« previous next »
Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Handi rifle novice question  (Read 895 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline a4beltfed2000

  • Trade Count: (16)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 593
Handi rifle novice question
« on: June 17, 2009, 05:06:26 AM »
OK I am embarassed to admit it. I am trying to get a handle on how the heck that some are turning the 20 ga and 12 ga shotguns into the big bores rifle. First,  are these being built on SB1 or 2 frames? second, how is it possible to generate the kind of pressures that are being discuessed in the threads and still keep the gun from a big KABOOM? What the heck kind of barrels are being used? Damage to receivers?

How is it that some of these guns are not hitting NFA status? Currently the 50 BMG is the largest round that is not a NFA DD. even the boydes AT rifle which is .55 caliber is considered a DD, along with the new 14mm rifle being offered. So how is it that a rifle which is shooting something in the .70 caliber range in considered to be a DD. (not looking to strip up stuff but......)
Logged
H&R/NEF 10, 12,16 20 28 ,410 .243 45 357 45lc. 1919a4, uzi, sten mK 2,3,5 M2HB, 1917a1, ak74(2) amd 65, RPK (2) 11 aks and 50 other guns....

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43302
  • Gender: Male
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2009, 05:21:31 AM »
The 12ga USH that Hubel458 uses for this 12g FH H&R project comes with an SB2 shotgun frame, same as all factory 10ga and 12ga USH frames, Tyler's project involves an SB2 rifle frame, pressures on both of these projects are within the frame limits, you'll have to read the 12ga FH thread in the Big Bore forum to see the pressures he's running, his loads have been pressure tested, Tyler expects to keep his pressure under 30kpsi which is the limit of the brass he'll be using as he has stated.

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,50.0.html
Logged
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline LaOtto222

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3828
  • Gender: Male
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2009, 05:28:54 AM »
I think I can answer some of your questions. You can get rifled 20 gauge and 12 gauge barrels. Have an SB 2 frame and send it it to be fitted with one or buy a 20 or 12 and fit it to your SB2 frame. They are using brass cases to load up the primer/powder/bullet. The bullet is sized to fit the bore of your particular barrel, be it 20 gauge or 12 gauge. Keep the pressures low when loading up your cases. There should not be a problem with the frame/barrel, unless pressures start exceeding 20 - 25 psi. Beyond that, I think you are taking a chance.

As far as legal aspects, I do not have a clue. I do  know that the 600 Nitro is a very old cartridge so, it may fall into a different category - I said MAY.

Not "quick" enough, i posted anyway ;D
Logged
Great men have vision and resolve to make dreams come true.

Offline a4beltfed2000

  • Trade Count: (16)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 593
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2009, 05:31:39 AM »
Tim,

   I did read through the 12GA FH thread and guess that somewhere I must have lost track, there is alot of data there to follow through. I will reread it, be it seemed to me that some of them was  pushing the limits or at least it seem to me (go ahead and call me a pussy) but I have seen some pretty bad KABOOMS on FA weapons.

Logged
H&R/NEF 10, 12,16 20 28 ,410 .243 45 357 45lc. 1919a4, uzi, sten mK 2,3,5 M2HB, 1917a1, ak74(2) amd 65, RPK (2) 11 aks and 50 other guns....

Offline a4beltfed2000

  • Trade Count: (16)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 593
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2009, 05:35:06 AM »
so what kind of brass casings are they using? Casting the projectiles? What basis is the load Data from?

GUYS dont get me wrong, I LOVE the idea, I just love having two hands even more ;D
Logged
H&R/NEF 10, 12,16 20 28 ,410 .243 45 357 45lc. 1919a4, uzi, sten mK 2,3,5 M2HB, 1917a1, ak74(2) amd 65, RPK (2) 11 aks and 50 other guns....

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43302
  • Gender: Male
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2009, 05:39:56 AM »
Hubel uses more than one firearm in his 12ga FH project, the H&R is just one of them.

Tyler's intended cases are machined, data thus far has been predicted using software, careful load work will determine what the actual limit is, the H&R uses ejectors, they will start sticking and not ejecting when pressure starts exceeding the brass strength which is long before the frame strength is tested. The 20ga barrel has a thicker wall than the 12ga, so the 30kpsi limit should be just fine, 600NE operates at about 36kpsi for comparison.

Tim
Logged
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43302
  • Gender: Male
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2009, 05:53:29 AM »
Here's a condensed version of Hubel's project he posted on ShootingWorld.

Tim

http://www.shootingworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3645
Logged
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline PHATINJUN

  • "Seeker of the Red Mist"
  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (144)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4076
  • Gender: Male
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2009, 12:32:48 PM »
I believe the machined cases Tyler is gonna use are from RMC Rocky Mountain Cartridge Co he has a web site you can check out. I have some of the 20ga RMC cases I bought 10 when I was messin with them and I think they ran me about $60 all told. You will not wear these out though and I use rifle primers instead of 209 in them.Kurt
Logged
Deceased 2/16/24
https://www.dignitymemorial.com/obituaries/machesney-park-il/kurt-heckman-11671764

Sportster17M2,20"Nickle410Tamer,26"410,
WTUTI12ga,WTU25-06,M158 22RemJet, 24"Ultra.204Ruger24"UltraFluted.204Ruger
M157Mannliker.22Hornet,24".223UltraFluted,   24".223Ultra,7X64BrenekkeUltra,22-250AIUltraFluted            7.62x39,22"303Britstub.32H&Rmag, .32303BritstubHuntsman,24" SS.50calHuntsman 58calHuntsman 12gaHuntsman
NEF RevolversSSModel73.32H&Rmag                     Blued Model73.32H&R mag The herd is shrinking!!
                                 "SOLI DEO GLORIA"

Offline a4beltfed2000

  • Trade Count: (16)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 593
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2009, 06:06:50 AM »
THanks guys for the info, I will look into the cases. sounds like a fun project to me!
Logged
H&R/NEF 10, 12,16 20 28 ,410 .243 45 357 45lc. 1919a4, uzi, sten mK 2,3,5 M2HB, 1917a1, ak74(2) amd 65, RPK (2) 11 aks and 50 other guns....

Offline vincewarde

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 127
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2009, 09:48:43 PM »
As for the legal issues, I have wondered about that too.  The reason I have seen in print most often is that because rifled shotguns were originally designed as shotguns they are still considered as such by BATFE.  I'm sure that if it were not so, lots of folks would be in jail  ;)
Logged
"Preach the Gospel at all times, when absolutely necessary - use words" St Francis
<><

Offline chipmunk

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 149
Re: Handi rifle novice question
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2009, 07:06:24 AM »
I personally don't see why there would be a legal issue.  A 30-06 is just as deadly as these shotgun projects.  To me the difference is in the danger to the shooters shoulder!   


Of course the government never sees things in the same way as me anyways!
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
« previous next »