Author Topic: Evolution? NEW DISCOVERY (Read 2524 times)

Heather · « **on:** May 19, 2009, 06:15:09 AM »

In what could prove to be a landmark discovery, a leading paleontologist said scientists have dug up the 47 million-year-old fossil of an ancient primate whose features suggest it could be the common ancestor of all later monkeys, apes and humans.

full story at http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,520632,00.html

Heather

Questor · « **Reply #1 on:** May 19, 2009, 06:17:00 AM »

That is big news! Thanks!

rex6666 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 19, 2009, 06:39:27 AM »

I have often wondered about my X inlaws.

Cement Man · « **Reply #3 on:** May 19, 2009, 07:37:28 AM »

Quote from: rex6666 on May 19, 2009, 06:39:27 AM

I have often wondered about my X inlaws.

Now that's funny!

Ruskin · « **Reply #4 on:** May 19, 2009, 07:43:00 AM »

we are at a moment in time when scientist wonder if we evolved from some ape or is some ape looking at us and wondering if his species is evloving into that. Which way is evlovution going? From what to what?

Skunk · « **Reply #5 on:** May 19, 2009, 07:45:14 AM »

Can't Make a Monkey of Me

We're in a revolution just over evolution.
The battle of ages is on.
Some scientists have claimed
We're human just by name,
That monkeys and men are the same.
But Darwin's theory doesn't sound good to me.
I might have monkey manners
But with him I can't agree.

You can't make a monkey of me.
You can't make a monkey of me.
There's not a monkey in my family tree.
I've searched on each branch from Adam to me.
I am inclined to believe
The story of Adam and Eve.
There's no chimpanzee
In my pedigree.
And you can't make a monkey of me.

Can science ever prove it?
Will monkey trials remove it?
We don't have ideas of our own.
In some would monkeys be.
Let them stay in their tree.
But don't talk their chatter to me.
That long missing link
Puts history on the blink.
I'll give you my opinion
The whole chain was lost I think.

You can't make a monkey of me.
You can't make a monkey of me.
There's not a monkey in my family tree.
I've searched on each branch from Adam to me.
I am inclined to believe
The story of Adam and Eve.
There's no chimpanzee
In my pedigree.
And you can't make a monkey of me.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/monkeytrial/sfeature/pop_monkey_03.html

slim rem 7 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 19, 2009, 08:45:13 AM »

even those proponents of evolution can t show an example of one species evolving into another.. sure they evolve.. but not into a creature with totally different dna. while i don t pretent to know whether the creator used evolution to create man..
i do know it won t disprove creation as told in the bible..that storys afully simple to cover so much territory .. but i don t need to know how he does things .. i just need faith that he does things way past our ability to comprehend.. heather you young .. the need for a deep faith may not have occured to you yet i don t know..
but i do know it will... i had 2 uncles that were millionaires .. both atheist..
at ones funeral he requested that,the song, jesus loves me,, be sang .. it was the only hyme he could remember, this told me by his children..slim
ps this not meant to offend you heather.. just the thoughts of an older man with a broke shoulder an can t work.. sad state,but im trying to stay busy ..done been on a trek in the woods today,an mowed the yrd..

Heather · « **Reply #7 on:** May 19, 2009, 09:12:48 AM »

I guess I should have stated my opinon on the article along with the article, but I was simply relaying the news not advocationg for evolution. I have an open mind to the past as I wasn't there and don't know exactly went down. I will say that I believe that we were created. Wether we were created as monkeys, and evolved into humans I don't know. If we were created and seeded here by aliens I don't know. There are many theories to the past, but they are just that theories. Hopefully we will know one day for sure, but I am content with not knowing for now.

Please don't confuse this with my faith. I may not believe in the accuracy of the creation story in the Bible enough to accept it as an accurate description of history. It has been translated, rewritten, and edited by those in power for centurys. That doesn't change my relationship with God. Just becaues I have little faith in men, especially men of power, on Earth doesn't mean I don't have a deep faith in our creator.

Heather

Cement Man · « **Reply #8 on:** May 19, 2009, 10:53:17 AM »

Quote from: Heather on May 19, 2009, 09:12:48 AM

Please don't confuse this with my faith. I may not believe in the accuracy of the creation story in the Bible enough to accept it as an accurate description of history. It has been translated, rewritten, and edited by those in power for centurys. That doesn't change my relationship with God. Just becaues I have little faith in men, especially men of power, on Earth doesn't mean I don't have a deep faith in our creator.

Heather

If I might be so bold to say - "Well said". People prove and disprove almost everything with literal excerpts from different translations of the Bible. I absolutely believe a just and loving God created us, and that he sent his son Jesus the Christ to die for our salvation. God is real in my life and I pray to him every day. Whether a "day" in the process of creation was 24 hours as we clock it or not, doesn't seem to me to be something I need to debate, nor do I want to.

slim rem 7 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 19, 2009, 11:36:43 AM »

i don t know how bold it is but i to think it was well said showing maturity beyond your yrs quite a bit..i am glad you have that faith .. thats whats really necessary for him to help us grow . may the circle be unbroken someday an we ll all better understand.. slim..

GH1 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 19, 2009, 12:07:06 PM »

Personally I find too many holes in both schools of thought to believe in either one exclusively. There's too many things that remain unknown. But that's just me.
GH1

Graybeard · « **Reply #11 on:** May 19, 2009, 12:18:36 PM »

Dunno about the rest of ya but there ain't no monkeys in my family tree. Now I gotta admit I do see some folks walking around that look like the belong in a tree about as much as monkeys do so I won't say the same for them but as for me there ain't no monkeys in my family tree.

billy_56081 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 19, 2009, 01:57:20 PM »

TM7 I as much as I hate to say it, I agree with you completly on this one. There are too many could be's and maybe's in this story. I had me a whole lot of anthopology in college, and just remember evolution, is a theory.

mechanic · « **Reply #13 on:** May 19, 2009, 05:18:31 PM »

They done gone and found some old cave woman's cave cat. Probably choked on a fur ball and died.

nomosendero · « **Reply #14 on:** May 20, 2009, 02:59:35 AM »

Quote from: TM7 on May 19, 2009, 01:37:34 PM

Looks like a big rat or lizard. Of course it could be argued that man so-called evolved from a rat or lizard...
Every once in a while scientist put up one of these fossil records that looks funny. Then in a few weeks or months it is debunked as a fraud or made up specium.

..TM7

Wow, we agree!!

gypsyman · « **Reply #15 on:** May 20, 2009, 03:11:16 AM »

I go by the old common sense opinion of, if we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys? gypsyman

slim rem 7 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 20, 2009, 03:20:39 AM »

now thats irrifutable [flunked that new word huh

]
gypsyman nailed it.. best argument ive ever heard against it..
an so simple. slim

rex6666 · « **Reply #17 on:** May 20, 2009, 03:21:52 AM »

Quote from: Heather on May 19, 2009, 09:12:48 AM

I guess I should have stated my opinon on the article along with the article, but I was simply relaying the news not advocationg for evolution. I have an open mind to the past as I wasn't there and don't know exactly went down. I will say that I believe that we were created. Wether we were created as monkeys, and evolved into humans I don't know. If we were created and seeded here by aliens I don't know. There are many theories to the past, but they are just that theories. Hopefully we will know one day for sure, but I am content with not knowing for now.

Please don't confuse this with my faith. I may not believe in the accuracy of the creation story in the Bible enough to accept it as an accurate description of history. It has been translated, rewritten, and edited by those in power for centurys. That doesn't change my relationship with God. Just becaues I have little faith in men, especially men of power, on Earth doesn't mean I don't have a deep faith in our creator.

Heather

IMHO
Idon't know how you can get it any better, you hang in there.

Skunk · « **Reply #18 on:** May 20, 2009, 04:44:29 AM »

Quote from: gypsyman on May 20, 2009, 03:11:16 AM

I go by the old common sense opinion of, if we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?

Quote from: slim rem 7 on May 20, 2009, 03:20:39 AM

now thats irrefutable...best argument ive ever heard against it..an so simple.

If dogs evolved from wolves, why are there still wolves?

Ruskin · « **Reply #19 on:** May 20, 2009, 05:03:33 AM »

I know people have issues with the copying of the testaments from generation to generation.

A point that helps me is to believe is that when Christ on this earth and had discussions of scripture, he used recopied texts that had been passed down through generations. If he could use them, then I should be able to rely upon the Bible as it has been passed down through the generations. One has to belive that God can preserve his word even though it has been recopied from generation to generation.

slim rem 7 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 20, 2009, 06:26:22 AM »

the dna of a wolf an dog are basicly still alike as to species..
the dna is the key they count on.. never is there record of one species changing to another.. just an assumption that it must be the case by evolutionist..it totally frustrates them as they know if what tier sayin is true ..there should be inumerable examples of these changes discovered already ..there not.. evolutionist will tell you that..
then go into thier appologist explanations.. but it sounds kinda hollow to me..
still it doesnt matter how god does things..i don t have to understand it ,,to believe in an benevolent loving god..that ive had proved to me more times than i can count..i only hope my faith is not found lacking,when called on to be at my best,under exstreme stress ,someday.. only with his help could i endure ,of that i am sure.... slim

rex6666 · « **Reply #21 on:** May 20, 2009, 07:04:17 AM »

Dogs did not evolve from wolves, some wolves were brought into the cave
and raised as lap dogs, they were breed to cave mice and that is how
we got poodles. Some where breed to porcupines and we got Airedales and
wirehaired terriors.

Skunk · « **Reply #22 on:** May 20, 2009, 07:09:26 AM »

Quote from: slim rem 7 on May 20, 2009, 06:26:22 AM

the DNA of a wolf and dog are basically still alike as to species...the DNA is the key they count on...

Slim,

Dogs share approximately 99% of their DNA Genome with Wolves.

Humans share approximately 99% of their DNA Genome with chimpanzees.

Don't get me wrong Slim, I'm with you on God's creation. Like I said in my previous post, "there's no chimpanzee in my pedigree, and you can't make a monkey out of me. I was just pointing out that if a nick in the genes of a few members of one species sends that particular strain on a different path, it wouldn't necessarily mean that the original species would cease to exist.

Heather · « **Reply #23 on:** May 20, 2009, 07:15:12 AM »

Quote from: Ruskin on May 20, 2009, 05:03:33 AM

I know people have issues with the copying of the testaments from generation to generation.

A point that helps me is to believe is that when Christ on this earth and had discussions of scripture, he used recopied texts that had been passed down through generations. If he could use them, then I should be able to rely upon the Bible as it has been passed down through the generations. One has to belive that God can preserve his word even though it has been recopied from generation to generation.

THe difference there is that Jesus was teaching scripture that had been passed down by families and churches with little adgenda to change things. The Bible as we know it today was put together by a ruler. Constatine. He picked only the scriptures that suited his adgenda, to aide in controlling society. He even took Paegan rituals and conviently changed them just enough to suit Christians and attract Paegans at the same time. There are many lost scriptures that were not allowed to be published. I believe in the teaching of the Bible and the morals behind them, but the accuracy of stories I can't seem to rely on. I believe in an all powerful God that could do anything, but I also belive in opposite side of the spectrum and when Constatine put the Bible together I am not so sure that his influence wasn't from the lower end. I don't have all the answers and have never clamed to, but for you to tell me that one HAS TO BELIEVE THAT GOD can preserve his word is almost as bad as saying one has to believe your way or no way. Like I stated earlier I trust in God, but it is men of power that I am skeptical of.

Heather

rex6666 · « **Reply #24 on:** May 20, 2009, 07:24:25 AM »

I think will have to hang with Heather on this.
I believe in GOD and know what he has done for me.
I am not sure i Know exactly what his word is, some MEN clam to know,
but have turned out to be bad apples

slim rem 7 · « **Reply #25 on:** May 20, 2009, 08:30:02 AM »

heather you have studied it.. my take on it was a bit different.. i understood that constatine became converted.. as happen so much with christians.. he thought it good that all rome be christians..
so attempted to make it the state religion.. this is a tragedy that happen even today in converts..i always tellum to give thier selves time to grow in thier christianty..like as not they ll be listening to an
minister of experience but strayed very far from what i think christ message is.. they become condemers of everything..
in any case ,i understood constiontine ordered the bible put togather from various letters written by followers of the one god religous ideals of the jewish faith .this of course with new testament writing as then existed also..
heather i too questioned it for years .. an still am not a total fundamentalist .. but yrs .have lead me to believe the bible to be as much as our father thinks we need at this time.. no claim to my being absolutely right.. truthfully this is as close as you will ever get me to debating religion..
for me i know a real an benevolent god.. i know my christ an redemer .. i need not hold to anything else .. my house is built on these rocks.. no speculation in these simple truths..may god bless us all in this country..for we are sure in need at this time.. slim

nomosendero · « **Reply #26 on:** May 20, 2009, 08:42:56 AM »

Quote from: Heather on May 20, 2009, 07:15:12 AM

Quote from: Ruskin on May 20, 2009, 05:03:33 AM
I know people have issues with the copying of the testaments from generation to generation.

A point that helps me is to believe is that when Christ on this earth and had discussions of scripture, he used recopied texts that had been passed down through generations. If he could use them, then I should be able to rely upon the Bible as it has been passed down through the generations. One has to belive that God can preserve his word even though it has been recopied from generation to generation.

THe difference there is that Jesus was teaching scripture that had been passed down by families and churches with little adgenda to change things. The Bible as we know it today was put together by a ruler. Constatine. He picked only the scriptures that suited his adgenda, to aide in controlling society. He even took Paegan rituals and conviently changed them just enough to suit Christians and attract Paegans at the same time. There are many lost scriptures that were not allowed to be published. I believe in the teaching of the Bible and the morals behind them, but the accuracy of stories I can't seem to rely on. I believe in an all powerful God that could do anything, but I also belive in opposite side of the spectrum and when Constatine put the Bible together I am not so sure that his influence wasn't from the lower end. I don't have all the answers and have never clamed to, but for you to tell me that one HAS TO BELIEVE THAT GOD can preserve his word is almost as bad as saying one has to believe your way or no way. Like I stated earlier I trust in God, but it is men of power that I am skeptical of.

Heather

"Jesus was teaching scripture that had been passed down by families and churches" Churches were established after Christ actually. As far as passed down by families but yet stated they were scripture, then where did the
"scripture" come from ? If it was scripture, it was accurate, no matter how it was passed down. And we know that Christ was sinless, so that leaves out passing down less than 100% accurate information doesn't it?

About Constantine; "he even took Paegan rituals and conviently changed them just enough to suit Christians and
attract Paegans at the same time". Can you name me those verses please. It doesn't have to be all, just some, or one.

"There are many lost scriptures' Can you direct us to those please? I heard about them thoughout College years, when I had to listen to pinheads long enough to ge a degree. Not saying you are a pinhead, in fact I feel the opposite in that regard, but this stuff was started way back by pinheads & for them it is a convienient though because if part of the scriptures are missing, then we can't observe it fully, so why not observe the part that fits our lifestyle since we can't do it all anyway. Could there have been scrolls laying around that some unqualified folks could have thought were part of the Bible? Perhaps. But since I know that "All scripture was given by the inspiration of God" then I would have to ask the following: What God Inspired or in other words scripture that belonged in the Bible wound up not being there?

You mght want to keep in mind when the printing press came along as well, this is when the common folk really started gaining access to the Bible. Besides the early Roman Catholics also did not like that idea of Christians reading the Bible in general of course later came the Dark Ages.

Ruskins thoughts were valid. God wants us to obey his word, something you can't do if no one in the World has access to it.

billy_56081 · « **Reply #27 on:** May 20, 2009, 12:57:38 PM »

Quote from: slim rem 7 on May 20, 2009, 06:26:22 AM

the dna of a wolf an dog are basicly still alike as to species..
the dna is the key they count on.. never is there record of one species changing to another.. just an assumption that it must be the case by evolutionist..it totally frustrates them as they know if what tier sayin is true ..there should be inumerable examples of these changes discovered already ..there not.. evolutionist will tell you that..
then go into thier appologist explanations.. but it sounds kinda hollow to me..
still it doesnt matter how god does things..i don t have to understand it ,,to believe in an benevolent loving god..that ive had proved to me more times than i can count..i only hope my faith is not found lacking,when called on to be at my best,under exstreme stress ,someday.. only with his help could i endure ,of that i am sure.... slim

I agree with you Slim, dogs, wolves and coyotes are the same species. They share more than 99.9 % of genes. They ca all interbreed with no problems what so ever. Now humans and apes or monkeys cannot interbreed. They are a completly different specie. Much of the variety on dogs is from selective breeding and inbreeding. When the sceintists go around and spew this 96,97,97,99 percent sharing of genes, they are telling you the truth, but not the whole truth, who here can tell you what percentage of our genes is the same as, hmmm lets just use a horse as an example! I think you will find how amazingly similar our genetic makup is.

Swampman · « **Reply #28 on:** May 20, 2009, 01:14:16 PM »

Several scientist who examined it said it didn't prove much of anything.

mechanic · « **Reply #29 on:** May 20, 2009, 02:33:24 PM »

We are closer to pigs than any other specie I believe........at least some are.