mold size?

[44joe]

Hello to all, I am looking to get into bullet casting.  I have decided on a bottom pour pot and now what kind of molds.  How are the lee aluminum ones, do they last or are the steel/iron ones better.  When I look at the size, they list .430.  Do you have to order the mold larger?  I slugged my barrel and I need .432.  Or do they all come out bigger and you have to size them down?  Sorry for the stupid questions, and yes it will be for a 44.  I was thinking about getting three, 2 cavity molds for starters, #1)200 gr RNFP, #2)246 gr RN, #3) the 250 gr Keith.  I figure the three will cover plinking, small game and large game.
Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Joe

[bilmac]

I have just about quit buying iron molds since Lee has been making them. Occasionally I will buy an iron mold if I can't find a Lee style that I want.

If you are loading a modern standard 44, just buy molds listed as 44s. They will cast a bullet slightly large to be sized down a bit. Actually they are close enough that they can be shot as cast without sizing if you want.

[iiranger]

#1).  The actual "cast size" of a bullet will be much affected by the exact alloy you use to cast it. I don't recall the exacts, but Lyman books go over and over them. This is the reason for Lyman #2 alloy. That would drop the size bullet the mold was listed for supposedly most of the time. Any other alloy and you are "on your own." Lead is quite pliable. It will fill the grooves. I would not get too excited. With the price of LEE molds, try it.

#2). Your list, #2 is awful close to #3. I would delete #2, but that is me. Your bucks, your call.

#3).  .432? Seems a little "loose" to me. I think I would try that again, very carefully.  At the same time measuring that small takes skill too. Like I said, lead will expand and any but the hardest lead and lightest loads the jump from the cylinder into the forcing cone should have the bullet a bit over sized anyway. LUCK.

[45-70.gov]

i  suggest  you  send a slug to  veral at  LBT  and 
tell him you want  a 280g  WFN  for the gun the slug was pushed through
i  wouldn't  go below 260g  or  over  300g

use  this slug  for everything
i  liked it  i just got a 180g  WFN  for  ALL  my 38s  and 357s [4 cavity /3 plain base  and one gas check ]

i  have  one  with gas checks  one with out
i rarely   use  the gas checks

LBT  moulds  are  so much  better than  a lee mould
i  even  feel  ashamed  to talk about  lbt  and  lee at the same time

[44joe]

I used a hollow egg sinker to slug the barrel.  I read that it won't spring back after you slug the barrel.  Anyway, it measured .432, I used two different dial calipers which I know aren't as good as a mic, but it's what I have. 

I used the 280 gr WFN from Beartooth at .432 and they worked great.  I only shot one deer with the bullet, 22.5 gr H110 behind it.  I hit about a 180 lb buck with it, just behind the shoulder.  The deer fell so fast I thought I missed it!  I walked about 40 yards to where I thought it was and it was DRT.  The only thing was that I wasn't sure about it's long range stability, although I didn't test it.  BTW, long range would be 100 + yards.

On a separte note, I was wondering how everyone cleans wheel weights.  I had about a five inch shallow metal can.  I put in several very dirty WW'ts.  I put it at a slight angle and heated the weights up with a propane torch.  As the wheel weights melted they got kind of wrinkled and then what appeared to be "clean alloy" melted out and ran into a puddle at the bottom.  Left in the can was a wheel weight shaped pile of dirt.  I was thinking of putting a small hole in the can and let the alloy drip into a old muffin pan to make ingots.  I poured off the apparently now clean alloy and it looked great.  I thought it might be a way to pre clean the wheel weights because they are really dirty.  Either way it was fun!

Joe

[45-70.gov]

my 280 wfn did  4 inch groups at  100yards  in  a handi rifle

external terret adjustments  on scope  zeroed  at 50 yds    turn  to 8  for  100yds
dont  know drop  in  inces  about 6 i think

the weight will help  on distance

they  do  great in  my reduced 44 speacial  and very quiet  in a rifle
deadly and silent  on small  game
i  dont  need to tell  you about big game

just send that sinker or another slug  to  veral smith  he will give you waht  you want
and  you will  be happy......i  read his  book  a long time ago..you should too

[44joe]

I'm definitly going to get his book and any others I can find, I can see this becoming addictive!

I never had a chance to try the 280 WFN out of my 1894, but it didn't like either the 300 LFN or the 320 WFN, too much weight for the twist was my best guess.  But with the added velocity the rifle had, the 240 xtp over expanded and didn't perform and the 300 xtp was too long with the bottom crimp, and I didn't like all the space it took up in the case when it was seated in the top grove.  I've been using the speer 270 grn GD SP since, but I think I'll give the 280 cast a try. The Super Red Hawk didn't mind either bullet, cast or jacketed, heavy or light, it just takes whatever you put in and doesn't complain!

There is just something about cast bullets I like.

Thanks
Joe

[45-70.gov]

i  stainless ruger  often  has  a tight spot
right where  the barrel screws into the frame

LBT  sells a lapping compound  to shoot  that out

the  WFN  is shorter than the  LFN
so the WFN should stabilize better  and  kill better......just a little more  wind drag

heavyer  is slower  so  you get less leading  and quieter......better powder burn
along with better penatration

[jsh]

"On a separte note, I was wondering how everyone cleans wheel weights.  I had about a five inch shallow metal can.  I put in several very dirty WW'ts.  I put it at a slight angle and heated the weights up with a propane torch.  As the wheel weights melted they got kind of wrinkled and then what appeared to be "clean alloy" melted out and ran into a puddle at the bottom.  Left in the can was a wheel weight shaped pile of dirt.  I was thinking of putting a small hole in the can and let the alloy drip into a old muffin pan to make ingots.  I poured off the apparently now clean alloy and it looked great.  I thought it might be a way to pre clean the wheel weights because they are really dirty."

I use one of the cheap "china" made cast iron pots to smelt in. Larger batches of several hundred pounds, I have a friend that has a smelting pot that works somthing like a lee 20 pound pot. It holds a 5 gallon bucket at a time.
I started off smelting in fairly small lots, coffe can at a time. I had some problems of varying things. I beleive it was from ths small batches of alloy, because each one was quite different. So I would suggest you smelt in as large of a batch as you can. Don't worry about dirt and grime. It will all float to the top and can be skimmed off along with the clips. Having a pretty consistant alloy will help a lot as to how well of a fill out you get. Of course that is along with a hot mould and clean, fluxed alloy.

One word of advice that was given to me several years ago regarding lee moulds. "If you can hear the blocks close, you are closing them to fast or hard". I also have a piece of oak block that is smooth and flat. I set the blocks on the oak, then shut it. if you just leave it hanging and close, the steel pins will align the halves. All fine and dandy, but it will wear and get sloppy sooner or later where the alum hits the steel pins. The Lee 6C are way over and above there 1 and 2C moulds. Only problem I find with them a lot of times is a I get a large spread of weight and sizes as dropped from the 6C. I relegate them to more casual plinking rather than any serious work.
jeff

[blhof]

I 2nd the LBT slugging and lapping and his molds are better than any others hands down.  I got the kit for my 357max and have since slugged and lapped every gun I've got.  The improvement is remarkable, at least for all my guns; rifles and pistols.  Veral's book is also a must for casting.

[Lloyd Smale]

I have lots of brass steal and alum molds and like steal ones hands down. A good steel mold will last a lifetime. The same cant be said for aluminum ones especially the lees. Lee offers a good bang for the buck in there 6 cavity line but i wouldnt waste 10 cents on another 2 cavity lee.

[Hank08]

Lloyd is right.  Lee's are crap!  It's not just that they are aluminum.  Veral's are aluminum and his moulds are good but there's nothing like iron or steel.  I have about 150 moulds and a few are Lee but compared to the others the Lee are crap.  Some of my iron ones are 70 -80 yrs. old and as good as they ever were. Veral's, RCBS, Lyman, Cramer, Saeco, Hensley & Gibbs, Moden Bond, NEI and a few more are good, they cost more but are cheaper in the long run.
H08

[bilmac]

JSH   I think that the grey ash you see when you melt down your wheelweights has tin and antimony in it which you want to keep in your alloy. It hardens the lead.

When I melt down wheelweights, I melt them in a large pot until everything is good and hot. Then I flux the crap out of them. I drop  a pea sized piece of wax or something similar ln the pot and stir a lot. I do this several times. You can tell you are doing good when the grey stuff kind of goes away and you have a black ashy looking stuff instead. When all the dross is black and ashy, I skim it and the steel clips off the top and then you have a nice clean pot of metal with the tin and antimony still in it.