;  
      I've been browsing around qrz.com and took a test.  97.1%, or 34 of 35 .  Missed the QSY question.  I don't know the "Q" Codes, so when the question asked which Q Code pertained to changing frequencies, I was in total darkness.

Saw a FT-736R for sale on the swap forum.  Made me take notice.  Sure would like to jump in and get it, but I'll try to stay calm and ride this out one step at a time.

On qrz... some of the old Ham's are highly knowlegable about electronics and I honor that.  They also don't care for this new testing system, and I can understand their reasoning about it.   However; being a late comer with old man time chasing me faster each day (I'm 65yrs young),  I'm thrilled that I have the opportunity to get in on some of this hands on amateur radioing.   A longtime depressed passion (that's another story) that I didn't think would ever materialize.

LP; I'm going to have to read up on this cause it's Greek to me~~
" QUOTE" Keep your leads odd 1/4 wave lengths.
1/4-3/4 and so on plus figure in the velocity factor of the coax when you cut your line.

4B

[ozarkhillbilly49]

hey 4b don't sweat it . i will get a handbook out later and run thru the formula with you. congrats on the passing score on the practice test!!!!!! when are you gonna do the real test??? bet you ace it to. an arrl handbook is darn handy to have. i got'em from the 1930's up to 1991. you take care bug. i will post back on how to figure feedline lengths. 73's. aa5ez.( don't worry about some of the old farts complaning about newcomer's. you are playing by the rules ain't ya!!!)

[Lead pot]

4b

in time when you really get into this you will be making wave guides to squeeze every OZ gain you can get

Ozark.

I thank you kindle on your gracious offer for all that fine stuff but I have xformers that are 3 amp 3200 volt and weigh 120 pounds and Isolation xformers that go 80 lbs that make very good river boat anchors
And I'm still running 807's and the big 4-250 and the 500 Z's to keep my shack warm 

I been thinking about your chirps are you really having that problem??

[ozarkhillbilly49]

hum??? 3200 at 3amps. hummmmm . would you part with that? i do have an old grief kit here that is a little chirpy!! ain't used it in years tho. my ol ft one is pretty stable. heavy hitter isolation transformers to!!! those are all good windable cores leadpot!! explaining what a "birdie" is in a receiver is a good way to introduce  newcomers to hetrodyning  and frq. determination in a reciever. also a good way for a couple ol farts to have some fun to. relive some old memories!!!! first homebrew regen reciever. my mom and dad  screaming at me to turn that squaking, squealing thang off or go hungry!!!! i hope you get that 726 up and running again. i shore would like to have one of them rigs!!! didn't figure i could intrest you in any of my junk dadgumit!!!!!!4b i will post some info back for you a little later on how to figure an electrical 1/4 wave and 1/2 wave feedline. both have some good proprieties. take care all. this is truly a good forum!!! 73's .aa5ez

[Lead pot]

It took me a long time tracing down a chirp-chirp-chirp
till I figured out the neighbor had a scanner going
And there is a project going for the purpose to explore the use of publicly available chirped ionospheric sounding transmissions (ionosondes) to study the ionosphere. These transmissions are made from most parts of the world, and cover the HF spectrum from about 3 to 30 MHz on a 24 hour basis. The unique aspect of this project is that it is wholly passive - it makes use of the sounding transmissions made by other agencies. This means that anyone can potentially receive and interpret the transmissions.

And Grand Island once gave me a citation for having a Vibroplex bug with dirty contacts that made to wide of a ban spread

[ozarkhillbilly49]

yep, i know how you feel leadpot. i got a couple of oo red tickets for pileup busting a few times. have you ever looked on rich measures site? i really enjoy his official observer observer card!! i can't say i agree with everything mr. measures has to say but i do think a lot of his thinking on amps is basically sound.  remember the Russian woodpecker!!! jeez ain't it amazing what govments can get away with!! jeez dirty contacts on a bug. must have cost a whole extra 20 cycles of bandwidth!!! fellars i have had a rough day and i am going to pack it in for tonite. 4b i promise i will post some on the 1/4 wave deal.73's to all. aa5ez. qrt(closing station) sk(cw for shutting down). nite all.

[ozarkhillbilly49]

here we go on wavelengths!! 4b we are going to look at a cycle of oscillation. lets imagine we have a line that represents 0 value.( this value is usually voltage) .a sine wave(or rf wave) will have + components(above the line)and- components(below the line) remember the line is 0. now we take off and head down the line as volts rise. when we get to point of peak value if we drop a line from the peak to the 0 line straight down so they intersect at a 90 degree angle we just found a 1/4 wave!now if we go down the line to where the value falls back to 0 we just found a 1/2 wave. if we go down to the negative peak and bring a line up to the 0 line at a 90 degree angle we found 3/4 of a wave. if we travel to the next 0 point we just found a full wave!now remember we are talking about rf. it travels in different stuff. it travels in air, the vaccum of space, the copper traces on the boards in our radios. it travels in our feedlines and antennas. it travels at different speeds in all of those things!!!!! WHAT!!!! HOW CAN THAT BE? the answer is simple, resistance.in the fastest medium(free space) electrons can change places very fast!!!in one of the slowest mediums electrons can't change places as fast due to effects of the conductor and insulation!!! that slow medium is of course coax!! now remember our line. if the cycle(or wave) is going slower it will travel a shorter distance for all  the neat little points we found!! make sense so far??puzzel on this'un for a while 4b. drop a line back and tell me if this makes sense to you. if it does we will do a little math next time!!! 73's to all. hope leadpot got his rig up and running!!! those 726's are nice. aa5ez qrt.(closing station).

[Hodr]

Fourbee What swap forum?  I have an excess ICOM w32a with ac/dc power supply and original rubber ducky antenna.

thanks for your time

blindhari

[FourBee]

Thank You ozark; I'll check that out.

Fourbee What swap forum?  I have an excess ICOM w32a with ac/dc power supply and original rubber ducky antenna.

thanks for your time

blindhari

Hey blindhari; Go over to qrz.com, and click onto their swap forum....