Author Topic: 243 vs 25/06 (Read 3953 times)

Dan Martin · « **on:** May 25, 2009, 03:53:03 PM »

Considering a new Encore barrel for deer hunting (southeastern deer)...can't decide between a 243 and 25/06. I had the latter years ago in an Encore and didn't have great luck with accuracy.

I have the 223 and below well-covered...so don't really need the dual deer/varmint aspect.

Opinions?

mannyrock · « **Reply #1 on:** May 25, 2009, 05:20:27 PM »

Well, then you've answered your own question. Get the .25-06. It is a far superior deer round.

Regards,

Mannyrock

nomosendero · « **Reply #2 on:** May 25, 2009, 05:21:07 PM »

Quote from: Dan Martin on May 25, 2009, 03:53:03 PM

Considering a new Encore barrel for deer hunting (southeastern deer)...can't decide between a 243 and 25/06. I had the latter years ago in an Encore and didn't have great luck with accuracy.

I have the 223 and below well-covered...so don't really need the dual deer/varmint aspect.

Opinions?

To me the last sentence would be the deciding factor, since you have the varmit side covered, I would go 25-06 hands down. Of course the 243 can work well on Deer, but the 25-06 will give a good 150 yds.additional range plus a better bet when it comes to quartering shots, etc., just a better Deer round.

nomosendero · « **Reply #3 on:** May 25, 2009, 05:22:42 PM »

Oops Mannyrock, you covered that one while I was typing I guess

helotaxi · « **Reply #4 on:** May 25, 2009, 07:09:20 PM »

I'd personally go with neither if I wanted a deer only cartridge. For nice small southern deer and likely really short range shots I'd look for something larger and slower than either of those. A larger, slower bullet damages less meat and is less likely to be deflected by brush.

I'm looking for a rifle for the same purpose myself and I'm leaning heavily toward the 7mm-08 in a Handi or a lightweight bolt gun. If I could get one of the 6.5 or 7mm wildcats based on the .223 or .222 mag in a rifle that would be perfect for AL/FL whitetails but something like that would set me back more than I want to spend right now.

Just my take.

BBF · « **Reply #5 on:** May 26, 2009, 10:40:49 AM »

a 7mm-08 isn't a slow cartridge IMO. Can you get a barrel for the 30-30 Win or 35 Rem?

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #6 on:** May 26, 2009, 10:49:03 AM »

for small SOUTHERN deer anything will work unless you sit over bean fields , gas lines or other long shots . Or in thick stuff next to posted land and need to drop um in their tracks .
If your heart is set on one of the 2 listed then go with a 25-06 nothing beats cubic inches . the 308 would be a wise choice also as it has more power up close and still can get it done at either 25-06 or 243 range .

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #7 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:04:29 AM »

+1 on the .308. I really like my 308 for deer in NC and the 180 grain round nose does not ruin any meat. I find thses to be DRT bullets on deer in the chest.
And when sitting over the bean fields I use the 165 grain soft points. For out to 250 yards.
I have had bad success with the smaller faster bullets in 270 and 243 with friends and relitives, they just turn the meat into Jelly.
If you do not like 308 Then 30-06 will work just as well.
Remington also has the reduced recoil loads with 125 grain bullets that recoil like 243 if you are concerned with the back end of the rifle more than the front end. The neat thing about the 125 grain bullets is they are designed for big game and not varmints so they will stay together and leave the deer.
Heck if you want smaller bullet hole the 260 rem or 6.5X55 swede would also fit your bill. I have killed deer with 6.5 swede and it is a great deer round especally in the heavy for caliber rounds (140 and 156 soft points) I imagine the 260 will be the same.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #8 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:12:54 AM »

Hey i found a supply of 125 serria spire point flat base i was going to load to around 2800fps for Va. deer . You don't think that will work ?

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #9 on:** May 26, 2009, 11:59:46 AM »

No they will Bounce off.

Of course they will work. I just like the 180's. I tend to go bigger and heavier. I think the rounds that are known a brush rounds are that way because of the big heavy round nose bullets. I have shot deer the same size a day a part, same place in the woods and same spot on the deer one with 180 round nose and one with a 180 pointed soft point. The round nose deer lost both lungs and had an exit hole the size of a dime the pointed soft point went in as 30 cal and out as 30 cal and the deer ran a little ways before laying down to die.
Actually depending on how far away you are from the deer I think the 125's will penitrate the near side ribs and explode shredding the heart and lungs. I know the 270 with a 130 grain bullet @3000 FPS really jelly a deer. I have had to discard whole hams and shoulders of deer shot by 270 with the small bullets. Same with the really small under 85grain bullets for the 243. But that too is why they make so many calibers bullet weights and designs as everybody has a different idea of what ideal is.
Oh the other reason I like the 180's in NC is we have HUGE black bears on the farm.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #10 on:** May 26, 2009, 12:11:15 PM »

The first deer i ever shot with a rifle , 3006 was with a 180 gr. round nose remington corelok if 36 years of memory is correct . No doubt they will work in spades . Due to a shoulder problem i was forced to cut back on hard kicking guns and ended up with a 7X30 waters which is near perfect for our deer out to 200 yards . 120 gr. flat point at 2700 fps. goes in 7mm comes out size of my thumb or latger . So far nothing has run more that a very few yards , guess i shot 20 plus deer with it , one a very large 12 pointer . Anyway shoulder is better so i have tried larget guns . The 308 seems well suited and i was trying to get close to the old 7X30 load . see i got the 200 bullets for 30 some bucks . In this day and time around here that was a deal . it was old stock a few more boxes are on the shelf if they work.
thanks , BTW what part of NC do you hunt ?

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #11 on:** May 26, 2009, 12:23:30 PM »

My Step mother's family has a farm just out side of Oriental in Pamlico county and my Parents moved to Minnisott Beach 8 years ago and built a house right on the river.
Do you get down there?
Dad is always looking for someone to go duck hunting with. He has a 2 year old Lab that is great.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #12 on:** May 26, 2009, 12:27:22 PM »

I try to get to the Outer Banks every year .

flintlock · « **Reply #13 on:** May 26, 2009, 01:18:01 PM »

Do you reload??? If so, you might consider the 25/06, if not, stick with the .243 as there are just so many more factory loads on the shelves...

As far as long range shooting, the .243 will kill farther than most hunters need to be shooting at deer in the field...My bean field load is the Federal Premium Sierra GameKing 85gr HPBT, as good a whitetail bullet as ever made for long range shooting in any caliber...
For swamp and woods hunting the 100gr CoreLokt, Hornady InterLock, Grand Slam, Nosler Partion and even the Federal HotCore have all been good killers for me...

DRT??? I find it very easy to drop a deer in it's tracks, that's more of an accuracy issue and with a .243 you see them react after the shot because you never lose them in your scope...

Another advantage, you can shoot this caliber either right or left handed and not worry about recoil on the off shoulder...Of course, I'm sure none of ya'll have ever had a deer slip up on your off side...

Dan Martin · « **Reply #14 on:** May 26, 2009, 01:46:43 PM »

Thanks for all the opinions...

I don't reload anymore (just a time issue) so factory load availability is important. That pretty well kills the otherwise very interesting .260 Rem.

I've owned most of the cartridges discussed here (My name is Dan and I have a trading problem) but for southern deer, my limited experience is that speed kills.

Assuming appropriate bullet construction, small and fast seems to perform better than big and slow. I haven't wanted to believe this...but my experience seems to support it.

nomosendero · « **Reply #15 on:** May 26, 2009, 03:38:44 PM »

It doesn't hurt to have the velocity, I am not a Lung eater anyway.

helotaxi · « **Reply #16 on:** May 26, 2009, 04:59:31 PM »

Quote from: BBF on May 26, 2009, 10:40:49 AM

a 7mm-08 isn't a slow cartridge IMO.

Until you compare it to a .243 or 25-06. With similar weight bullets the velocities are similar but you're talking bullets at the very high end of the .243s range and same with the 25-06. These same bullet weights are varmint bullets in the 7mm-08. The -08 can go much heavier and at that point much slower from there. Sure a light, fast bullet will kill a deer, but how much meat is going to get ruined especially at close range?

Dee · « **Reply #17 on:** May 26, 2009, 05:18:24 PM »

Almost NONE if the shot is good. The 2506 is as good as it gets in the deer category, and par-excellent in hunting prairie goats, i.e. antelope. I have owned 8 of them in various makes and models, and have reloaded the cartridge for over 37 years. It is no more prone to ruin meat than a 7mm08, or any other cartridge. A bad shot, is a bad shot regardless of caliber, and the 7mm08, as good as it is, will not keep up with the 2506 when it comes to stretching out for a long shot at a deer, and 7mm08 kills no better than the 2506 in close.

Back to the original question which did not concern the 7mm08. 243 vs 2506!

The 2506 will do anything the 243 will do, and do it better, and at farther distances. The 243 is a fine cartridge, but it is not in the same class as the 2506. The 2506 is INHERENTLY accurate, and is an extreme range gun in the predator category, and a good long range gun in the deer category. I have killed a many of both with a 2506 in the last 37 years, and have owned 5 rifles that were sub-moa shooters, and no, they were not custom rifles. Glass bedded actions, free floated barrels, and a nice trigger, is usually all it takes to make a quality 2506 shoot with good ammo. The 87 grain spitzer's are good whitetail bullets, the 100 grains Nosler partitions are good Muley loads, and a 113 grain Nosler partition is good medicine for elk with good shot placement.

Savage .250 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 27, 2009, 03:13:55 AM »

Never owned a 25-06 but I`ve heard and read it`s a fine cal. Wouldn`t mind owning one.
I`can`t debate the merits of of it vs the .243 but as I have owned a Sav 110 in .243 since the mid 60`s and have shot many a deer with it I can say (for me) it`s done everything perfectly. For the type of terrain I hunt, it`s just right for the job.

Dee · « **Reply #19 on:** May 27, 2009, 03:31:52 AM »

Savage that is precisely the point. I too have owned a 243, and it is indeed a fine caliber. It is all in what one expects REALISTICALLY from a caliber. If a caliber suits one's tastes and needs then by all means it is the caliber for THAT PERSON to own.
Having shot both extensively over the years, I am absolutely certain of each one's weaknesses and strengths. To say that either is more of a meat waster than say, the 7mm08, is coming from either a very biased stance, or from an inexperience stance of the non-7mm08 calibers.
A bad shot from a 36 caliber muzzle loader will ruin meat.

BBF · « **Reply #20 on:** May 27, 2009, 09:36:50 AM »

Dunno, depending on whose Loading Manual you read, the 140 gr bullets from a 7mm-08 are close to 3000 fps and that isn't slow for a hunting bullet IMO.

Graybeard · « **Reply #21 on:** May 27, 2009, 09:40:04 AM »

With 100 grain bullets there's not a dime's worth of difference between them. The difference comes in with the fact the .25-06 can bullets to 120 grains making it darn near the full equal of a .270 Win. shooting 130s.

That is a real world difference in favor of the .25-06.

LONGTOM · « **Reply #22 on:** May 27, 2009, 04:41:10 PM »

Thanks Dee.
Have always thought the same thing about meat damage.
A well placed shot in the vitals at the right angle will destroy very little meat no matter what cartridge you use.
It all depends on how well you can place the shot.
Put it in the wrong place and you will lose meat.
As long as it puts the deer down quickly I will trade a little meat.
I have never had to lose more than a large hand full no matter where they were hit and with what caliber.
Just takes a little more cleaning some times.
Have never gut shot a deer so I don't know how much you might lose there except that you could lose the whole deer if it gets away.

LONGTOM

cjclemens · « **Reply #23 on:** May 27, 2009, 06:53:06 PM »

.243 has and will always be my favorite, but I dont think you can go wrong either way you choose. I live in the people's republic of Illinois, so I dont get to deer hunt with a rifle any too ofter, but the few times I have, I found that 85 grain partitions will drop deer like a bolt of lightning. Once again, you cant go wrong either way. Both are very capable deer cartridges, but i'll vote .243 every time this topic comes up.

Swampman · « **Reply #24 on:** May 27, 2009, 11:55:01 PM »

In the Encore I'd probly choose the .25-06. In a bolt gun I'd probably choose the .243.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #25 on:** May 28, 2009, 02:12:43 AM »

The max load for the 100 gr. bullet in 243 is 3000fps ,and the 25-06 3400fps. that was one reason i chose the 25-06 . these were taken from Hornady hand book of reloading 4th edition , I made the choice over 24 years ago and used an older book but that was the reasoning along with the flater traj. and with 117 and 120 bullets . I intended to hunt both deer and ground hogs with it . It has been a great choice . I settled on 100 balastic tip bullets and use them for both . I can't recall the number of either i have taken but it has been quite a few of each . I have never had a deer run off with this load most don't move much less run after being hit with it .
I agree any bad shot will waste meat , but no shot means no meat to waste .
I have had a chance since buying the 25-06 to hunt with several other cal. and the 25 with the longer bbl. that you need to take advantage of the speed it can reach and needs to reach to preform well makes it unsuitable for heavy brush . And the small light bullet in brush make a larger bore and heavy bullet more useable .
So if you hunt fields and open woods the 25-06 is good . But if you hunt in close spaces you might look for something .30
BTW i like my 25-06 alot

saltydog · « **Reply #26 on:** May 31, 2009, 03:34:30 PM »

I own both - flip a coin - the are both good with few drawbacks as hunting rounds. Sorry but you could argure the merits of both all year and still not have a clear winner. 243 has less recoil while the 25 caliber bullet is heavier and so forth.

the lone gunman · « **Reply #27 on:** June 07, 2009, 12:05:36 AM »

I would consider barrel length also. If you dont mind 24-26 inch, 25-06 would be good. Shorter and I would go 243.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #28 on:** June 07, 2009, 04:34:09 AM »

In reading the replies I'm amazed that some people are still buying into the old BS of "heavy, slow moving brush busters". I thought that bit of foolishness had been dispelled decades ago but apparently not. All bullets are deflected by brush and the so-called "brush busters" like the .30/30/170, .35 Remington/200, .44mag, and such are actually among the worst for deflection.

Swampman · « **Reply #29 on:** June 07, 2009, 08:42:06 AM »

Heavier bullets retain velocity & energy better. They also buck the wind better.