Author Topic: Obama at it again....  (Read 352 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Masterblaster1

  • Trade Count: (4)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 223
Obama at it again....
« on: April 24, 2009, 07:47:08 AM »
It appears our great American President is looking to curtail my freedoms again.  This treaty he is pushing with Mexico would apparently make it illegal for me to reload my own ammo. Here is the link        http://www.oas.org/juridico/English/treaties/a-63.html   I sure hope the NRA is all over this one. If we lose our rights at least I will know I did not contribute to it, not voting for this clown was a no-brainer.

Offline Bart Solo

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 706
  • Gender: Male
Re: Obama at it again....
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2009, 09:26:24 AM »
How many times do I have to see this phony baloney.  The treaty you are talking about has been kicking around over twelve years.  It is an international treaty.  Have you read it?  I have. It deals with the illicit manufacture and shipment of ammunition from country to country.  That is why it is an international treaty. 

Please, for the love of all that is good, stop with the panic already.  The NRA has a staff that will tell us when we should start worrying.  Until then we are wasting our time.  Worse, we are encouraging horders to buy up everything making it more expensive or maybe impossible to find components.

In any event it takes a vote of 67 senators before any treaty can be ratified.  I would be far more worried about an assault weapons ban which could be passed with a majority vote. Of course, so far the assault weapons bill isn't being pushed by the administration.

 Oh, did you know that  if you sell ammunition you manufacture (reload) you have to be licensed already? 18 U.S.C 923(a)(1)(C)   http://www.atf.gov/firearms/fflc/ffl/ffl_types.htm#type06

Offline nw_hunter

  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (4)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5208
  • Gender: Male
Re: Obama at it again....
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2009, 02:59:21 PM »
How many times do I have to see this phony baloney.  The treaty you are talking about has been kicking around over twelve years.  It is an international treaty.  Have you read it?  I have. It deals with the illicit manufacture and shipment of ammunition from country to country.  That is why it is an international treaty. 

Please, for the love of all that is good, stop with the panic already.  The NRA has a staff that will tell us when we should start worrying.  Until then we are wasting our time.  Worse, we are encouraging horders to buy up everything making it more expensive or maybe impossible to find components.

In any event it takes a vote of 67 senators before any treaty can be ratified.  I would be far more worried about an assault weapons ban which could be passed with a majority vote. Of course, so far the assault weapons bill isn't being pushed by the administration.

 



Phony Baloney huh?
Read below what Mr (I never met a gun grabber we couldn't have a dialog with) Wayne Lapierre said, and read on to see what the GOA (A true friend of the gun owners)has to say on the subject.

Statement By NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre and NRA Chief Lobbyist Chris Cox Regarding the Organization of American States Treaty on Firearms Trafficking

Thursday, April 16, 2009

The NRA is well aware of the proposed Organization of American States treaty on firearms trafficking, known by its Spanish initials as CIFTA. The NRA monitored the development of this treaty from its earliest days, but contrary to news reports today, the NRA did not "participate" at the meeting where the treaty was approved.

The treaty does include language suggesting that it is not intended to restrict "lawful ownership and use" of firearms . Despite those words, the NRA knows that anti-gun advocates will still try to use this treaty to attack gun ownership in the U.S. Therefore, the NRA will continue to vigorously oppose any international effort to restrict the constitutional rights of law-abiding American gun owners.

Gun Owners Of America:

Obama Pushing Treaty To Ban Reloading
-- Even BB guns could be on the chopping block

Tuesday, April 21, 2009

Remember CANDIDATE Barack Obama?  The guy who “wasn’t going to take away our guns”?

Well, guess what?

Less than 100 days into his administration, he’s never met a gun he didn’t hate.

A week ago, Obama went to Mexico, whined about the United States, and bemoaned (before the whole world) the fact that he didn’t have the political power to take away our semi-automatics.  Nevertheless, that didn’t keep him from pushing additional restrictions on American gun owners.

It’s called the Inter-American Convention Against Illicit Manufacturing of and Trafficking in Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, and Other Related Materials.  To be sure, this imponderable title masks a really nasty piece of work.

First of all, when the treaty purports to ban the “illicit” manufacture of firearms, what does that mean?

1. “Illicit manufacturing” of firearms is defined as “assembly of firearms [or] ammunition ... without a license....”

Hence, reloading ammunition -- or putting together a lawful firearm from a kit -- is clearly “illicit manufacturing.”

Modifying a firearm in any way would surely be “illicit manufacturing.”  And, while it would be a stretch, assembling a firearm after cleaning it could, in any plain reading of the words, come within the screwy definition of “illicit manufacturing.”

2. “Firearm” has a similarly questionable definition.

“[A]ny other weapon” is a “firearm,” according to the treaty -- and the term “weapon” is nowhere defined.

So, is a BB gun a “firearm”?  Probably.

A toy gun?  Possibly.

A pistol grip or firing pin?  Probably.  And who knows what else. 

If these provisions (and others) become the law of the land, the Obama administration could have a heyday in enforcing them.  Consider some of the other provisions in the treaty:

* Banning reloading. In Article IV of the treaty, countries commit to adopting “necessary legislative or other measures” to criminalize illicit manufacturing and trafficking in firearms.

Remember that “illicit manufacturing” includes reloading and modifying or assembling a firearm in any way.  This would mean that the Obama administration could promulgate regulations banning reloading on the basis of this treaty -- just as it is currently circumventing Congress to write legislation taxing greenhouse gases.

* Banning gun clubs. Article IV goes on to state that the criminalized acts should include “association or conspiracy” in connection with said offenses -- which is arguably a term broad enough to allow, by regulation, the criminalization of entire pro-gun organizations or gun clubs, based on the facilities which they provide their membership.

* Extraditing US gun dealers. Article V requires each party to “adopt such measures as may be necessary to establish its jurisdiction over the offenses it has established in accordance with this Convention” under a variety of circumstances.

We know that Mexico is blaming U.S. gun dealers for the fact that its streets are flowing with blood.  And we know it is possible for Mexico to define offenses “committed in its territory” in a very broad way.  And we know that we have an extradition obligation under Article XIX of the proposed treaty.  So we know that Mexico could try to use the treaty to demand to extradition of American gun dealers.

Under Article XXIX, if Mexico demands the extradition of a lawful American gun dealer, the U.S. would be required to resolve the dispute through “other means of peaceful settlement.”

Does anyone want to risk twenty years in a sweltering Mexican jail on the proposition that the Obama administration would apply this provision in a pro-gun manner?

* Microstamping. Article VI requires “appropriate markings” on firearms.  And, it is not inconceivable that this provision could be used to require microstamping of firearms and/or ammunition -- a requirement which is clearly intended to impose specifications which are not technologically possible or which are possible only at a prohibitively expensive cost.

* Gun registration. Article XI requires the maintenance of any records, for a “reasonable time,” that the government determines to be necessary to trace firearms.  This provision would almost certainly repeal portions of McClure-Volkmer and could arguably be used to require a national registry or database.
Freedom Of Speech.....Once we lose it, every other freedom will follow.

Offline beerbelly

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1625
Re: Obama at it again....
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2009, 02:09:45 AM »
That treaty was never ratified by the senate. If he gets it raddified, I expect he will crack down on reloading. Don't fool your self, this guy is slick. He is coming after or gun rights. He is just being very sneaky about it.
                                Beerbelly