Copper plating cast bullet experiment

[ShadowMover]

Repeating a set up I made many years ago I put this together recently. Some changes I made and will make from the video. I used about 3 times as much copper sulfate, I added some battery acid, and I need to punch or drill more holes in the tumbling bucket. I also need to add an aquarium heater to warm up the solution, and a better power supply than an old battery charger. It is too slow.

Well, my video must be too big as it didn't show up. I'll work on it. The video was 1600 KB in size and could only be 1024. I'll trim it down and get back to you guys interested in the plating project. I wasn't able to get a movie to load so here are some pictures. What is nor shown is the 'sacrificial' copper anode that is a grid or mesh of copper wire at the bottom of the Copper Sulfate solution. This is hooked to the + side of a good high amperage battery charger. The wire gets eaten up as the copper gets deposited on the bullets.

I wrote this rather long winded description a few years ago:
I've copper plated bullets using a automobile battery charger, Copper Sulfate (Bluestone Root killer), a square plastic bucket, a BBQ rotisserie motor and shaft, scrap copper wire, and a few pieces of carbon from a battery or starter brushes.  You need to rotate the bullets in the plating solution or they grow little wires (dendrites) that make them rough and lumpy. Set up a plastic bucket with a lid on the shaft of the old BBQ rotisserie, using the adjustable prongs to center it and hold it. Pre-drill a few dozen or more holes in the bucket; the more the better. Don't make them bigger than the bullets. I used a bucket that premixed wall board 'mud' came in. The bucket has to be small enough so the motor can rotate it, when it's loaded up with bullets. The bullets go in the bucket, which rotates on the rotisserie shaft, which is supported by a short piece of copper pipe soldered or clamped to the square rotisserie shaft. The copper / shaft  rotates on a piece of graphite or starter brush on one side of the bucket, providing a bearing surface and electrical connection to the NEG  - MINUS side of the battery charger. The other end of the shaft goes in the rotisserie motor.  The solution is distilled water with a handful of copper sulfate ( experiment! ), deep enough to submerge the bullets while it rotates.  The other battery cable connection goes to a web of copper wires (scrap wire with the insulation cut off) positioned on the bottom of the square bucket to clear the bucket as it rotates. As the current flows copper will plate onto the rotating bullets and the prongs. Copper from the wires on the bottom will dissolve into the solution to replace what is plated out these are  connected to the + POS side of the charger. The wires in the bottom will get thinner as they are eaten away. You can adjust the temperature, the charger setting, the concentration of the solution, and the distance between the wires on the bottom and the bullets. The last time I did it, over 25 years ago, the bullets (.429 SWC straight wheel weights) plated to a red copper color which I couldn't dent with my fingernail, and stayed on the bullet pieces after it went through an old RR tie. The finish is not real shiny, but rather red , hard, and rough. The tumbling in the bucket puts a lot of tiny dents in the surface. After the plating, I washed them real good a few times,dried, then lubrisized them with Alox /Beeswax.  As to the toxicity of the solution, it's legal to dump the copper sulfate solution into the sewer, or they wouldn't sell it for that. The solution is reusable, as the copper is replenished by the wires in the bottom.  Just pour it into a safe plastic container. Store it away from kids, and wear rubber gloves, as it is poison.  There are many things that could improve the plating, and make it look better, but this simple process does work, and is a starting point.  If the bullets are lubrisized they should be the correct diameter. You will have to check the weight.

[Robert357]

Thanks for sharing!  I like both Rainier and Berry bullets, but at the moment both are in short supply.  It is nice to know that there is a way to do this. 

One think I was warned about at a local gunshop was copper bullets loaded to +P+ 9mm loads and secured with a sharp roll crimp.  I was told that a roll crimp could cut the copper creating the famous India dum-dum-DUMB barrel explosion potential.  That is the bottom copper remaining within the barrel and waiting for the next round to overpressure things.  If you go to the Rainier website, it use to say to only use a tapper crimp and never a roll crimp on their bullets.  I never saw a similar warning on Berry bullets, but felt it was still a good idea not to do a roll crimp on them as well.

[SHOOTALL]

Got to ask - the bullet from India was soft lead not copper ?
the presure from expanding gas is behind the base of the bullet so how could anything remain in the bbl ?
In its simplest form a gun is little more than an internal combustion engine with no connecting rod , the piston is a one time use . What would keep part of it in the cyl/bbl ?
The judge has up to 5 seperate buck shot going down a bbl with no problem and at best a paper wad at the back side .

[Robert357]

Got to ask - the bullet from India was soft lead not copper ?
the presure from expanding gas is behind the base of the bullet so how could anything remain in the bbl ?

You might check out the following and look closely at footnote 14  http://www.thegunzone.com/dum-dum.html


The caution expressed to me was that a solid roll crimp that accidently "cut" the copper cladding, had resulted in some cladding separation.  I was advised by the gunshop not to load such rounds to +P+ pressures/speed and to use only a tapper crimp.  In light of the fame of the Dum Dum bullet, I thought that was good advice and thought I would pass it along.

[Robert357]

Thanks for sharing!  I like both Rainier and Berry bullets, but at the moment both are in short supply.  It is nice to know that there is a way to do this. 

One think I was warned about at a local gunshop was copper-clad bullets loaded to +P+ 9mm loads and secured with a sharp roll crimp.  I was told that a roll crimp could cut the copper creating the famous India dum-dum-DUMB barrel explosion potential.  That is the bottom copper remaining within the barrel and waiting for the next round to overpressure things.  If you go to the Rainier website, it use to say to only use a tapper crimp and never a roll crimp on their bullets.  I never saw a similar warning on Berry bullets, but felt it was still a good idea not to do a roll crimp on them as well.

[SHOOTALL]

thanks for the ref. on the bullet .
I have always heard not to load washed bullets to +p+ . I still don't see a crimp causing a plated bullet to seperate and part remain in the bbl.
And seldom do i roll crimp anything for a handgun , I profile crimp placing the brass in contact with the top of the crimp ring of the bullet thus locking the bullet in place with littke chance of set back or forward movement . This was a  pratice I picked up from other revolver shooters years ago .

[agent141]

What kind of tumbling time do you use   time vs. thickness

Rick

[ShadowMover]

That batch was about 2 hours, and it wasn't really as thick as it could be. I could still see lead showing on some of the bullets. The amount of copper deposited depends on the number of electrons ( current) going through the solution. I just had a cheap 10 amp battery charger. The charger wasn't putting the full 10 amps in, only about 2, because I didn't have enough copper sulfate, acid , holes in the bucket, or temperature. It did work, but it was just slow. The last time I did it, by luck I got it better, I had access to a real big automotive shop battery charger, and I used a copper/graphite starter brush as a contact bearing combination.  I could tell it wasn't going as well this time, because the brush, from a small electric drill motor, was getting hot.  I need to have more copper wires in the solution across the bottom too. I wouldn't call the bullets plated this time a complete success, just a mile marker on the way. I wish I could give you a thickness. I just know I couldn't scrape it off with my fingernail. I just wanted to share what I'd done so far. When I do some modifications and run another batch, I'll post more.

[John Traveler]

That's a very clever home plating setup you came up with!

The commercial plating shops I visited used ground up plastic bits in the tumbling media to cushion the parts and prevent them getting all dinged up.

Plating time, current density, and surface area is what determines thickness of the plating.  You have to do a little math to calculate total bullet area, number of bullets, current density (amps/hour) to find the plated thickness.

I believe commercially plated bullets are pickled (acid washed) and tumble polished to get that bright finish.

An interesting experiment, but I have never been ambitious enough to both plate my pistol bullets and then have to lube & size them too.